Post: #1

I'm 25 and I've been banging this 19 year old since two months. Met her from daygame and banged on 3rd date. After first sex I took her to before party to my friends palce, then we partied together and banged again. So this set the frame from the beginning as something more than casual fuckbuddy. Maybe it was to soon, but I wanted to keep her so I took her out.

I've been meeting her once a week or once two weeks. For me this girl is a type of "cool chick that you meet once a year, there is a great chemistry and you really hit it off". She has some red flags and she's 19 so I kept it casual. For example after second bang session I've seen her with some dude in the street, guy was her age so probly an orbiter but who knows. Also once she told me that she's visiting her ex-boyfriend. I was like whatever because I'm banging another chick and I have 2 other booty-calls just in case. So basically I'm assuming she's a slut and that she's banging on the side.

I've took her to 2 electronic festivals, we've been poping E together, parting together then fucking each other brains out. In terms of sex she was a bit cold in the beginning and didn't want to give blowjob. She told me that she does it only if she loves someone or if it's a boyfriend. I LOLd. Next time we met she got a bit drunk and she was sucking me like there is no tommorow and I started fucking her in the face. After that she's blowing me no problem. She like it rough, but it seems noone before was fucking her good enough so she keeps coming for more. She likes when I fuck her face, give her facials, she likes licking my balls, dirty talk etc. Basically she's fucking like a pornstar. She's cumming with me multiple times, I give her squirting orgasms etc. Sex is mindblowing.

Last week we met again and after sex I started talking things like "I really think I'm falling for you", "I don't remember when I felt like that", "I'm opening up with you" etc. It was for shit and giggles and I was saying that with a smirk. She knew I was doing it for fun on the logical level, but on the emotional level it hit her. After that she become much warmer to me. I wanted to hook her harder.

Few days later she texted me that she bought new lingerie and that she wants to meet on friday. I told her that I can't on friday (was going out gaming) and that she can come on thursday. She accused me that I'm meeting other girl and that I should change plans and meet with her instead, I said no and she eventually said ok to thursday. I didn't reaffirm on thursday, because I assumed that she will come as always, but she flaked. She texted some bullshit excuse, told me not to be mad and that we'll meet another time.

So I see it as stupid power play. It looks like she started to catch feeling or losing ground and she wanted to get some power back. I think I might look like a bit to player to her and she might be afraid that she's liking me too much.

Now how do I proceed from here? Should I text her more and give her more comfort or should I be more cold because of her flake?

Ideally I would like to:
-Keep banging her more (obviously)
-Sometimes going out with her (I don't know if that is good and if reducing it to only sex would be better)
-Not to get burned in the process

Post: #2

From over here it sounds like she's falling for you and you're not doing anything to keep her on the level, i.e. you're making her think things that aren't true.

I'd say that if you keep going the way you're going, you're gonna either break her heart (her heart doesn't care if she's a slut, it thinks she deserves a knight in shining armor anyway) or she's gonna find out you cheated on her and it's gonna blow up.

Post: #3

have you had the what are we talk yet? thats when you lay the law down.
till then y'all or are just fucking and neither of you has the right to really get after each other on commitments.

She's testing your frame to see if you're going to change how you act if she acts out.
Solutions:
1) business as usual--shows solid frame unfazed by her horse shit
2) stern repremand--better if its done while you have sex. Fuck the shit out of her and make her apologize while you do it

She's 19, thats a teenager. How serious would you take a 13 year old?

Post: #4

(12-12-2016 08:31 AM)ginatingles Wrote:  I'm 25 and I've been banging this 19 year old since two months. Met her from daygame and banged on 3rd date. After first sex I took her to before party to my friends palce, then we partied together and banged again. So this set the frame from the beginning as something more than casual fuckbuddy. Maybe it was to soon, but I wanted to keep her so I took her out.

Big mistakes made here - you're strutting her around like she's your girl around your friends - you even said you wanted to keep her.

She isn't your fuck buddy at this point, she's your default girlfriend.

You've that pussy on a pedestal and you've got a little scarcity in you.

