Post: #1

http://news.yahoo.com/obsession-over-six...17704.html

DEAR ABBY: I'm a 21-year-old man who has been a successful swimmer in high school and now in college. Over the past few months, I have become obsessed with developing six-pack abs. I have never had much success with women, and I thought that looking like a movie star might finally get me noticed and make me feel good about myself.

As a result, I have become obsessive about my diet. I have dropped 10 pounds, mostly muscle, and my performance in the pool has suffered. If I don't see perfect definition between every ab and don't exercise for at least 2 1/2 hours a day, I feel fat and guilty whenever I eat. I have awakened in the middle of the night worrying about what I'll eat the next day. I'm concerned for the future when my metabolism will inevitably slow down.

I have begun to think that death is a better scenario than being fat, or feeling that way. I want to be able to enjoy eating again and get my life back. I don't want to tell my parents or friends for fear of seeming weak-minded. Where can I go for help? -- FEELING LOST IN NEW MEXICO

DEAR FEELING LOST: Physical perfection is no guarantee that you'll find love. Liking yourself and accepting yourself for who you are is what attracts others.

Although "looking like a movie star" can be an asset -- depending upon who the movie star is -- unless you are secure about who you are and what you have to offer, you can't maintain a healthy relationship. (If you don't believe me, look at the tabloids and start counting how many movie star romances resemble a game of musical chairs.)

If you truly think that death might be preferable to being fat, then you are in trouble. You may have a serious eating disorder, one that could shorten your life. Most people who have an eating disorder need professional help to overcome it, so the place to go is to your student health center. Ask to speak with a mental health counselor about what you're doing and how you're feeling. It is important that you understand what has caused this so you can be successfully treated.

Post: #2

Women must have it great in New Mexico. One of my best friends is from there, sounds like a pussy desert.

Also never heard of a single mention of NM as a place to visit for game purposes on RVF. Bad sign.

Guy just need to go south a few hundred miles into the old country.

Post: #3

I read somewhere that maintaining six-pack abs lowers your testosterone. Because it takes such hard work and an extreme caloric deficit.

This guy may be having that problem.

Post: #4

That doesn't seem right. To have six pack abs you need to have a body fat % of less than 10 I believe. I'm at 11 right now and I've got a four pack but not a six. It's known that body fat decreases testosterone. As a rule, less body fat = more testosterone.

What this guy sounds like he's doing is going on a binge diet which we know never works. To lose body fat you should maintain a slight caloric deficit so you lose around a pound or two a week. Anything over that is going to hurt you in the long run, as we see here because he's losing muscle.

Post: #5

If he says he is swimmer then he is probably very thin and has little muscle from doing some hi-rep / low-weight exercizes like crunches for abs. Any surplus food therefore turns into fat.

He should build bigger muscles by working with higher weight and lower reps to burn off more calories and be able to eat more by training more rarely. And this means he should probably not spend much time doing ab isolation exercises. Which I bet he does.

Also abs are really overrated in terms of getting women. They are useless unless you are topless which is in bedroom when she is ready for sex anyway. Any other muscle that shows with clothing is more useful than abs in terms of attracting women.

Post: #6

Unless you're doing "beach game" no one is going to see you 6 pack until your naked, but you already got her back to your bed at that point so it didn't matter.

It'd be nice to have a six pack, but there's a bad ROI for game.

Post: #7

This kid has serious inner game issues. Maybe he should work on that instead of obsessing over six pack abs.

Post: #8

Obsession is a word the lazy use to describe the dedicated.

This kid has terrible inner game but there is no harm in striving for perfection in something.

Sounds fake because if you are a successful swimmer you are already doing several hours of swimming, ab exercises and workouts daily. All my swimmer friends at Uni were absolutely ripped but they generally have bad game because of the isolated and introverted nature of the sport. Plus they have zero drinking tolerance.

Post: #9

(07-31-2014 12:19 PM)Atlantic Wrote:  Obsession is a word the lazy use to describe the dedicated.

This kid has terrible inner game but there is no harm in striving for perfection in something.

Sounds fake because if you are a successful swimmer you are already doing several hours of swimming, ab exercises and workouts daily. All my swimmer friends at Uni were absolutely ripped but they generally have bad game because of the isolated and introverted nature of the sport. Plus they have zero drinking tolerance.

There's only harm when it comes at the cost of something else. He's waking up in the middle of the night worrying about what he's going to eat the next day and experiences symptoms of depression(e.g., thinking death is a better scenario than being fat).

Having perfectly chiseled abs does not guarantee you success with women. It'll get you more looks from them(when you're topless), sure, but it's no substitute for having good inner game, which he obviously lacks.

He's a product of how mainstream media has deluded young men—thinking they need to look like a movie star to attract women.

Post: #10

It's not just diet but actually working out the core.

And I don't mean just ab exercises, but compound lifts such as squats, deadlifts, etc.

