Post: #1

The Washington Post has been amazingly deceptive and disingenuous the last few months, even going so far as to help create a fabricated story alleging that a female reporter was manhandled by a member of Trump's staff. However, a couple of weeks ago the paper published an article by a female obstetrician that almost completely destroys the feminist narrative that women can "have it all" with career and childbirth. Anytime you see or hear a woman try to claim that it's ok for women to "wait" until their mid-to-late 30s to start having babies, show her this article. The article is here.

Quote:I’m a high-risk-pregnancy expert. So why didn’t I worry about my own fertility? By Shannon M. Clark February 26, 2016

Dr. Shannon M. Clark is a maternal-fetal medicine specialist at the University of Texas Medical Branch in Galveston, Tex., and founder of BabiesAfter35.com.

More women are having babies later in life, but the biological clock is still all too real.

The other day, I saw a new patient in my office. She was 39 years old, healthy, a successful career woman, pregnant for the first time — and scared to death. After trying for two years to conceive, she had finally done it. But instead of being thrilled, she was worried about the potential complications that come with being pregnant as an older first-time mom. After I answered all of her questions, the tension in the room dissipated, and she began to smile.
I understood her worry. I could sense her excitement and her guilt over having waited so long. She had married at 37 after spending years focused on her career, and she immediately started trying to have a child. She thought it would be easy to get pregnant, and she was truly surprised when it wasn’t. The attempt had strained her new marriage, so news of her pregnancy also brought anxiety.

I understood her because I am her. Only I may never be able to have a child.

As an obstetrician-gynecologist who specializes in the care of high-risk women, I see many patients who are older mothers and older first-time mothers; for several reasons, any pregnancy over the age of 35 — “advanced maternal age” — is automatically considered high-risk. But as a 42-year-old struggling with infertility, I can’t help but feel that the increasing number of women having babies later in life hides the reality of how difficult it can be. Forty-something childbearing may be more common today, but the biological clock is still very real.

Despite my years of training and work with expectant mothers, I never realized how hard it would be to conceive at this age. No matter why a woman has waited to have children or how healthy she is, her ovaries release fewer eggs and eggs of lower quality as she ages. The changes accelerate drastically by 37. Like many of my patients, I was healthy, educated, had traveled the world, and was finally ready to settle down and pursue the next phase of my life. But after two years of trying everything to become a mom, I now see that no matter what we hear about 40 being the new 30, fertility doesn’t work that way.

***
The average age of first-time mothers in the United States rose from 24.9 in 2000 to 26.3 in 2014, according to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention. While this is partially a result of a decline in births to teenage mothers, it’s also because the share of first births to women age 35 and over rose by 23 percent.

Older women’s reasons for waiting to start a family are varied and, in many cases, complex. Many have educational and career goals. Some women simply have not yet met the person they want to have children with. Some women have health conditions that need to be addressed or overcome before it’s safe for them to carry a fetus.

Although many of my patients have conceived naturally, even later in life, many owe their pregnancies to my colleagues in reproductive endocrinology and infertility and to treatments such as in vitro fertilization. (Many more women, like me, are still trying.) Advances have helped women of all ages have families. But fertility treatments aren’t just stressful; they’re also expensive ($12,400 per cycle, on average, according to the American Society for Reproductive Medicine) and time-consuming (between four and eight weeks per cycle).

According to the Society for Assisted Reproductive Technology, the success rate for IVF is 40 percent in women younger than 35. But for women between 35 and 37, it drops to 31 percent; to 21 percent for women between 38 and 40; 11 percent for 41- and 42-year-olds; and less than 5 percent for women 42 and older. This does not take into account the number of IVF cycles each woman undergoes. So while IVF is an option, it hardly guarantees you’ll have a baby.

Those are just the official stats. Here’s how things looked for me: one miscarriage, two hysteroscopies, five cycles of IVF, one embryo transfer with my own eggs and one embryo transfer with donor eggs.