Quote:I've been meeting her once a week or once two weeks. For me this girl is a type of "cool chick that you meet once a year, there is a great chemistry and you really hit it off". She has some red flags and she's 19 so I kept it casual. For example after second bang session I've seen her with some dude in the street, guy was her age so probly an orbiter but who knows. Also once she told me that she's visiting her ex-boyfriend. I was like whatever because I'm banging another chick and I have 2 other booty-calls just in case. So basically I'm assuming she's a slut and that she's banging on the side.

That's good you've kept her distant and don't hangout with her that much.

She was probably shit testing you about the ex BF expecting you to get all angry and jealous - which is good you just ignored that.

You assume that she's fucking other dudes, that's good.

Quote:I've took her to 2 electronic festivals, we've been poping E together, parting together then fucking each other brains out. In terms of sex she was a bit cold in the beginning and didn't want to give blowjob. She told me that she does it only if she loves someone or if it's a boyfriend. I LOLd. Next time we met she got a bit drunk and she was sucking me like there is no tommorow and I started fucking her in the face. After that she's blowing me no problem. She like it rough, but it seems noone before was fucking her good enough so she keeps coming for more. She likes when I fuck her face, give her facials, she likes licking my balls, dirty talk etc. Basically she's fucking like a pornstar. She's cumming with me multiple times, I give her squirting orgasms etc. Sex is mindblowing.

She obviously likes you, that's pretty clear, and you guys explored sexually together. You're taking her places to yeah, default girlfriend.

Quote:Last week we met again and after sex I started talking things like "I really think I'm falling for you", "I don't remember when I felt like that", "I'm opening up with you" etc. It was for shit and giggles and I was saying that with a smirk. She knew I was doing it for fun on the logical level, but on the emotional level it hit her. After that she become much warmer to me. I wanted to hook her harder.

You might be joking, but in every joke lies a little truth and I think part of you actually likes her and enjoy being with her. You telling her this is feeding in to the girlfriend mindset for her.

Quote:Few days later she texted me that she bought new lingerie and that she wants to meet on friday. I told her that I can't on friday (was going out gaming) and that she can come on thursday. She accused me that I'm meeting other girl and that I should change plans and meet with her instead, I said no and she eventually said ok to thursday. I didn't reaffirm on thursday, because I assumed that she will come as always, but she flaked. She texted some bullshit excuse, told me not to be mad and that we'll meet another time.

She's trying to hook you, then got mad about you not being free friday.

Once again, very clear she likes you, but you kept frame which is good.

BUT she did flake - once again testing your frame - I would've gone silent till she reached out again to me.

Quote:So I see it as stupid power play. It looks like she started to catch feeling or losing ground and she wanted to get some power back. I think I might look like a bit to player to her and she might be afraid that she's liking me too much.

You see it EXACTLY for what its for, she likes you alot, and is trying to lock you down.

Quote:Now how do I proceed from here? Should I text her more and give her more comfort or should I be more cold because of her flake?

Ideally I would like to:
-Keep banging her more (obviously)
-Sometimes going out with her (I don't know if that is good and if reducing it to only sex would be better)
-Not to get burned in the process

[/quote]

This isn't going to end well - I would know since I dumped 2 mini LTR's WHILE I had a main LTR.

All I did was fuck both girls, I never took one out, the other I took out once or twice.

Both caught feelings hard, both I ended things with.

You need to asked yourself a few things:

How much are you willing to invest into this chick ?
Do you even really like her as much as she does you ?
Do you want to take things to the next level ?

It's clear she's opened up to you, especially sexually, and she likes you alot.

Thing is, this started with the fuck buddy system, then as always, one side catches feelings more than the other.

From what I'm reading from you - it seems you don't want to put in that much effort and want to keep things the way they are.

You can do this for only so long until it reaches a dramatic breaking point and she gets pissed.

This shit happened to me and one of the girls got super upset and heartbroken.

Then comes the "what are we talk" which should NOT be initiated by you, but by her.


Experience wise, I'd cut her off, and move on.

The sex may be great, she might be good, but you don't want a relationship, and she obviously does.

Better to rip off the bandaid now then to peel off the bandaid slowly.

