Post: #1

Shenzhen datasheet.

I arrived to Sz in late April. First was trying to get my Chinese visa in Phils, but it was a major hassle. Thus decided to make in Hong Kong via agent. Pretty straight forward process, apply in the morning and pick up the visa the same day afternoon. Price was around 120 USD for 3 months double entry visa (I’m not US citizen btw).
My background.
I arrived in China after 6 months of extensive travelling in SE Asia I decided to settle down for longer.
Why Shenzhen?
China is the land of opportunities, supposedly it was the nicest city in China (Chinese Hollywood as referred by this forum).
Never been to China before. 7 years ago I took a year long intensive course of Mandarin when I was studying in Barcelona. But I could mostly remember how to greet people, order a beer and wine. That’s it. So zero language skill to start with. I had some friends prior to arrive, so had a place to crash and some language assist, making a culture shock less painful.

First thing was to get a suit. Long story short, if you want a tailor made woolen suit (reasonably priced), go to Bangkok or Hongkong, not Shenzhen. I lost time, money and the final product was awful. So instead I bought a pretty decent trousers and couple of shirts for the interviews. The problem was with the shoes. Since I was previously travelling, I had 2 pairs of shoes, both rather casual. Spent a long time browsing the shoes in Sz, and found nothing that would fit my size (46 european, which I believe is 11-12 US). The biggest ones were 44. So once again, try to get them before you come to China if you plan to work here.
As to search for a job, there are various websites, like job51.com, but in reality as a foreigner without any skills in mandarin (btw, Shenzhen is in Canton, but since this is the city of immigrants people mostly speak mandarin, not cantonese) I would resort to 3 others. Echinacities.com, Shenzhenstuff.com and Shenzhenparty.com.
They are dedicated to foreigners, and although most jobs are for teaching English, there is a handful of companies looking for sales people, business developers etc. And this is what I was aiming at.
I kept sending CVs through the official websites, as well as to hiring managers/general managers via Linkedin.
After few weeks the output was… Zero responses, so it was time to take more traditional approach. Gather the address, phone numbers and pay companies visits. With a Chinese friend I figured out the addresses, wherever possible I would give the company a call say that I’m coming (till the very end they would be convinced that I’m a client willing to spend some money on their products), and just make a walk-in interviews.
I got 2 offers in the end of the month, and took one of them, (an IT stuff sales).
Now, many ask how the foreigners are treated in China.
To my surprise, I was (and still am) treated like a privileged. People would walk me to the place (If I’m persistent and lucky enough to find someone in the crowd speaking English), offer help and such. Never had any hassle with police. And to the clubs, even the posh ones, I could enter with my shorts (as long as I had full shoes, could even be sport ones). Dresscode haha.
At work I would be invited to join the team to go out dining, drinking and such. Of course, I never even saw the bill in those situations. They make it easy for me, in spite of the fact that only my boss speaks English.

Accomodation:
Since I didn’t want to get myself into 1 year rental contract (and pay bi monthly rent as a deposit), decided to go for for a service apartment. All utilities plus cleaning once a week included, pay monthly as you go with deposit less than 1 K. Easy way. And the price wasn’t too elevated (3,5 K for a studio, 4,5 K for 1 bedroom), 7 minutes walk from MTR, 25 minutes from my work.

Party, free time and girls:
Foreigners go to Coco park, but I got fed up with it after less than a month of partying there. My location (Louhu/Futian) didn’t have much else to offer, but I gave it a shot and went to Shekou (Seaworld) one night. It was a blast – in Viva club.
I loved the pool parties in Intercontinental hotel (OCT Luobao station). If the weather is nice (scarce in Shenzhen, 5 days of rain in the week on the average since I arrived in April), those parties are a blast.
Generally seek shenzhenstuff and shenzhenparty for the info. There are events going on weekly, and nightlife can be lots of fun!
Girls, as many say are the easy part. Won’t elaborate on the game here, but just have 2 things in mind – go well dressed and show status. China is all about money in my and many of colleagues opinion. In many cases I would tell a girl what I do, her eyes would literally flash with interest to “get to know me better”. Also they appreciate if a guy can cook, and once they are invited to the dinner in my place… rest is a history.
I hang out with girls I met in Interconti parties, and in clubs. Little to no day game.

