Post: #1

The U.S. has military bases all over the world. They surround Iran, Syria, Russia, and China. They are a huge cause of provocation around the world.

Iran for instance is surrounded by U.S. military bases, has Iraq on one side and Afghanistan on the other, and we constantly talk about the need for regime change there. They feel rationally threatened. And in our media we act like Iran is an aggressive threat to the U.S. and Israel, when in reality we have them totally surrounded by our far superior military.

Will the situation of global U.S. military bases end any time soon?

For instance, Ecuador recently revoked the U.S. military's right to use a base on Ecuadorian territory, saying that if the U.S. wants military bases in Cuador, then Ecuador would need a military base in Miami in return.

Any chance of a significant amount of other countries taking the same path?

Post: #2

There are no military bases in Iraq. And what do you mean by "U.S. military bases"? There is a myth going around that the U.S. has "bases" in 150+ countries. That's just not true. That statistic counts Marines guarding U.S. embassies or military attaches. Two military attaches at some Latin American country hardly counts as a "base." They are there to liaise with the host government military. In all circumstances, countries that house actual U.S. bases (Germany, South Korea, Qatar) want to the U.S. military presence to deter adversaries or for economic reasons (think Bulgaria and Kyrgyzstan). If a country doesn't want to house a U.S. military "base" they can say adios Gringo.

Post: #3

We have an Air Force base in Kyrgyzstan that must be closed by July of this year. That was something I randomly clicked on in Wikipedia. They have a list of all overseas US military bases. It's amazing how many we have in the former axis powers left over from WW2. I think the number in those countries alone is close to 300 various installations.

Post: #4

(03-30-2014 12:29 PM)Sweet Pea Wrote:  We have an Air Force base in Kyrgyzstan that must be closed by July of this year.

My point exactly! We couldn't out bid the Russians on Kyrgyzstan (also the host government did like us raising human rights and corruption issues). And guess what? We are leaving.

Post: #5

I hope not. I'm retired military reserve and can start flying around the world on Air Force planes for $10 a flight when I'm 60. More bases, more destinations. Plus I can buy cheap cigarettes at the PX and sell them to locals.

Dover, Delaware to Ramstein, Norfolk to Rota, Clark to Singapore, etc.

Post: #6

Post: #7

I hope so.

Post: #8

(03-30-2014 08:17 PM)Sonsowey Wrote:  

There seems to be a discrepancy in that map. How are we supposed to access Lake America to the north of Iran without bases there?

Post: #9

Only if the government collapses and people stop joining the military. This is part of America's greater geopolitical aims at world domination through military (NATO) and economic (IMF) coercion. I mean why the hell are Jordanians, Emiratis, Bulgarians, Romanians, Georgians, and tons of other nations' armed forces here in Afghanistan? America through/ with NATO and the EU has obligated those nations into shouldering the part of the risk in order to reap large returns from garrisoning central asia (a-stan), in the form of resources (lithium, gas, copper to name some) and have a central operating base to posture against Russia, China and Iran.

You will find many well written publications the point to this here: http://www.globalresearch.ca/

Post: #10

On the argument about them existing:

When you say military base. I think you are thinking of things like Quantico or camp Pendleton....

When in reality the Forward Operating Bases overseas are more like this....

Post: #11

The point is not so much the capacity of the base. Its the political agreements with the governments in question that allows our military to operate there.

If Russias military operated all throughout the carribean, we wouldnt be comforted by the fact that some "bases" were not so fancy.

Post: #12

(04-01-2014 07:34 AM)Sonsowey Wrote:  The point is not so much the capacity of the base. Its the political agreements with the governments in question that allows our military to operate there.

If Russias military operated all throughout the carribean, we wouldnt be comforted by the fact that some "bases" were not so fancy.

Thats pretty normal man. The US special forces perform raids and drone strikes in Somalia and Yemen. Its not a declared war zone or anything. So they are not allowed to do it.
But if leaders of the Taliban and Al-qaeda are running training camps there... Of course they are going to drone the cunts.

You can't enjoy your freedom and complain about that at the same time.

Post: #13

(04-01-2014 07:34 AM)Sonsowey Wrote:  The point is not so much the capacity of the base. Its the political agreements with the governments in question that allows our military to operate there.

If Russias military operated all throughout the carribean, we wouldnt be comforted by the fact that some "bases" were not so fancy.