Post: #5

(12-12-2016 08:31 AM)ginatingles Wrote:  Last week we met again and after sex I started talking things like "I really think I'm falling for you", "I don't remember when I felt like that", "I'm opening up with you" etc. It was for shit and giggles and I was saying that with a smirk. She knew I was doing it for fun on the logical level, but on the emotional level it hit her. After that she become much warmer to me. I wanted to hook her harder.

Here you have officially started foreplay to relationship. You're right it hit her. She's viewing you differently now because of this exact moment. Well not only because of your 'opening up' scene but this moment officially cemented your previous experiences. she's something more than a random fuckbuddy to you. This is why she feels ENTITLED to demand your time. She's trying to take advantage of it. When she is denied she starts playing mind/power games by flaking to 'punish' you, by guilting you into it, by manipulating you. She feels that NOW she CAN do shit like this.

You have to show her that she can't.

(12-12-2016 08:31 AM)ginatingles Wrote:  Now how do I proceed from here? Should I text her more and give her more comfort or should I be more cold because of her flake?

Ideally I would like to:
-Keep banging her more (obviously)
-Sometimes going out with her (I don't know if that is good and if reducing it to only sex would be better)
-Not to get burned in the process

You gotta act like you don't care. I know you care haha cause mindblowing sex is very appealing and you're already missing it. But act as if. Just be cool bro. Act normal like nothing happened. Like she couldn't meet you on Thursday cause her grandma was sick. Zero fucks given.

That will hit her even harder

Then just contact her the same way you did before. Very casually. That will get her mind racing. You will probably try to make you react to her flaking. She might say stuff like "didn't you miss me?" or "didn;t you care?". If she does you brush it off saying something like "you were just busy with something no big deal, anyway [change topic]". She might persist with it. Whatever she does DO NOT GET CAUGHT UP IN IT. Dodge it and act casual. Of she crosses the line tell her "girl chill out.. you're acting weird now.. i see what you're doing, you're just trying to guilt me into something now, that's lame.." and cut off your attention. If she confronts you over the phone say you gotta go. If she does it face to face you can leave cause "you don't wanna waste time for some bullshit manipulation".

Simple stuff like this should work.

You can also try "drama" route which is much more intense and will impact her much stronger but that's emotionally tiring and takes more time in general.

Post: #6

Yep, this is actually mLTR situation. Winter is coming so I'd like to keep her for at least 2 more months because I won't be gaming a lot then. I like this chick a lot, but investing in her is not a great idea since she's 19 and I don't want anything serious in the long run.

We didn't have the talk yet. How to handle that?

Also, how do I repremand her without looking butthurt?

Post: #7

My experience on this issue is 2 girls that were my consistent fuck buddies for over 2 years each.

For me to make the game run that long during the "what are we talks" I said:

"I like you and think you are really cool to hang out with"

"I don't want a relationship with anybody right now because I don't know where my life is going and that isn't fair to anyone. It's not like I am going to go have another girl as my girlfriend next week, I don't want any relationship at this time in my life."

"Look your life is constantly changing too, you won't know where you want to be a year from now..."

Those 3 points tie in a few things:

- She feels she is more than a piece of ass and has a bond to you that you like her for her personality and coolness, not just sex (their biggest fear once they like you a little bit and any long term fuck buddy will like you as a person) --- this is a big hook with girls
- You save her feelings by saying it isn't you turning down her personally it is you turning down relationships in general
- You point out reasons why it isn't smart for either of you to get into anything when your life directions could be changing (this is often the key manufactured part that keeps her around to see if she can change your life trajectory to include her)

This has worked for me. I have had to go through a few crying and tears sessions with each usually spread 6-9 months apart about why can't we be more?

If you can stomach those you can go for awhile. In my case over 2 years each. What saves you in this arguments is your upfront honesty about what you wanted from the beginning. Girls have a strange affinity for red pill dating rules and they have even agreed "yeah I know you told me you didn't want anything --- I don't know why I am saying this to you". These girls were both attractive college girls and had options too.

You will have to accept though in this arrangement for them to keep going they need a sense of detachment which is usually other guys.

They will mention things like:

"Oh I was hanging out with my buddy (other guy fucking or trying to fuck them) the other night we got drunk on wine at my house"

"I went to concert with a friend..."

"I saw my ex the other week..."