I had a perfectly good reason to delay childbearing, one that would seem familiar to many of my patients: I was focused on my career. My sister and I were the first in our family to graduate from high school and the first to go to college. I just kept going. My medical degree and specialty added 11 more years to my training, and I simply didn’t allow myself much time for meeting a partner. I convinced myself that my career would be enough; my career would be my child. That all changed when I was 38 years old and my now-husband walked into the room. I don’t regret my decisions, and I am grateful for a job I’m passionate about. I’m glad I waited to find my soul mate. I just never anticipated the sacrifice it would require.

When I married at age 39, I knew that time wasn’t on my side. But even with my extensive medical training, I didn’t truly grasp how difficult it would be. If I couldn’t get pregnant naturally, I told myself, I’d have IVF to fall back on — I didn’t know those statistics. After I got pregnant naturally and miscarried in late 2013, I panicked. I was turning 40, and I finally realized that I was not going to be like my patients who had beaten the odds and naturally conceived. I was going to need help. Since then, I have tried every form of fertility treatment available to me.

Out of five cycles of IVF that produced 16 embryos, I had only one genetically normal embryo, and its transfer was not successful. I tried using two donor eggs from a younger woman, but this transfer, too, was unsuccessful. That was the most devastating loss of all.

I suppose I was in a bit of denial: I am an obstetrician, for goodness’ sake. I should have known better, and perhaps somewhere deep inside, I did. But I had taken care of many women who had successful pregnancies later in life, naturally or through fertility treatments, and I just assumed I’d be one of them. I was used to achieving my goals. Why would I fail at this?

The most surprising thing is that the pain I’ve felt hasn’t lessened my commitment to my patients. If anything, I better understand the elation they feel when they welcome a child into the world. I also grasp the overwhelming sense of loss when they lose a pregnancy. But I don’t share my own disappointments with grieving patients: My job is about them, not about me and what I am going through. As a physician, I have to be able to tuck my personal pain away so I can be fully present. I can only hope they feel my sincerity and caring when I am with them during the happiest, and sometimes most devastating, time of their lives.

Sometimes, though, it is hard: There is no escape. I am surrounded by pregnant bellies every day. I don’t get a reprieve from the thing that is causing me so much hurt. My feelings of loss sometimes creep in when I am seeing a pregnant patient or delivering a baby, and I have to find a way to close that part of my brain off — but without becoming numb to what has given me so much joy throughout my career. I am an excellent doctor. I refuse to let infertility take that away from me.

I want to be pregnant. I want to feel a growing being inside me. I want to feel the kicks, have the ultrasounds, see my body change and experience all the things my patients experience. I want to be on the other side; I want to be the pregnant patient and not just the doctor. But while I may not experience the basic human endeavor that is childbirth, I still have options. I have three donor embryos left, and surrogacy and adoption are alternatives. My journey is not yet over.

A child is a miracle. No one knows better than I just how true that statement is. Yet I urge women delaying childbearing for any reason to look beyond the headlines about maternal age. Yes, there are many women who get pregnant naturally later in life, and yes, there are many options for becoming pregnant through fertility treatments. But women need to be mindful that there is no guarantee. I never thought I would be a statistic, and I caution women on my path never to assume that their journey toward a family will be seamless. If having children is in your master plan, please consider your options early.

Post: #2

I guess I should feel pity for this woman, but I simply don't.
She knew the stats and thought she wasn't concerned, being a special snowflake.
Well, she isn't after all.

Next phase of her life : crazy cat lady.

Post: #3

So thats why so many older ladies love it raw dog. Well, either I'm infertile or they are.

Post: #4

Haha read the comment section. It's still not the women's fault. It's societies fault for not creating an atmosphere where she can have children AND have her high powered career. These people cannot be saved. Of that i'm convinced.

Post: #5

(03-14-2016 12:43 PM)zigZag Wrote:  Haha read the comment section. It's still not the women's fault. It's societies fault for not creating an atmosphere where she can have children AND have her high powered career. These people cannot be saved. Of that i'm convinced.

I noticed that also. Quite a bit of hamsterization going on in that comment section.

