Post: #1

My father is getting a bit up there in age, he is 58 years old and he is a general contractor...he wakes up at 6AM to head to work and doesn't wrap up his day until 6PM....he is the hardest working guy I know and his body is starting to give out. I help him with jobs on the weekends but I have a 9-5 during the week and there is really only so much I can do.

His knees are giving him problems and I am curious if anyone on this forum has found remedies or solutions for this? I know the most basic advice is to "take it easy" and "not work as hard" but I might as well just smack myself in the head with a hammer because I have told him that about a million times and he doesn't want to hear it

Any help would be greatly appreciated, I think this is a great forum

Post: #2

(06-20-2018 01:30 PM)whatitdowhatitdoes Wrote:  My father is getting a bit up there in age, he is 58 years old and he is a general contractor...he wakes up at 6AM to head to work and doesn't wrap up his day until 6PM....he is the hardest working guy I know and his body is starting to give out. I help him with jobs on the weekends but I have a 9-5 during the week and there is really only so much I can do.

His knees are giving him problems and I am curious if anyone on this forum has found remedies or solutions for this? I know the most basic advice is to "take it easy" and "not work as hard" but I might as well just smack myself in the head with a hammer because I have told him that about a million times and he doesn't want to hear it

Any help would be greatly appreciated, I think this is a great forum

Collagen hydrolysate (CH) is a pretty well studied supplement for joint-tendon-bone issues. The constituent amino acids proline and glycine (mostly) are used as building blocks by stromal cells in order to synthesize various types of collagen fibers/fibrils. Collagen production is gradually reduced already from age 25. These amino acids are not present in most modern foods, unless you eat "nose-to-tail," which very few people do these days.

It`s important also to have a vitamin C rich diet (for many reasons including immune function) since vitamin C is required, or is "used up" in the production of collagen. Better to get this from foods such as yellow and red bell peppers, and various greens like spinach, collards etc. rather than poorly absorbed pills. (You also get so much more.)
I would in general recommend a Paleo-ish diet independent of the type of health issue, and just for longevity in general. Just a few of the studies on this subject;

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1107...;=activity
The study above proves that proline from CH supplementation accumulates in chondrocytes (cartilage cells) and improves collagen production.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18416885
Athletes with joint pain, improved.

PS: I use a brand called Great Lakes CH, seems to be the most popular out there and I`ve seen great results with it for some joint issues.

Post: #3

For muscle/meniscus pain: go to an Asian holistic medicine store and buy DMSO. Athletes use it for pain and it really works. I have used it and get pain relief within 1 minute. Buy the clearish green one on amazon, not the red colored label which is a white cream.

WORD OF WARNING: scientists are unclear on the toxicity of this substance, and it is a cream which is rubbed topically. My dad has always reminded me to use this only when absolutely necessary because it rapidly absorbed into the blood stream through the epidermis.

Post: #4

For muscle/meniscus pain: go to an Asian holistic medicine store and buy DMSO. Athletes use it for pain and it really works. I have used it and get pain relief within 1 minute. Buy the clearish green one on amazon, not the red colored label which is a white cream.

WORD OF WARNING: scientists are unclear on the toxicity of this substance, and it is a cream which is rubbed topically. My dad has always reminded me to use this only when absolutely necessary because it rapidly absorbed into the blood stream through the epidermis.

Post: #5

I'm answering this from a licensed physiotherapist's view.

What kind of contractor is he? Does he hunker down and stand on his knees alot for work?

With a physically demanding job, it's highly likely he has a certain level of osteoarthritis in his knees. It's a disease that affects the cartilage of the knees. The main purpose of cartilage is to act as shock absorbers and reduce friction between bones.

It's very common among carpenters, electricians and other physical trades. Knee osteoarthritis is the main diagnose I meet in my clinic among working male contractors between 45 to 65 years of age.