This stuff you need to absolutely not care, I believe it is necessary evil as you give her the room to vent that she isn't getting what she wants and she fools herself into feeling "even" with you. Though if you hold frame they always crumble in the end and forcibly cut you off as realize they have no shot at winning the long game, and even their orbiters are getting sick and tired of her crying on their shoulders about you and stop answering her texts.

It takes a bit to stomach. I haven't cared though during some of the accusation and tear sessions because both girls had on and off streaks of promiscuity, guy friends constantly trying to fuck them etc... so for me it was more - if I didn't with this girl someone else would sort of thing. I also saw how badly they treated some of their orbiters so no fucks given. They were manipulating me just in a different direction than the poor orbiters.

If you want to witness truly amazing frame steal a girl's phone with many orbiters. See the orbiters whine about how badly the girl treats them like shit while still caving in and doing favors for her anyways. Purposely toying at a serious emotional level. Deeply sociopathic behavior. Much much worse than me having them over for fun laughs and great sex. I think the shit is dark, other guys say "that's life".

Post: #8

(12-13-2016 06:23 PM)Travesty Wrote:  My experience on this issue is 2 girls that were my consistent fuck buddies for over 2 years each.

For me to make the game run that long during the "what are we talks" I said:

"I like you and think you are really cool to hang out with"

"I don't want a relationship with anybody right now because I don't know where my life is going and that isn't fair to anyone. It's not like I am going to go have another girl as my girlfriend next week, I don't want any relationship at this time in my life."

"Look your life is constantly changing too, you won't know where you want to be a year from now..."

Those 3 points tie in a few things:

- She feels she is more than a piece of ass and has a bond to you that you like her for her personality and coolness, not just sex (their biggest fear once they like you a little bit and any long term fuck buddy will like you as a person) --- this is a big hook with girls
- You save her feelings by saying it isn't you turning down her personally it is you turning down relationships in general
- You point out reasons why it isn't smart for either of you to get into anything when your life directions could be changing (this is often the key manufactured part that keeps her around to see if she can change your life trajectory to include her)

This has worked for me. I have had to go through a few crying and tears sessions with each usually spread 6-9 months apart about why can't we be more?

If you can stomach those you can go for awhile. In my case over 2 years each. What saves you in this arguments is your upfront honesty about what you wanted from the beginning. Girls have a strange affinity for red pill dating rules and they have even agreed "yeah I know you told me you didn't want anything --- I don't know why I am saying this to you". These girls were both attractive college girls and had options too.

You will have to accept though in this arrangement for them to keep going they need a sense of detachment which is usually other guys.

They will mention things like:

"Oh I was hanging out with my buddy (other guy fucking or trying to fuck them) the other night we got drunk on wine at my house"

"I went to concert with a friend..."

"I saw my ex the other week..."

This stuff you need to absolutely not care, I believe it is necessary evil as you give her the room to vent that she isn't getting what she wants and she fools herself into feeling "even" with you. Though if you hold frame they always crumble in the end and forcibly cut you off as realize they have no shot at winning the long game, and even their orbiters are getting sick and tired of her crying on their shoulders about you and stop answering her texts.

It takes a bit to stomach. I haven't cared though during some of the accusation and tear sessions because both girls had on and off streaks of promiscuity, guy friends constantly trying to fuck them etc... so for me it was more - if I didn't with this girl someone else would sort of thing. I also saw how badly they treated some of their orbiters so no fucks given. They were manipulating me just in a different direction than the poor orbiters.

If you want to witness truly amazing frame steal a girl's phone with many orbiters. See the orbiters whine about how badly the girl treats them like shit while still caving in and doing favors for her anyways. Purposely toying at a serious emotional level. Deeply sociopathic behavior. Much much worse than me having them over for fun laughs and great sex. I think the shit is dark, other guys say "that's life".

It's eerie how close this was to how I managed to maintain both my MLTRs to girls who would've gladly jumped at the opportunity to be more, but were satisfied with being what I could (and explicitly) offer. Yes, plausible deniability was necessary, but really not much of it. They would practically thank me for being clear with them from the beginning but in the same breath wish for more.

Women especially, but people in general are in awe and will respect someone who holds frame and is brutally honest. Most people are too scared to be completely honest. I don't profess to have mastery at it, but it's incredible how true it is.