Post: #1

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/09/04/us/kim....html?_r=0

"The clerk, Kim Davis of Rowan County, was ordered incarcerated after a hearing here before Judge David L. Bunning of Federal District Court. The contempt finding was another legal defeat for Ms. Davis, who has argued that she should not be forced to issue licenses that conflict with her religious beliefs."

Post: #2

Whatever your views on the issue, it isn't civil disobedience when you actually are the State.
Bitch clearly doesn't understand how this works.

Post: #3

Guess the pussy pass is only accepted when you're on their side, huh?

Post: #4

Whether or not you personally agree with gay marriage is irrelevant when your state job involves issuing marriage licenses. The supreme court made its ruling and that's that. If she doesn't like it, or doesn't agree, then she should seek out a new job. For those who are going to say "but...but...gay marriage..." that's nice, but the law is clear on the matter whether you agree or not.

If I lived in bumfuck appalachia and had a decent public sector job with benefits and a pension, I sure as shit wouldn't risk that job on some idealistic crusade that will not yield the result she wants.

Post: #5

"The law is the law" is a quaint notion that doesn't exist in America anymore in the first place. We have mayors and governors actively defying federal immigration law and getting away with it because the media agrees with their position. Same with federal drug laws.

I applaud her doing this but she's going to get steamrolled.

Anal marriage is a complete joke and a disgrace.

Post: #6

She has every right not to issue gay marriage licenses if she finds it goes against her beliefs but since she can't perform her job she should have stepped down.

Post: #7

As I was reading, I had some deep thoughts.

Judging by her picture, she may be in her late-forties to mid fifties. Let's say she lived in Kentucky her whole life. Presumably, she was raised in a Christian household and taught Christian values. She may have lost faith as she grew older, but the fundamental values taught to her in her early years stayed the same. I'd bet she passed the same values to her children. Seeing as she is a clerk, she either had a short professional career or stayed in the general work force her whole life. There are no real skills to being a clerk so it's safe the job is simple and standard.

Now, let's remove her gender and think of everyone as a whole. A mass majority of people across the world lived in an era where homosexuality was taboo and almost nonexistent. My parents and grandparents were raised in a setting where homosexuality did not publicly exist. It was known to happen, but if anyone ever openly came out and demanded acceptance it was viewed as a mental illness. They went through a majority of their lives never dealing with homosexuals. I'm sure this lady falls into this category.

In the last decade there has been an uprising in the homosexual community demanding not only equality in the eyes of the state, but acceptance in the eyes of society. Technically, these people are already living equal lives. They are not forced to pay extra taxes, eat at separate locations, be put on a list, etc. What they want above all else is OPEN homosexuality.

They want us to accept their extreme lifestyle. They want us to not look disgusted when two burly dudes are going at it in the middle of the street. They want us to consider two men raising a little boy as brave and heroic. They want us to think that bodily mutilation is a way of expressing your individuality.

I'm going to go out on a limb and say most of us are not homophobic. We don't go out of our way to ruin these people's day. The conflict occurs when these views are forced down our throats. The LGBTWXYZ community is delusional if it thinks a few protests and laws are going to change what people grew up with.

Now it's going as far as someone being thrown in JAIL because they do not support this movement. I'm not sure what the right call was. Maybe she should have quit her job, maybe not. There is one thing I do know though, and that is that this will never end. They will never be satisfied.

I could go on for hours, but I'll end it here. If this isn't a sign of the incoming collapse, I don't know what is.

Post: #8

Cronus, a lot of what you wrote seems unlikely. She has a very nasty and checkered past.

However, I am glad she is doing this.

Post: #9

At best she failed to do her job, at worst she abused her position of authority to deny people their rights. Punishment fits the crime.

Post: #10

(09-03-2015 02:17 PM)TheWastelander Wrote:  Cronus, a lot of what you wrote seems unlikely. She has a very nasty and checkered past.

However, I am glad she is doing this.

Speaking of that, she did get divorced 3 times and married 4 times I believe.

Post: #11

(09-03-2015 02:35 PM)kaotic Wrote:  

(09-03-2015 02:17 PM)TheWastelander Wrote:  Cronus, a lot of what you wrote seems unlikely. She has a very nasty and checkered past.

However, I am glad she is doing this.

Speaking of that, she did get divorced 3 times and married 4 times I believe.

Look at her. Can you blame her husbands for wanting to GTFO?

Post: #12

The fagscists have taken over.
God help us.

(09-03-2015 01:03 PM)Eirykr Wrote:  Whatever your views on the issue, it isn't civil disobedience when you actually are the State.
Bitch clearly doesn't understand how this works.

I love how the same people who want other government officials to disobey laws of their choice are now saying she should implement the so-called law anyway. This is the problem with societies. Should the Gestapo have enforced the roundups or should one officer somewhere look the other way and risk jail by violating bad laws? It is insane. If a law is bad, it should be disobeyed, not mindlessly enforced.

Post: #13

At first I didn't understand why it was a matter of court, but now that I know a bit more about the case it makes sense to me. She should have just stepped down if she had a moral problem with the issue.

Post: #14

Wouldn't the county just fire her and get another clerk?

Post: #15

She was an elected official

Post: #16

Obama refuses to enforce a bunch of laws he doesn't agree with, yet it's this woman going to jail.

Post: #17

People of my mothers generation are shockingly naive when it comes to homosexuality and their demands.

She works at a church as an integral part of it except she isn't part of the clergy. I asked =here what would happen if a couple of homo's wanted to marry there. She merely put it down to a vote between the clergy in the church.

If it was voted against then that would be that in their world. Not so for the couple who want what they want and believe they should get it.

