Post: #1

As in guys who are 8+ in terms of looks? Would those same guys be average-looking (like a 6-7) if they were a bit out of shape (like 20% body fat), or do their good genetics shine through regardless?

Post: #2

I ask because I'm currently at 20% or in the late teens in terms of body fat (which is like an average body type) and I rate myself a 6, rarely get IOI's from women (I used to assume I was good looking because of random compliments I got in highschool that stuck and fucked me up by giving me false expectations, mainly from other guys who'd tell me that I was 'cute', but I have a more realistic perception of my attractiveness now), and somehow I have this idea that if I get down to 8-10% and lose my puffy face I could crack 7+ when it's possible that I just don't have the facial structure for it. It's honestly the only thing that's given me hope in having any success in game, and I'm just counting down the days until I get lean when it's possible that it wont make much of a difference.

Post: #3

I'm not one to usually say this, but after this thread..

Post: #4

I don't know exactly what 20% body fat looks like, but just like we don't consider chubby girls 'really hot' (a.k.a 8+), I doubt girls would classify overweight men as 'extremely attractive'.

A little beer gut that you can't see unless the guy is wearing a tight shirt might not be a big deal, but generally speaking, when you're overweight (even slightly), your face isn't as chiseled and your bone structure is harder to see.

Take Leo DiCaprio for instance. Look at his face now and a few years ago. Big difference.

It's a real shame, especially in obese countries like America. I see plenty of girls who I can tell have nice bone structure, beautiful eyes etc.

But with a 20lb layer of fat around their body, they're gross.

Post: #5

Is looks insecurity trolling on the troll list?

There are controllable physical appearance traits which influence sexual attractiveness. These include:
- Musculature
- Body fat percentage
- Styling
- Posture
- Skin (to some extent)
- Dick size (apparently 'PE' guys have proven you can increase this to some extent)

There are uncontrollable physical appearance traits which influence sexual attractiveness. These include:
- Facial bone structure (jaw, brow, symmetry and proportions etc; controllable if you are Korean)
- Height
- Shoulder-to-shoulder skeletal width

High body fat percentage obscures facial bone structure (jaw and cheekbone definition disappears), so an otherwise handsome man will not look that handsome at 20% b.f.

'Good genetics' is not just indicated by physical appearance. It is also indicated by behaviour, since a large percentage of your genes are expressed in your brain. And one of the biggest tell-tale signs of poor mental health is neurotic behaviour. It is important, for your sexual attractiveness, that you work on getting out of your head and stop indulging in your anxieties and self-doubt. I think goodlookingloser has some articles on dealing with anxiety.

Post: #6

(06-22-2015 09:33 AM)Nascimento Wrote:  I'm not one to usually say this, but after this thread..

It's a genuine sore spot for me. It's kind of disorienting to go from thinking you're attractive and stand out (those are good pictures, most of the time when I look in the mirror, I don't see that. trust me on this. i'm sure you've seen average-looking girls that take good selfies), and having that be your only source of confidence or sense of value from the age of 16 because you lack personality, to realizing that you're average and have low SMV. It's a lot to adjust to. Girls who were 7+ used to seem attainable, in theory, whereas now I assume zero passive attraction from fuckable girls my age. I'm just now noticing the extent to which I'm ignored by girls which I just assumed was typical for most guys regardless of looks if they lack 'game'.

Post: #7

I think that the body fat percentage plays a larger role in changing womens attractivness than for men.

Initial attractiveness is going to be based on the woman's perception of you, but I think in most cases a guy 3 stone overweight is going to look less attractive than if he wasn't. I think having a lower percentage of body fat combined with some training at the gym can have good results for many people who consider themselves to averagely built.

Post: #8

If you're not a purple dancing Troll, the answer is obvious. Eat properly, lose weight, lift weights and then you won't have to complaint about being overweight and 20% fat and "puffy faced". It's all part of game.

Post: #9

(06-22-2015 10:08 AM)depravity Wrote:  It's a genuine sore spot for me. It's kind of disorienting to go from thinking you're attractive and stand out (those are good pictures, most of the time when I look in the mirror, I don't see that. trust me on this. i'm sure you've seen average-looking girls that take good selfies), and having that be your only source of confidence or sense of value from the age of 16 because you lack personality, to realizing that you're average and have low SMV. It's a lot to adjust to. Girls who were 7+ used to seem attainable, in theory, whereas now I assume zero passive attraction from fuckable girls my age.

We've already told you you're a good looking guy on the other thread and given you some sound advice.

I've told you I've already been in your exact same position and given you two serious pieces of advice on the matter.

But yet not only what I've offered, but also what everyone else has suggested to you out of good will, has just gone in one ear, out the other.

Post: #10

Dude you've started a few threads on this alone, if you have a general question, post in the lifters lounge.

If you've got a game question post it in the approach thread, or players lounge.

You're doing fine with your approach thread.

But my god you're being extremely insecure about your looks and BMI.

If you're lifting give us the stats in the lifters lounge, you'll get alot of suggestions.

Post: #11

That other guy who trolled first the Misc then RVF about his looks and his daygame technique was a much better troll.

Every time someone would give him advice he would come up with some reason why that wouldn't work for him or some new problem. He kept it going for a long time. Wish I could recall the names of those threads

Post: #12

OP did you wanted to hear that beauty comes at all shapes and sizes? LOL

Post: #13

The OP is banned but to answer the question for the public record, I'd say that, overwhelmingly, yes.

Low body fat is a foundation of attractiveness. It reveals the facial bones. Some men with particularly robust, protusive bone structure can pull off being good looking while fat, but those are a minority. But even then there's still a big difference, cf. Chris Pratt - pudgy TV character actor vs. trim Hollywood leading man.

The 5 components of being (facially) "handsome", in rough order, in my opinion:

1. Bone Structure
2. Body Fat %
3. Hair
4. Youthfulness
5. Neck Thickness

Post: #14

It's quite amazing how a combination of low body fat, musculature and dressing smart (i.e. suited or otherwise fitted clothing) can make a fairly average or even ugly man appear "handsome" to some girls. Even acting in a confident way has an effect on how girls perceive your looks. Some things we can't control, but there's a lot that we can. I'm so thankful to be born a man.

Post: #15

Yes. You have to be in shape in the first place to be consider in the good looking range.