Yep; not to mention that one could easily hide an entire Topol launcher inside a large tent. The fact that a military base is "simple" or not fortified doesn't really imply anything - it's still a base with a credible projection of power.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RT-2UTTKh_Topol-M

That said, I am not opposed to the USA having bases all over the world. I agree that the USA should pack up and leave most of these places, but only to save money and energy, not because of a threat to international stability, morals or anything else.

Post: #14

Spalex

Again, if russia was bombing Mexico, Chile, Canada and Nicaragua because of perceived risks to their national security, we would not like it.

Theres really no justification for all this. How does the U.S. have a right to bomb anyone anywhere whenever they deem it appropriate? Look at the massive civilian deaths that are caused by this in Pakistan. Its completely immoral.

Post: #15

It sesms incredible to assert that "my country can bomb anyone we want anywhere" when no other country can do such a thing. I guess thats just the advantage of being a superpower but you are gonna get blowback. Why do foreign terrorists not attack Brazil? Because Brazil isnt bombing foreign countries ever.

Post: #16

(04-01-2014 07:50 AM)spalex Wrote:  

(04-01-2014 07:34 AM)Sonsowey Wrote:  The point is not so much the capacity of the base. Its the political agreements with the governments in question that allows our military to operate there.

If Russias military operated all throughout the carribean, we wouldnt be comforted by the fact that some "bases" were not so fancy.

Thats pretty normal man. The US special forces perform raids and drone strikes in Somalia and Yemen. Its not a declared war zone or anything. So they are not allowed to do it.
But if leaders of the Taliban and Al-qaeda are running training camps there... Of course they are going to drone the cunts.

You can't enjoy your freedom and complain about that at the same time.

Yeah, sure, because America is the only "free" country in the world...

Post: #17

Its not JUST American forces that do it.
Sure they are behind most of it, but they use British special forces a lot to perform raids in Pakistan and Somalia.

National Security is a lot more serious than you think, and its a lot more complicated than building a wall around your country.

(04-02-2014 04:38 PM)Sonsowey Wrote:  Spalex

Again, if russia was bombing Mexico, Chile, Canada and Nicaragua because of perceived risks to their national security, we would not like it.

Theres really no justification for all this. How does the U.S. have a right to bomb anyone anywhere whenever they deem it appropriate? Look at the massive civilian deaths that are caused by this in Pakistan. Its completely immoral.

There is plenty of justification.

Think about when you here people talk about soldiers and say things like "they are protecting our freedom. or "thank you for protecting our freed"
It is thrown around a lot. But None of these people really know the meaning behind these words.

Imagine if our worlds forces weren't going into the middle east and fucking shit up.
Imagine a world where Osama bin-laned is still alive.
A world where alll the terrorists from Al-qaeda, the Talliban, al shabaab, boko haram, hezb-e- islami guibuddin, hamas, hezbollah... The list goes on.

If allll these people were still alive.... Do you think things would stop at the September 11, London and Madrid bombings?
Of course it wouldn't!
These people wan't to kill everyone who is not one of them!

That's why we have this War on terror. At the moment they are trying to prevent the alliban operating around the tribal areas of north west Pakistan and border of Afghanistan.

Unfortunately it is going to take a few more terrorist attacks and people are going to have to lose a mate or a family member before they understand this.

Post: #18

(04-03-2014 01:27 AM)spalex Wrote:  Its not JUST American forces that do it.
Sure they are behind most of it, but they use British special forces a lot to perform raids in Pakistan and Somalia.

National Security is a lot more serious than you think, and its a lot more complicated than building a wall around your country.

My point is there are a lot of countries who could be considered free and secure who do not engage in the level of "activity" abroad as countries like the U.S. and the British.

Post: #19

(04-03-2014 05:14 AM)Beyond Borders Wrote:  

(04-03-2014 01:27 AM)spalex Wrote:  Its not JUST American forces that do it.
Sure they are behind most of it, but they use British special forces a lot to perform raids in Pakistan and Somalia.

National Security is a lot more serious than you think, and its a lot more complicated than building a wall around your country.

My point is there are a lot of countries who could be considered free and secure who do not engage in the level of "activity" abroad as countries like the U.S. and the British.

and don't suffer from terrorist attacks as a consequence. The 7/7 bombings in the UK were a direct result of the British government hanging off the American tail as it rained down bombs on Afghanistan and Iraq.