Food:
After visiting some shops I realized how bad is the food in here (you don't see it when going to restaurants of course, but I cook by myself and the quality of basic ingredients is horrible) - I mean meat and veggies. Ever seen a carrot bigger than your forearm? An onion as big as girls head? This is about it - all grown on chemicals - bigger size, bigger profit.

Business& making money, costs:
As written before, China is a good place to make money. Once you tackle the obstacles, mainly cultural and language bareer, business opportunities are pretty much limited by your imagination and personal limits only from what I saw and heard. I don’t have much experience in this field though, so not to write any bullshit will leave this part concise.

Sz is not cheap as it used to be. In fact, it gets more expensive than any major city in western europe if you want to live decent life (imported cheese, wine, good quality food, some parties)...
So 2K USD/month is good for some decent life, but rather forget any extravaganza in this budget. And this is what an average English teacher can expect as a salary. If you are in different field – like engineer, sales, architecture… You should make more than that.

Feel free to ask questions.

Post: #2

After few weeks the output was… Zero responses, so it was time to take more traditional approach. Gather the address, phone numbers and pay companies visits. With a Chinese friend I figured out the addresses, wherever possible I would give the company a call say that I’m coming (till the very end they would be convinced that I’m a client willing to spend some money on their products), and just make a walk-in interviews.
I got 2 offers in the end of the month, and took one of them, (an IT stuff sales).

This is brilliant.

Haha I did this in Beijing in 2007. Strolled into Lehman Brothers and Jones Lang Lasalle and requested an interview on the spot.

Didn't work for me but I'm glad it worked for you. I'm going to have interns test this strategy out.

-

Post: #3

Hey YMG,

You are welcome, just remember that all of the companies posted (even if it was 1 month before) the job ad that I was interested in. I'm sure if I hit on random companies the success (conversion) rate would be much lower.

Post: #4

Oh okay thanks for that tip. Yeah makes sense.

That was a pretty ballsy move but it worked.

Post: #5

Artur, how would you rate your overall experience and enjoyment living in SZ? Is it a place you could see living, and enjoying your life there? Or was it more just a stop off for you and you were ready to move on?

Post: #6

Nice one for the data sheet. Good to see some on some other Chinese cities. I'll be in the area at the end of August so useful to me. Will drop one on Chongqing when I have been here a bit longer.

Post: #7

@ RioNomad.
I'm still here.
Overall rating? 5/10 (due to the weather, language bareer, food and girls with negative butts )
I prefer much more South America, for me there is a paradise (Nordeste do Brasil). As I wrote, China is mostly for money, and I feel I could never "fall in love" with the place. But definitely great experience to see what is possible.

Post: #8

Weather is a huge problem for me here in BKK as well. Growing up in California, I swear I get depressed being somewhere without blue skies and sunshine on a regular basis.

Post: #9

Data sheet is legit. Learn a little mandarin and street game becomes take your pick.

Post: #10

Great sheet AJ!
Did the company you got hired by helped you with the work visa? or you had to do it on your own? and if yes, how complicated/easy was it?

Post: #11

Great post. I have studied mandarin for a few years.

How hard is it to land a sales job there if your a laowai with a silver tongue ?

Post: #12

(06-18-2013 02:29 PM)Vacancier Permanent Wrote:  Great sheet AJ!
Did the company you got hired by helped you with the work visa? or you had to do it on your own? and if yes, how complicated/easy was it?

After few months they will apply for working visa for me. Until then cash in hand and ordinary - non working visa. Applying by yourself is lots of hassle, according to some friends who had to do it.
Btw I heard that from July there won't anymore 3 and 6 months business visas. One will have to go to HK to renew the visa every month.. Curious to see if that really happens.

(06-18-2013 08:58 PM)T5_Income Wrote:  Great post. I have studied mandarin for a few years.

How hard is it to land a sales job there if your a laowai with a silver tongue ?

If you know how to hustle and have an experience in the field you should be fine.

Post: #13

Artur, if they do change the visa, how expensive/much of a hassle would it be to do that each month? Is it just a quick hop across the border and back to SZ, or is there fees each time/new visa?

Post: #14

(06-19-2013 12:37 AM)artur jedi Wrote:  Btw I heard that from July there won't anymore 3 and 6 months business visas. One will have to go to HK to renew the visa every month.. Curious to see if that really happens.

Interesting. Chongqing to Hong Kong every month would be a major drain on time and money for me. I was debating if I should get the study visa (from the uni I'm enrolling in) or go for the business visa for legal reasons (Chongqing has deported some students recently for working), if this is true I'm going for the study visa, at least until my cash flow starts to improve.