What he can do:

- Start a continual exercise program targeting lower-body power and strength, particularly quadriceps and hip power. When the cartilage starts to give out the muscles need to take up the slack of relieving the joints.

For power, use exercises like a knee extension machine or sit-to-stands where the quadriceps is a main mover. The concentric movement should be done as fast as possible, while the eccentric part should be 3-4 seconds long. Start with body weight and progress weights every 2 weeks, for example add a 10 pound weight plate for sit-to-stands. It's very important that the exercises are done explosively.

For strength the main difference is focusing on 2-3 seconds of concentric movements and 3 seconds of eccentric movement with progressing weights.

For this kind of knee pain, exercising in water is also very good. Running, high knees, jumps... Only creativity while in the water sets the limits.

Loss of strength and power in the quadriceps is linked to development of osteoarthritis.

- Look into getting knee pads for work. Very important as it reduces stress on the joint significantly. Would be surprised though if he's 58 and not using them already.

- NSAIDs (anti-inflammatory pills) for those days where the pain is unbearable. Medical advice from a doctor regarding this is mandatory.

- Corticosteroid injections are, in my experience, without effect for osteoarthritis. It has a short duration and can even make the symptoms worse. I know it's popular in the states, but European reviews have found this intervention useless is most cases.

A poster above mentioned collagen supplements. Haven't read that much about them but it's definitely worth to give a try. Exercise (the right kind) has the best evidence for reducing pain and restoring function for this kind of problem.

With the advice above I've taken men with creaking joints that were scheduled for knee replacement surgery, to a well-functioning everyday life with drastically reduced pain. It doesn't work for everyone, but it works for many.

Post: #6

Thank you for the posts! Just bought some CH on Amazon, so I will have him give that a shot and report back the results

I will also tell him about the exercise advice

Thanks again

Post: #7

(06-21-2018 08:51 AM)whatitdowhatitdoes Wrote:  Thank you for the posts! Just bought some CH on Amazon, so I will have him give that a shot and report back the results

I will also tell him about the exercise advice

Thanks again

Great, remember that you need the vitamin C for the collagen production as well.
I`ve been taking mine with green tea, it`s basically taste and odourless though so you can have it with anything. You also have to be consistent with it for a few months to expect to see results.

Post: #8

He should take 2 supplements (1) tumeric with pepperin, and 2) glucosin with chondroitin.

Start with nutrition, then consider something more serious.

Post: #9

Is he wearing daily knee wraps?
A good knee wrap will give Slight Compression (not too much and not too little), which will result in a little more heat and blood flow to the area.

This probably won't fix the problem but it is an easy start to relieving pain, minimizing further damage and starting the healing process.

A lot of other great recommendations above (supplements, light exercise)

Jocko Willink has 2 great supplements for this:
Jocko Super Krill: Link 1
Jocko Joint Warefare: Link 2

Jocko Willink is a famous Navy Seal, inspirational/motivational speaker and BJJ Grappler.
His supplements are high quality and made in the USA - worth checking out.

Post: #10

MSM (methlsulfonylmethane) is very effective. I've used it to combat joint pain. Echo comments from Hypno and Scrapper as well.

You need to remove any inflammatory foods. Look at links in my signature - '12 bad foods' video especially. Look up the GAPS diet.

Avoid NSAIDs as much as possible but have him take 1 NAC (n acetyl cysteine) in the morning on an empty stomach to detox his liner when using anti inflammatories.

Post: #11

I don't mean to be rude, but there is NO way anyone can give you any advice on this topic, and NO way you should take any advice (such as the crap you bought), WITHOUT KNOWING WHAT THE DAMN PROBLEM IS!

There can be DOZENS of reasons for your dad's knee pain! I'm not that far from his age; i had horrible knee pain for 2 years. I assumed it would go away, as knee pain always had before. When it didn't after a long time, I figured it had to be an injury, not a strain-related thing. I assumed it was torn cartilage, since that's what my brothers and friends my age had. They all had surgery, so mentally i prepared myself to, as well. Also, my knee pain happened suddenly, after i slipped while running one night, so of COURSE it was an injury.