Post: #20

You act like Bin Laden attacked us out of nowhere. U.S. military bases in holy Saudi sites were what provoked him to begin with.

Thats why he attacked the USA and not Brazil. We have military bases all over the muslim world, supporting dictators all throughout the muslim world.

We only need to kill these guys cause we created them. And our bombings of their countries create more and more terrorists. Its just tit for tat at this point. But how many muslim extremists are attacking Christian Democracies in South America who dont fuck with the Muslim world.

Post: #21

(04-03-2014 11:42 AM)Sonsowey Wrote:  You act like Bin Laden attacked us out of nowhere. U.S. military bases in holy Saudi sites were what provoked him to begin with.

Thats why he attacked the USA and not Brazil. We have military bases all over the muslim world, supporting dictators all throughout the muslim world.

We only need to kill these guys cause we created them. And our bombings of their countries create more and more terrorists. Its just tit for tat at this point. But how many muslim extremists are attacking Christian Democracies in South America who dont fuck with the Muslim world.

Here mate.
This is 1 of about 180 other versus just like it (pm me if you want a better quality pic of it, or any of the others).
This is why we have terrorist attacks like 9/11 going on all over the world.
This was written about 1400 years before before the US had military bases in foreign countries.

From the top of my head, I can recall 2 islamic terrorist attacks in Argentina. Fuck-loads of people were killed.

The one part you were right about is that bombing their countries causes more muslims to resort to Jihad. But that is the cost of war. Think about it... How many Polish people like Germans or Russians?

Post: #22

Yea that same shit is in the bible torah. Dont act like thats the cause or this. In muslim eyes christians are the ones who are aggressors against muslims. Our militaries being there are a much bigger incitation than some verse in the koran. http://www.evilbible.com/BiblicalIntolerance.htm

Post: #23

(04-03-2014 11:42 AM)Sonsowey Wrote:  You act like Bin Laden attacked us out of nowhere. U.S. military bases in holy Saudi sites were what provoked him to begin with.

Thats why he attacked the USA and not Brazil. We have military bases all over the muslim world, supporting dictators all throughout the muslim world.

If he was mad at the US for the bases, shouldn't he have attacked the countries hosting the US and then the Saudis would have kicked the US out? US has bases there with permission.

Post: #24

(04-02-2014 04:38 PM)Sonsowey Wrote:  Spalex

Again, if russia was bombing Mexico, Chile, Canada and Nicaragua because of perceived risks to their national security, we would not like it.

Theres really no justification for all this. How does the U.S. have a right to bomb anyone anywhere whenever they deem it appropriate? Look at the massive civilian deaths that are caused by this in Pakistan. Its completely immoral.

you should read "decent into chaos" by ahmed Rashid and "ghost wars" by steve coll

Post: #25

(04-03-2014 12:50 PM)spalex Wrote:  

(04-03-2014 11:42 AM)Sonsowey Wrote:  You act like Bin Laden attacked us out of nowhere. U.S. military bases in holy Saudi sites were what provoked him to begin with.

Thats why he attacked the USA and not Brazil. We have military bases all over the muslim world, supporting dictators all throughout the muslim world.

We only need to kill these guys cause we created them. And our bombings of their countries create more and more terrorists. Its just tit for tat at this point. But how many muslim extremists are attacking Christian Democracies in South America who dont fuck with the Muslim world.

Here mate.
This is 1 of about 180 other versus just like it (pm me if you want a better quality pic of it, or any of the others).
This is why we have terrorist attacks like 9/11 going on all over the world.
This was written about 1400 years before before the US had military bases in foreign countries.

From the top of my head, I can recall 2 islamic terrorist attacks in Argentina. Fuck-loads of people were killed.

The one part you were right about is that bombing their countries causes more muslims to resort to Jihad. But that is the cost of war. Think about it... How many Polish people like Germans or Russians?

There is 8 verses there in the bible....
versus 180+ just on jihad in the quran. Plus there is hundreds (i haven't actually counted) more on intolerance and deception and all sorts of other fucked up shit towards non-believers.
Thats just the Quran... The Sunnah (Prophet Mohammeds rules for life book), is pretty much all jihad and treating women worse than dogs.

Also, unlike the bible which nobody would argue is open to you own interpretation, the Quran specifically dictates that everything in it is to be taken literally.

As for the Torah, I cant say anything as I haven't read it. But I cant imagine there was much competition when it was written!