Post: #18

(09-03-2015 03:49 PM)Captainstabbin Wrote:  Obama refuses to enforce a bunch of laws he doesn't agree with, yet it's this woman going to jail.

I agree, my mind is blown that this woman is locked up in jail with an INDEFINITE sentence. This is political prisoner stuff right there.

If you murder someone, do you have to stay in jail until you apologize to the family? No, you get a set term in jail and then you are done. This woman's only way out of prison is if she recants her religious beliefs. If thats not kicking the constitution in the balls right there, I don't know what is.

edit: It really does seem like an open ended sentence...a statement from one of her lawyers

-----------
Today, for the first time in history, an American citizen has been incarcerated for having the belief of conscience that marriage is the union of one man and one woman, and she’s been ordered to stay there until she’s willing to change her mind, until she’s willing to change her conscience about what that belief is,” he said. “This is unprecedented in American law

Post: #19

(09-03-2015 02:45 PM)zaqan Wrote:  The fagscists have taken over.
God help us.

(09-03-2015 01:03 PM)Eirykr Wrote:  Whatever your views on the issue, it isn't civil disobedience when you actually are the State.
Bitch clearly doesn't understand how this works.

I love how the same people who want other government officials to disobey laws of their choice are now saying she should implement the so-called law anyway. This is the problem with societies. Should the Gestapo have enforced the roundups or should one officer somewhere look the other way and risk jail by violating bad laws? It is insane. If a law is bad, it should be disobeyed, not mindlessly enforced.

I think deep down this is why some liberals do not like Christianity. Christianity teaches that there is a higher law than the government. Governments can pass laws, but they are not the ultimate arbiters of what is right and what is wrong.

You need only open a history book to see all of the atrocities committed by people who were "only following orders" and doing what their government told them to do.

Since she has not been conscripted to her position, practically speaking, it would make more sense for her to just quit the job if it conflicts with her moral standards.

Post: #20

(09-03-2015 02:17 PM)TheWastelander Wrote:  Cronus, a lot of what you wrote seems unlikely. She has a very nasty and checkered past.

However, I am glad she is doing this.

You are nothing if not consistent Wastelander, and as always you are not a troll and you stand behind your beliefs. I don't agree with you but I am forced to respect you and your opinion. I wish you would be inconsistent or a hypocrite so I could not respect your opinion and claim a moral victory, but alas, you are intellectually consistent so I will just have to respectfully disagree. This woman was elected to do a job, even if it is distasteful she was elected, she took an oath and she neglected to follow a Supreme Court ruling, repeatedly. She now faces the consequences.... That is the system she chose to be a part of.

Post: #21

(09-03-2015 04:49 PM)Renzy Wrote:  

(09-03-2015 02:45 PM)zaqan Wrote:  The fagscists have taken over.
God help us.

(09-03-2015 01:03 PM)Eirykr Wrote:  Whatever your views on the issue, it isn't civil disobedience when you actually are the State.
Bitch clearly doesn't understand how this works.

I love how the same people who want other government officials to disobey laws of their choice are now saying she should implement the so-called law anyway. This is the problem with societies. Should the Gestapo have enforced the roundups or should one officer somewhere look the other way and risk jail by violating bad laws? It is insane. If a law is bad, it should be disobeyed, not mindlessly enforced.

I think deep down this is why some liberals do not like Christianity. Christianity teaches that there is a higher law than the government. Governments can pass laws, but they are not the ultimate arbiters of what is right and what is wrong.

You need only open a history book to see all of the atrocities committed by people who were "only following orders" and doing what their government told them to do.

Since she has not been conscripted to her position, practically speaking, it would make more sense for her to just quit the job if it conflicts with her moral standards.

I agree, she could have just stepped down but she obviously wanted to take a stand and be a martyr of sorts. The same way that the gay marriage people descend on businesses and sue to get a cake that is clearly going to have at least one turd mixed into the batter when they are forced to make it. They could go an get a cake in the shape of two dicks crossed like swords in extreme realism by any trendy cake shop...but they want to make a statement.

Post: #22

American Conservative had a good article on this.
http://www.theamericanconservative.com/d...avis-case/

Christians are not allowed to break the law, she should have resigned.

People harping on her divorces don't know she only converted a few years ago. After the divorces.

Post: #23

(09-03-2015 04:57 PM)Eskhander Wrote:  American Conservative had a good article on this.
http://www.theamericanconservative.com/d...avis-case/

Christians are not allowed to break the law, she should have resigned.

People harping on her divorces don't know she only converted a few years ago. After the divorces.

Christians are not allowed to break the law? I never read that in the Bible.

Post: #24

(09-03-2015 04:57 PM)Eskhander Wrote:  American Conservative had a good article on this.
http://www.theamericanconservative.com/d...avis-case/

Christians are not allowed to break the law, she should have resigned.

People harping on her divorces don't know she only converted a few years ago. After the divorces.

Was she actually breaking the law or just not doing her job? I would imagine a process exists to recall or impeach elected officials in that county.

If I worked at subway and refused to give people tuna salad sandwiches because I thought it was gross...am I breaking the law, or just not doing my job? What about if I was putting customers money in my pocket vs. the cash register...for one offence I should be fired, the other I should be prosecuted for breaking a law.

There would be some supreme irony if she did swear an oath, on a bible, that she will uphold the duties of her office though. If that is the case, definitely should have resigned.

Post: #25

I don't understand how people don't consider this to be civil disobedience.

Quote:Civil disobedience is the active, professed refusal to obey certain laws, demands, and commands of a government, or of an occupying international power.

Riddle me this: if she was The State, who sent her to jail?