I did the smart thing and went to an excellent orthopedic MD, who did an X-ray and MRI. My self-diagnosis of torn cartilage? WRONG! I had tendinitis. Of the patella tendon. I had 6 weeks of PT, plus lots of ice. That helped, but at my age it took many more months to be pain-free.

WE DON'T KNOW WHAT REGIMEN WILL HELP YOUR DAD, because WE DON'T KNOW WHAT THE PROBLEM IS!

Get him to a doctor. Stop self-diagnosing.

Post: #12

(06-23-2018 05:43 PM)The Father Wrote:  I don't mean to be rude, but there is NO way anyone can give you any advice on this topic, and NO way you should take any advice (such as the crap you bought), WITHOUT KNOWING WHAT THE DAMN PROBLEM IS!

There can be DOZENS of reasons for your dad's knee pain! I'm not that far from his age; i had horrible knee pain for 2 years. I assumed it would go away, as knee pain always had before. When it didn't after a long time, I figured it had to be an injury, not a strain-related thing. I assumed it was torn cartilage, since that's what my brothers and friends my age had. They all had surgery, so mentally i prepared myself to, as well. Also, my knee pain happened suddenly, after i slipped while running one night, so of COURSE it was an injury.

I did the smart thing and went to an excellent orthopedic MD, who did an X-ray and MRI. My self-diagnosis of torn cartilage? WRONG! I had tendinitis. Of the patella tendon. I had 6 weeks of PT, plus lots of ice. That helped, but at my age it took many more months to be pain-free.

WE DON'T KNOW WHAT REGIMEN WILL HELP YOUR DAD, because WE DON'T KNOW WHAT THE PROBLEM IS!

Get him to a doctor. Stop self-diagnosing.

This.

Get an MRI.

Get an accurate diagnosis.

Coming from someone who found minor knee pain absolutely required a major surgery in the past.

In the meantime, I highly recommend Tart Cherry Juice Concentrate from Stanton.

This stuff is ideal for all aches, pains, and inflammation.

Take one ounce with eight ounces of water before bed.

Post: #13

In terms of supps, I would also add Curcumin to the list.

A highly effective remedy for joint pain, prescribed to me by Rio Nomad.

Post: #14

(06-20-2018 01:30 PM)whatitdowhatitdoes Wrote:  My father is getting a bit up there in age, he is 58 years old and he is a general contractor...he wakes up at 6AM to head to work and doesn't wrap up his day until 6PM....he is the hardest working guy I know and his body is starting to give out. I help him with jobs on the weekends but I have a 9-5 during the week and there is really only so much I can do.

His knees are giving him problems and I am curious if anyone on this forum has found remedies or solutions for this? I know the most basic advice is to "take it easy" and "not work as hard" but I might as well just smack myself in the head with a hammer because I have told him that about a million times and he doesn't want to hear it

Any help would be greatly appreciated, I think this is a great forum

When something hurts, that's your body's way of telling you to stay off it. The solution is for him to find a job in the field where he's not punishing his knees. This is why men in construction graduate to foreman or desk jobs.

This was a constant battle I had with my ex. She had back problems and insisted in working through her pain. She's now on permanent disability (and was one of those people you read about who got addicted to pain pills). All the cures and workarounds can't save a body that's been pushed too hard.

Addendum: Humans were not meant for hard physical labor long term. Before the Industrial Revolution, when men (and women) worked the land, they'd have lots of kids, so the young ones could take over the backbreaking work when they came of age.

It's like that old folk song we used to sing in grade school "When I First Came To This Land." The final verse starts with "I called my son...my work is done." This was a comment on how the next of kin would take over doing the physical labor.

Anyway, corporate American isn't set up like the old family farms and basically works people till they break. This is why so many people are on disability these days.