Post: #11

I think some body types will have 6 packs and others wont. In high school I would do several hundred crunches per night and ran and I feel like that kind of set me up for years. I've always had a little less of the bottom two abs than the top 4 but still had a 6 pack. These days I been so busy working I've slacked a bit on my eating habits and workouts but still have a solid 4 pack. I have buddies and stuff though who just got out of military so in shape running several miles a day and even doing tons of ab workouts and still have a completely undefined stomach where as some people who dont really try have 4 packs or at least some definition. I think a big misconception is situps will get you a 6 pack. As its been said in this thread bodyfat percentage and running are probably the two most important things.

Post: #12

Maybe if he did real compound moves like squats and deadlifts he'd have a more well rounded physique. Doing a million crunches does not achieve much.

Post: #13

(07-31-2014 12:30 PM)game_ethic Wrote:  

(07-31-2014 12:19 PM)Atlantic Wrote:  Obsession is a word the lazy use to describe the dedicated.

This kid has terrible inner game but there is no harm in striving for perfection in something.

Sounds fake because if you are a successful swimmer you are already doing several hours of swimming, ab exercises and workouts daily. All my swimmer friends at Uni were absolutely ripped but they generally have bad game because of the isolated and introverted nature of the sport. Plus they have zero drinking tolerance.

There's only harm when it comes at the cost of something else. He's waking up in the middle of the night worrying about what he's going to eat the next day and experiences symptoms of depression(e.g., thinking death is a better scenario than being fat).

Having perfectly chiseled abs does not guarantee you success with women. It'll get you more looks from them(when you're topless), sure, but it's no substitute for having good inner game, which he obviously lacks.

He's a product of how mainstream media has deluded young men—thinking they need to look like a movie star to attract women.

I agree. If he had soild inner game it would be a worthy pursuit but at the moment its only feeding his insecurity.

From the swimmers I have known a lot of them have inner game issues.
They are socially isolated in a sport that promotes individual achievement. Swimming is kind of a zero sums game. You win or you didn’t. It is great for peak physical training but as a lifestyle you fall behind on experiencing what your pears are going through. They generally don’t drink or party much and are very strict on training and lifestyle – pool before University for two hours and then again in the evening after classes.

The swimmers I know are great achievers in individual pursuits and get high grades. Unfortunately their social skills suffer slightly and can find it hard to just chill and not see everything as a competition.

I am generalizing but that’s what I have seen.

Post: #14

(07-31-2014 12:09 PM)Dusty Wrote:  Unless you're doing "beach game" no one is going to see you 6 pack until your naked, but you already got her back to your bed at that point so it didn't matter.

It'd be nice to have a six pack, but there's a bad ROI for game.

Six packs also help at pool parties, which are common in cities like Las Vegas, Los Angeles, and Miami during the summer months. So I wouldn't say the ROI is necessarily "bad", but it's certainly not something worth obsessing over.

Post: #15

Shockingly, her advice is on point. Not extensive or sufficient for him (because she doesn't include a link to RVF or RoK), but she's right.

Post: #16

If you train like a bitch, you will look, in turn, like a bitch.

No man should concentrate on abdominal exercises at the expense of a well rounded physique. Swimmers are already low body fat, so you have to question his starting physique. Like said previously, compounds, not dropping to <2000 cals a day, and rest will give you much better results than 10000 crunches and an extreme caloric deficit.

Post: #17

(07-31-2014 11:29 AM)Beyond Borders Wrote:  I read somewhere that maintaining six-pack abs lowers your testosterone. Because it takes such hard work and an extreme caloric deficit.

This guy may be having that problem.

Is it because certain guys are doing so much cardio that the cortisol in their bodies rises?

Post: #18

I agree with the guys suggesting a well balanced body. That said, I am a build all the muscle first, core included, and then cut the fat and weight down later kinda guy. That always worked for me. Sometimes bulk up cycles help make muscles pop out that are more stubborn while using those conventional methods.

Post: #19

I am obsessed with my abs.

I'm not sure how I got this way?

I'm embarrassed if I don't have abs, I feel like a loser.

I'm not sure if its a healthy obsession or not. Maybe a little of both..?

Somehow, I got brainwashed into thinking that men should have abs.

Maybe, its because as a kid, I idolized world class athletes. I wanted to be like them, they always had great abs.

Superman, Batman, Spiderman, Ironman, etc. They always had abs.

I was raised by athletes and health nuts. Not having abs meant I was not working hard enough or I was eating bad food.

I felt peer pressure to have abs.

I was taught that fat people are lazy, undisciplined, and lacking in self control.

I now know this isn't always true. Different people have different priorities.

I got brainwashed into the world of abs!

I will try to keep my abs for as long as I can. Hopefully, into my 40s.

*****

Does it help me get pussy?

Of course.

Having abs means that the rest of my body will be free of any excess fat.