Post: #6

Biology. Always. Wins.

Post: #7

I feel sorry for her: women are peddled this lie that they can have great travels, great careers, then settle down whenever they feel like it and have a family. We have to realise that women are designed to be herd creatures, and so are more susceptible to peer pressure and MSM messages. When I first met my wife she said the same thing: she doesn't want to get married until 35, she wants a great career and to travel, etc...well, once her instincts kicked in that went out of the window, but perhaps it takes the presence of a man worth mating with and a comfortable nest to trigger that instinct in a safe (not baby-rabies) way.

I'm not saying that it isn't her fault, I'm just saying that I have sympathy. I have several female friends of a certain age, all of whom tried to have it all and then have children, and all failed. One made a lot of money, but still breaks down in tears because she never had children despite her Iron Lady persona. The others just bumbled along in their pointless drone jobs waiting for Mr Big to rescue them until they got old and had to settle for whatever men were left, along with their barren wombs. It must be horribly painful for women knowing that they have failed in their biological imperative given how easy it is for them to have a family, both biologically and culturally. All they have to do is filter out the players, find a man who will stick around and get breeding.

When you're in a high pressure, long hours career like a doctor, years just fly by. She just woke up one day and reality hit her in the face like a frying pan. Like I said, it totally IS her own fault, but given that I can see how much it hurts my barren female friends I do feel sorry for her.

On the upside, if she does adopt a daughter at least she'll be able to teach her this lesson.

Post: #8

I read this article somewhere else on the forum, I just can't remember where. I don't think it had it's own thread, but the thread was about this.

Post: #9

Rationale Male covered this along time ago.

Post: #10

(03-14-2016 03:47 PM)Matsufubu Wrote:  I feel sorry for her: women are peddled this lie that they can have great travels, great careers, then settle down whenever they feel like it and have a family. We have to realise that women are designed to be herd creatures, and so are more susceptible to peer pressure and MSM messages. When I first met my wife she said the same thing: she doesn't want to get married until 35, she wants a great career and to travel, etc...well, once her instincts kicked in that went out of the window, but perhaps it takes the presence of a man worth mating with and a comfortable nest to trigger that instinct in a safe (not baby-rabies) way.

I'm not saying that it isn't her fault, I'm just saying that I have sympathy. I have several female friends of a certain age, all of whom tried to have it all and then have children, and all failed. One made a lot of money, but still breaks down in tears because she never had children despite her Iron Lady persona. The others just bumbled along in their pointless drone jobs waiting for Mr Big to rescue them until they got old and had to settle for whatever men were left, along with their barren wombs. It must be horribly painful for women knowing that they have failed in their biological imperative given how easy it is for them to have a family, both biologically and culturally. All they have to do is filter out the players, find a man who will stick around and get breeding.

When you're in a high pressure, long hours career like a doctor, years just fly by. She just woke up one day and reality hit her in the face like a frying pan. Like I said, it totally IS her own fault, but given that I can see how much it hurts my barren female friends I do feel sorry for her.

On the upside, if she does adopt a daughter at least she'll be able to teach her this lesson.

I'm ambivalent about this, I agree with you, I also feel sorry for these women that think they can have it all and then realize too late they can't, but at the same time I feel like it serves them right and they're getting what they deserve.

Yes, Nature always wins in the end.

Post: #11

(03-14-2016 12:43 PM)zigZag Wrote:  Haha read the comment section. It's still not the women's fault. It's societies fault for not creating an atmosphere where she can have children AND have her high powered career. These people cannot be saved. Of that i'm convinced.

What they're subconsciously admitting is that feminism, as it is popularly peddled, cannot exist without everyone else in society quietly straining and sacrificing to hold up this giant lie that women can do everything men can do.

Post: #12

The average age of first time mothers in the US is 26? Damn. Here in the northeast, 90% of the mid-late 20's women I know laugh at the idea of settling down and getting married, let alone having kids. It must be proles in the south and midwest bringing down the average. I'd bet if you restricted that statistic to those with a degree, the average age would be well north of 30.

