Post: #1

I broker and buy heavy equipment for a living.I am 27 years old and was employed for a while, now I am trying to cut it on my own. I've had deals that did not go to well, but never have they been this bad....

So I bought 2 backhoes. We agreed on price with the seller. On this particular deal, I had agreed on a finders fee with the buyer, So he sends the wire transfer to the seller. About 3 weeks later, we send in a truck, get them loaded and we are on our way. Very simple and straight forward. It was a good deal, my customer was very happy. It just so happened, he had a third backhoe, and at a good price. When loading the first 2 machines, we did see a 3rd machine on the yard, so that all added up. Anyways, we send a wire transfer for the third one. He was a week late in confirming that they received a wire transfer, but he did confirm. This time around, we had a hard time finding a truck to pick it up, but by week 3 after sending the wire, sent in a truck. The company that owned the backhoe ( the seller was a broker and he did not own the machine ) said they hadn't been paid for yet. Uh oh! My seller says he hit a "snag" and something went wrong, but that he would get it taken care of ASAP. Fast forward 5 weeks and we still don't have our machine...

There is much more to all of this, but this is the about it. Before buying the machine I was given very credible references from the seller, so everything seemed fine. What is a man to do in this situation? Any suggestions? If you have particular questions about everything, I would be happy to answer them.

Post: #2

Is your country of residence Mexico?

That's going to be a big bit of information on how to proceed next.

Post: #3

A lawyer in your jurisdiction would be far more qualified to assist you than a bunch of largely anonymous people on an Internet forum.

Post: #4

(06-04-2017 07:41 AM)Suits Wrote:  A lawyer in your jurisdiction would be far more qualified to assist you than a bunch of largely anonymous people on an Internet forum.

But it is so much fun to play "I am an anonymous lawyer on the internet."

Post: #5

When I worked at a physical trading firm we sometimes had hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of materials stopped at customs.

One time the coast guard siezed our goods and we had to call all the way up to the top to figure what was going on. Turns out they were searching for drugs, but of course found nothing.

Stuff like that happened all the time.

In this situation call both parties and ensure that there was no mix up (both your broker and the company that has the backhoe). Maybe call the bank to see if you can see where the money is now. And then grab a lawyer at that point.

Post: #6

Have a lawyer send a demand letter. Money back or full performance within X days. Usually 7-15. Lot of people scam deposits. I.e. collect deposits and run. Hopefully this isn't a case of that as many of the full time scammers are very difficult to collect off of. That's my general course of action here in Canada.

Post: #7

Sounds like you need better business systems in place to be concrete about the steps and purchase etc.

Signed documents, bulletproof funds acknowledgment etc.

If you set up and run properly, you can never get left holding the baby without legal redress.

Post: #8

I do reside in Mexico.

Just so you are more aware of what's going on, here is more information. I initially found these machines myself. They are owned by a large construction company that has 100's if not 1000's of equipment in there fleet. In the beginning I talked to there equipment manager to see if I could buy them from him, but this broker I bought them from beat me to the punch. He said I would have to buy the machines from them. Sounded like they were working on numerous deals. This broker ended up buying quite a few machines and flipping them to his customers. I have a verbal agreement that if the broker buys another machine and sends funds to there account, those funds will go towards my machine. So I do know where the machine is, I know who owns it, and I do have an agreement with them so things could definitely be worse.

The company I used to work for was scammed on one occasion where the FBI contacted me. It never even went to court, from what I know anyways. I am going to contact some more people that might have some leverage in this situation. and will have to get a demand letter sent to them.

These guys have been in business for a while, and from what I understood from asking around, they weren't always shady like this. Not sure what happened exactly. I also know that they want to continue doing business with other people, this amount of money isn't worth screwing up there credibility for. I know A LOT of people in the construction selling business, and word can spread quickly. I need to approach them correctly with this, but I will let them know that everyone will know that he is misleading and scamming customers... wish me luck.

Post: #9

Why not use commercial letters of credit or escrow to conduct business with dubious countries? Sending money up front sounds like a hella dodgy idea, no matter even if the customer is AAA+++ rated. Once he has the full sum, what possible incentive does he have to try his best to complete his end of the deal?

Quote:I have a verbal agreement that...

Bro, when have verbal agreements ever been worth anything?

Post: #10

The deal was done with an American company, in Missouri. Like I mentioned earlier, when word spreads that he is shady, no one will want to buy from him anymore. In this business that's a big enough of an incentive.

Post: #11

It would be good to transform this thread into a testimony of failed business ventures that RVF have been through, to learn from their mistakes and also for people to reflect on them. This might be also good for the Business Owner's lounge, but a seperate focused thread is worthwhile. I'll post something with my own bad experiences in a few days...

Post: #12

The problem is you don't know what you are doing. PM me.

Post: #13

PM recd thanks,
We will get to the bottom of this.

Post: #14

After 3 months, I finally got this resolved. In hindsight, I know this could have been avoided and definitely could have been resolved quicker. Some rookies mistakes with to much risk. Mistakes are only useful if you learn from them, so I have definitely learned some lessons.