If I add some of muscle... I have abs + muscle.

Abs + muscle puts me in the top 10% of men, in terms of body.

Girls don't need to see my abs to know that I have them.

They can tell by my arms, shoulders, chest, and legs that I have abs.

I girl recently told me that I look like a guy who would have a 6pack. At the time, I was wearing only shorts and a t-shirt.

---

Learning how to dress properly has also helped me to better display my abs.

Even in slim pants and a fitted shirt, girls can see that my stomach is totally flat and my body is symmetrical.



They might not see the actual "6pack", but but they know it is probably there.

---

Having abs means that my diet is probably pretty good.

This means that my skin should also look healthy.

----

Having abs means that my overall vitality should look good

WITH CLOTHES ON.

******

How do I increase my sexual opportunities?

Take my shirt off and/wear tank tops!

I am constantly taking my shirt off.

Hot weather
The Beach
The Gym
The Park
Hiking
Basketball/soccer games.
Swimming
Etc.

I look for any excuse to take my shirt off.

Once the shirt is off. Having a 6pack is often a DHV. Girls often think it is sexy. Assuming the rest of your body, face, and personality are okay.

*****

Sexually..

It turns girls on.

They want a man with a nice body.

Very few men have this. It sets me apart.

---

Abs help me get girls and they also help me keep girls.

*****

This is just my perspective and I admit, my perspective is very biased.

I also admit, having a 6pack will do nothing for you if you don't have the necessary game to go with it.

But, if you do have some game, a 6pack can be a little detail that helps you appear more attractive, communicate your sexual intent, sexualize interactions faster, effect women's body chemistry, make women want to suck your dick, give women a "fantasy" experience, and give you a little
edge over the competition.

I probably care about my abs more than I should.

Post: #20

(07-31-2014 11:33 AM)Libertas Wrote:  That doesn't seem right. To have six pack abs you need to have a body fat % of less than 10 I believe. I'm at 11 right now and I've got a four pack but not a six. It's known that body fat decreases testosterone. As a rule, less body fat = more testosterone.

Not to chase this tangent too much, but it's not a completely black and white rule, actually.

Yeah, if you're over 15% bodyfat, I believe it is, pretty much losing weight is the number one thing you should focus on to boost testosterone. Being fat will murder your man hormones.

But below a certain threshold, losing weight becomes counter-productive and can also decrease testosterone. I think it's below 8 or 9%, but I'd have to look it up.

I was only joking with my post though. You're still obviously way better off being a bit too ripped than being chubby. And at 10% you're definitely solid. I think 7 - 8% is where you need to be for a 6-pack (I've never had one so maybe someone can confirm?).

Anyways, I'm just repeating information here (albeit from a pretty credible source). I'm by no means in shape or an expert on testosterone. I just did some research while working for a client and this was one thing that came up.

Post: #21

Gio, you are also lucky to live near the Equator where you can utilise having a good body. Up in the North, cats only get 3 months of flossing then it's back to the North Face jackets.

One can also utilise the good body in Florida.

Post: #22

six pack? naaaa.... I have a gas tank to fuel my sex machine :

I understand that being fit is better than not being fit, but i'm not going to go crazy if i don't get my 6-pack. IMO it's too much trouble (not the working out part, but more the eating control part) for the marginal benefit it gets you.
I think that a good body frame such as wide broad shoulders, v taper, decent chest, good looking ass (nohomo) and strong legs are more important than the 6 pack. I know lots of skinny guys that have the 6pack, but they still look like bitches.

Post: #23

Game is about improvising.

I have a 6 pack and when I game girls I may say something like "my stomach is making a weird noise, do you hear it?" then guide her head to my stomach so she can listen.

OR

If it is remotely hot outside I may take the bottom of my V-neck and wipe my face with it, exposing my abs.

Don't hate on six packs just because you don't have one. If you do have one and are using it to your advantage only in obvious environents(bedroom, beach), then work on improvising.

Bitches can't stop themselves when they see/feel a six pack. Especially if their bfs dont have one.

That said, a six pack is not required to pull.

Post: #24

http://www.muscleforlife.com/how-to-meas...ercentage/

Look at the difference between two guys with around 10% BF. Can you guess which one the insecure swimmer resembles?

Post: #25

(07-31-2014 01:29 PM)Noah Wrote:  Six packs also help at pool parties, which are common in cities like Las Vegas, Los Angeles, and Miami during the summer months. So I wouldn't say the ROI is necessarily "bad", but it's certainly not something worth obsessing over.

I was at The Clevelander one night in South Beach about a month ago and there was a European dude there showing off his abs to a group of East Indian 2.5's.

One of them looked at him and asked him, "What do you want me to do with those?"

It was a rather sad spectacle, one that I wish I could have caught on camera.

FTR: I do have a six pack, but I have one because I like taking care of my body, not because I want to show stop for some low quality skanks.