Post: #15

@ Rio,

Shenzhen is 1,5 - 2 hours from HK, including time you wait at the customs.
So far it was possible to go to HK in the morning, apply at the agency before 11 am and collect the visa before 6 pm. Not too much hassle, but visa costs you everytime.

@dawg,

Do you get deported for working while on study visa? If so, consider business one. If not and study one lasts for a semester or longer, I wouldn't think twice.

Post: #16

(06-19-2013 03:34 AM)artur jedi Wrote:  @dawg,

Do you get deported for working while on study visa? If so, consider business one. If not and study one lasts for a semester or longer, I wouldn't think twice.

Yes you can be deported. Its was rare that it was enforced in the past but it seems Chongqing's local government has done so recently. Two friends of my friend were deported recently for teaching on a student visa, both were students from Togo I believe. It might just be that they went through a period of enforcement and now things are back to normal, I don't know. There are many teachers here working on business visas which is also illegal, so I'm not sure.

The winds are definitely moving in the direction of stricter enforcement though, the Z Visa process is getting harder, and last year they started asking to see original copies of degree certificates, something that never happened in the past. I believe soon they will start actually verifying degrees and references, in which point you will see a lot of people deported. A good thing really, there are to many clowns over here. I just hope it doesn't get to difficult for those of us who are here for legitimate reasons.

I will get the student visa as the process has already been started, and reassess when I'm back on the ground. I'm a dual passport holder so can always head to Hong Kong and get a business visa on my other passport if needs be.

Post: #17

Chinadog or anyone who knows, what is the process like in getting a business visa for China? From what I remember from my conversations with Tim and Nick from the elevatorlife when I was in GZ, all I need is a letter from a company in my country stating that they need to send me to China for 1-2 years to source products for them. I don't doubt them, but would like a 2nd opinion or at least, get feedback from someone else who has gone through that process.

Thanks!

Post: #18

(06-19-2013 01:23 PM)Vacancier Permanent Wrote:  Chinadog or anyone who knows, what is the process like in getting a business visa for China? From what I remember from my conversations with Tim and Nick from the elevatorlife when I was in GZ, all I need is a letter from a company in my country stating that they need to send me to China for 1-2 years to source products for them. I don't doubt them, but would like a 2nd opinion or at least, get feedback from someone else who has gone through that process.

Thanks!

VP,
What you wrote is an official way.
However, in reality...
In the agency I had a guy in front of me applying for 6 months multiple entry business visa to China. All he had to put was an employers name on the form.
I'm pretty sure consulate didn't check it (since 7 hours later his visa was issued). Guy was from Brazil, and even if the officials tried to check it, the time difference would make it impossible

Post: #19

Jedi,
that was in HK? If yes, that's sweet as hell!!!!How much was the cost of that multiple entry business visa to China? Can you get the 1 year one? If yes, do you know how much is the cost of it?

Thanks!

Post: #20

yes, HK.
Not sure about the costs.
On their website they claim to have up to 3 years visa as I just saw.
Not sure if posting a link here would be considered advertisement, so just send me pm so I will forward it.

Post: #21

No worries, go ahead and post that link. I'm sure others will find it useful as well.

Cheers!

(06-20-2013 09:54 PM)artur jedi Wrote:  yes, HK.
Not sure about the costs.
On their website they claim to have up to 3 years visa as I just saw.
Not sure if posting a link here would be considered advertisement, so just send me pm so I will forward it.

Post: #22

here goes..
http://www.fbt-chinavisa.com.hk/
Website looks like made by 10 years old kid in previous century btw

Post: #23

Vacationer Permanent - What Artur Jedi says is correct. Agencies in Hong Kong can sort it for you in a matter of days. It seems the rules change often, but from my research its rarely a problem getting it from Hong Kong.

Post: #24

(06-18-2013 07:43 AM)artur jedi Wrote:  @ RioNomad.
I'm still here.
Overall rating? 5/10 (due to the weather, language bareer, food and girls with negative butts )
I prefer much more South America, for me there is a paradise (Nordeste do Brasil). As I wrote, China is mostly for money, and I feel I could never "fall in love" with the place. But definitely great experience to see what is possible.

What kind of salary/ cash are you getting from them?

Post: #25

7K base + commission (pretty hard to get it though).