Here are some things to take into consideration when making a deal ( In no particular order, just some thoughts and observations). In this case, I was buying a machine from a heavy equipment broker.

1. Make sure you have control when making the deal. At no point should you be at there mercy

2. Go with your gut. I never felt 100% when making the deal, because there were always these little things bothering me.
When talking with them over the phone, I didn´t always get clear answers. Long pauses when I was waiting for an answer
from him.

3. Checking with the references they gave you, and them telling you that they are great people and easy to deal with,
doesn´t mean your deal with them will go smoothly, or that they are not crooks. Good references doesn´t guarantee
anything.

So the deal went South, what to do....


1. Take control of the situation. After some time, they just didn´t take me seriously anymore. Almost 3 months had passed,
and all I ways doing was asking for them to send me my money back. I remembered a skip tracer / investigator I had
worked with in the past. I called her up, sent her the information and within a day I got a call from the broker saying that
I could pick up the machine a week later. Sure enough, yesterday morning I got a text from the construction company
saying that the machine had been paid for.

2. Keep things simple. Sometimes things are simpler that they seem and often one stresses over these things way more then
one should

3. Be persistent. Things are not going to work themselves out. Be creative and don´t give up.

4. Get help. Let´s face it, we´re not good at everything. This is where all those contacts and networking come in handy

Post: #15

Quote:RE: Business deals gone wrong!

I feel you man, I'm still waiting on my 500k from King Abdul Jahheed of Nigeria.

Post: #16

Thanks for reporting back, OP.

Post: #17

(07-20-2017 05:18 PM)re33603 Wrote:  1. Take control of the situation. After some time, they just didn´t take me seriously anymore. Almost 3 months had passed,
and all I ways doing was asking for them to send me my money back. I remembered a skip tracer / investigator I had
worked with in the past. I called her up, sent her the information and within a day I got a call from the broker saying that
I could pick up the machine a week later. Sure enough, yesterday morning I got a text from the construction company
saying that the machine had been paid for.

Could you expand upon this? What sort of pressure was she able to put on him to get it resolved so quickly? Normally by this point in a scam he wouldn't have the money to pay for the machine anyhow.

Post: #18

(07-20-2017 05:18 PM)re33603 Wrote:  After 3 months, I finally got this resolved. In hindsight, I know this could have been avoided and definitely could have been resolved quicker. Some rookies mistakes with to much risk. Mistakes are only useful if you learn from them, so I have definitely learned some lessons.

Here are some things to take into consideration when making a deal ( In no particular order, just some thoughts and observations). In this case, I was buying a machine from a heavy equipment broker.

1. Make sure you have control when making the deal. At no point should you be at there mercy

2. Go with your gut. I never felt 100% when making the deal, because there were always these little things bothering me.
When talking with them over the phone, I didn´t always get clear answers. Long pauses when I was waiting for an answer
from him.

3. Checking with the references they gave you, and them telling you that they are great people and easy to deal with,
doesn´t mean your deal with them will go smoothly, or that they are not crooks. Good references doesn´t guarantee
anything.

So the deal went South, what to do....


1. Take control of the situation. After some time, they just didn´t take me seriously anymore. Almost 3 months had passed,
and all I ways doing was asking for them to send me my money back. I remembered a skip tracer / investigator I had
worked with in the past. I called her up, sent her the information and within a day I got a call from the broker saying that
I could pick up the machine a week later. Sure enough, yesterday morning I got a text from the construction company
saying that the machine had been paid for.

2. Keep things simple. Sometimes things are simpler that they seem and often one stresses over these things way more then
one should

3. Be persistent. Things are not going to work themselves out. Be creative and don´t give up.

4. Get help. Let´s face it, we´re not good at everything. This is where all those contacts and networking come in handy

Good feeling to be sitting here instead of that first post, right!

Post: #19

Awesome lessons learned from that deal. Thanks for sharing.

Post: #20

(07-21-2017 02:50 AM)roberto Wrote:  

(07-20-2017 05:18 PM)re33603 Wrote:  1. Take control of the situation. After some time, they just didn´t take me seriously anymore. Almost 3 months had passed,
and all I ways doing was asking for them to send me my money back. I remembered a skip tracer / investigator I had
worked with in the past. I called her up, sent her the information and within a day I got a call from the broker saying that
I could pick up the machine a week later. Sure enough, yesterday morning I got a text from the construction company
saying that the machine had been paid for.

Could you expand upon this? What sort of pressure was she able to put on him to get it resolved so quickly? Normally by this point in a scam he wouldn't have the money to pay for the machine anyhow.

To start, it wasn't the usual scam where they get you to send a wire transfer and cease all communication. They were shady business owners that took advantage of the situation. They just did not take me serious enough, and they new I had no control and little leverage. The investigator new the right things to say, and instead of giving them a week to return the money, she gave them a 12 hours. Where exactly they got the money from to eventually pay for the machine, I don't know and at this point don't really care. She is also known well enough in her line of work, that they took her seriously. Definitely should have contacted her sooner.