Post: #13

Don't feel sorry for these women; they lied to themselves because they would rather live their "perfect" lives than adjust to the truth.

Post: #14

(03-14-2016 04:49 PM)Teutatis Wrote:  I'm ambivalent about this, I agree with you, I also feel sorry for these women that think they can have it all and then realize too late they can't, but at the same time I feel like it serves them right and they're getting what they deserve.

Yes, Nature always wins in the end.

I know, and if it were a man penning an article about spending his life chasing his career, drinking and going on holiday the whole world would be "So what, buddy? You made your choices and they were bad ones, STFU". Women, however, are not held to the same standard - they are expected to get what they want, when they want, and if failure in any department looms then a 'Real Man' (or government more likely) will step in to save the day. It's bullshit, but it's what they've been brought up with and all they've ever known.

Post: #15

Quote:Mother Nature is a bitch & Father Time has an undefeated record

- Emancipator's signature

Post: #16

She minimized the problem.

She didn't talk about the life-destroying dangers of having a child later. I know at least 4 women who have had seriously handicapped children simply because they were too old to bear the child.

Career women often work wayyyy too long into the pregnancy. They ignore their husbands and they ignore their own doctors. Then they have fucking problems in the fucking delivery and the baby is damaged. Sometimes in horrible ways.

Then they utterly deny their own responsibility.

Post: #17

(03-14-2016 04:53 PM)SirTimothy Wrote:  

(03-14-2016 12:43 PM)zigZag Wrote:  Haha read the comment section. It's still not the women's fault. It's societies fault for not creating an atmosphere where she can have children AND have her high powered career. These people cannot be saved. Of that i'm convinced.

What they're subconsciously admitting is that feminism, as it is popularly peddled, cannot exist without everyone else in society quietly straining and sacrificing to hold up this giant lie that women can do everything men can do.

Yes but you have to realize that when feminists talk about "equality" they don't really mean equal options. They mean equal results... except where women had an advantage (being courted, not having to pay, not having to join the military..etc). When you look through that lens then everything said in the comment makes perfect sense.

Equality to a feminist is society bending and shaping so that all women always have the favorable results that they perceive men have. Hence why you see gender quotas being talked about in managerial positions but not in construction, trash collecting..etc. And military service jobs being open to all women but men still have to sign up for selective service.

If at anytime a woman achieves an unfavorable result. It's because society still hasn't reached the proper equality level yet.

Post: #18

The hamster is so strong that even a woman educated to be a specialist doctor of maternal fertility is still ignorant about her own biological reality.

I'm actually rather impressed by her achieving this incredible level of stupidity.

Post: #19

I knew it was true cause i hear from women at 30 how hard it becomes! Of course they wouldn't publish something like this on front page cause they want women to be slaves to the work force!

Post: #20

I wonder how many times per month these aspiring cat ladies actually get fucked? Because I can look at a woman who claims to have fertility issues, and 9 times out of 10, I can tell that these women do the bare minimum amount of fucking. They dole out pussy, like they're doling out emergency rations on a life raft, and then wonder why they can't get knocked up.

Prime example is that rotten bitch Kate Gosselin from the reality show with the herd of kids. She's such a shrill, frigid bitch that she started IVF in her late 20s so she could avoid fucking her husband.

Post: #21

Biology: 1
Feminism: 0

Post: #22

had traveled the world - ya that matters to pregnancy.

Post: #23

Interesting however to observe how the troubles of late pregnancy are mummed by media.
I did notice how many women approaching or hitting the 30 wall alread start developing a certain axiety when kids arent there and the cock caarrousel grooves start becoming more and more visible

Post: #24

Some useful charts to complement the article:

Post: #25

I have no sympathy. If she's smart enough to be an excellent doctor, she's smart enough to know that her decision and the decisions of many women to focus on their careers instead of building a strong family are bad for society.

Of course, she's only coming to terms with her poor decisions because there is something she wants that she can't have, but her decisions have consequences that go far beyond that.

Fuck her.