Post: #1

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/spea...14dae31d5f

Takeaways:

-People shoot for a +2 SMV spread
-Everybody wants white men
-Seattle sucks for men
-Hot women = younger, hotter, tighter
-Hot men = older
-Post grad junior spinsters get no D
-A hot girl in a big city is basically god status

WaPo Wrote:Online dating study quantifies what’s ‘out of your league’

Online dating is now one of the primary ways people meet partners, and researchers can use data from dating apps to observe and quantify romantic attraction and pursuit. In other words, all of those terrible online messages and first dates are being donated to science.

A study out Wednesday in the journal Science Advances described “a hierarchy of desirability” in the messaging tactics of online daters. It also found that both men and women messaged potential partners who were on average 25 percent more attractive than they were.

The study analyzed heterosexual dating markets in an unnamed “popular, free online dating service” in four major U.S. cities: Boston, Chicago, New York and Seattle. The number of users totaled in the hundreds of thousands. User data was anonymous and did not include personal details or message content. Scientists looked at age, ethnicity and education of the users, and they quantified the messages exchanged through the service. Desirability was defined by the number of messages someone received as well as the desirability of the people sending those messages.

The study included only heterosexual users to simplify the analyses, said Elizabeth Bruch, lead author of the study and a sociologist at the University of Michigan. But, Bruch said, the research methods could be used for other groups.

Some previous studies have shown that ethnicity has an effect on desirability, but others have shown that it does not matter. In this study, white men and Asian women ranked highest for desirability, measured by the messaging metrics, and men and women contacted potential partners who were on average 25 percent more desirable than they were.

“What would it mean scientifically for someone to be ‘out of your league?’ ” Bruch said. This question, along with many others about mate choice, are now answerable, she said. “There are so many folk theories about dating, and what are the rules of dating, and the strategies that people have,” said Bruch. “It hit us like, oh my God, we can see if this is actually working. People in dating have all these strategies, like you don't call at 10 p.m. on Friday night, but we don't know if that actually matters. These things are knowable. They're not just things you can speculate about with your friends.”

The scientists measured the number of words per initial message and the message response rate. Men wrote more first messages than women did, and women were less likely to respond to a message. Men and women also wrote longer messages to potential dates who were more desirable, the study said. The number of words in a message, however, did not correlate to response, even when controlled for the desirability gap. In other words, a one-word message (let's say, “hiiiii”) was just as likely to get a response as a long, agonized line of Pablo Neruda poetry (I want / To do with you what spring does with a cherry tree"). This raises the obvious, if controversial question: Is it better to just say, “Hey”?

“It seems like 'hey' is the way to go,” Bruch said with a laugh. In terms of a cost-benefit analysis, the time and energy put into that first message may be wasted, but she pointed out that, because the researchers did not have access to the content of the messages, only the number of words, “we know nothing of the wittiness of the messages.” After a pause, she continued: “I'm not a fan of the 'hey' message.”

There was one exception to this. Men in Seattle who wrote longer messages had a higher chance of getting a reply. The study noted that Seattle's dating climate is “unfavorable” for men, with as many as two men per woman, depending on the population. If you are seeking a verbally prolific heterosexual man and great dating odds, you may want to put Seattle on your list.

A few other findings from the study: “Older women are less desirable, while older men are more so,” the authors found. “Postgraduate education is associated with decreased desirability among women.” Women’s desirability peaked at the youngest age possible to join the dating app — 18 — and declined until age 60. Men's desirability increased until 50. It is important to note, particularly for everyone who’s not an 18-year-old woman or a middle-aged white man, that the study results were based on averages, and there is a wide range in what people are looking for in a date.

Desirable people got more and longer messages overall. “Even though the probability of getting a response drops with a desirability gap, the response rate is still quite a bit above zero,” Bruch said — a cautiously optimistic argument for reaching out to those out-of-reach hotties.

One outlier in the data, described as a "30-year-old woman living in New York,” the scientists nicknamed their “movie star.” She received 1,500 messages, “equivalent to one message every 30 minutes, day and night, for the entire month” of the observing period, the study stated. The study did not state how this woman's life may have been affected by hourly “Hey” messages.

“What can be tricky about studying attraction is that so many things are subjective,” said Lucy Hunt, a social psychologist at Purdue University who was not involved in the study. Online dating shows us who is available, but Hunt warned against expecting it to do more than that. You have to meet people face to face, she said.

Helen Fisher, a biological anthropologist at the Kinsey Institute who was not involved in the study, pointed out that these are not really dating apps. They're “introducing apps.”

“The only real algorithm is your own brain. Where you meet him [or her] doesn't matter. On a park bench, online” or other places. The app can set you up with someone who might seem perfect, but traits like humor or trustworthiness are hard to measure online, Fisher said.

Fisher, who is also the chief scientist at Match.com, had several pieces of specific advice for online dating, based on that company's user research. Most people do not appreciate their dates looking at their phones. We're visual animals, she said, so picture choice is important (she recommends uploading six photos). But perhaps the most helpful advice was, “if what you're doing isn't working, change your strategy.”

As for me, I am moving to Seattle.

Here is a pic of the author, about what you would expect. Can't hack it with her looks in NYC so she wants to go to Seattle where she will get a bump in SMV just from demographics alone.

Post: #2

Not a lot of surprises in the study but still good confirmation nonetheless. I never did think Seattle was a great city for men like us based on what I've heard, so glad to be proven right there. Really, west coastal US cities all seem to have horrible reps lol from that to Portland, SF, and LA. At least the east coast has NYC and Miami.

I'm not hating on the woman for wanting Seattle. I'd be a hypocrite saying it considering I'm a big advocate of western men going to Asia to increase their value. In the dating world, the West is ruled by queens, the east is ruled by kings. Everyone can chase that.

Post: #3

Nothing new however the way the SMV (desirability in the article) is measured is biaised. They measure it with the number of messages received. We all know here that in the western world a woman 5 will get far more messages than a man 8. Basically a woman online gets her SMV amplified, that’s why women love dating apps more than men, they get from it a big ego boost with 0 effort.

Post: #4

(08-08-2018 07:36 PM)Adonis Wrote:  A few other findings from the study: “Older women are less desirable, while older men are more so,” the authors found. “Postgraduate education is associated with decreased desirability among women.” Women’s desirability peaked at the youngest age possible to join the dating app — 18 — and declined until age 60. Men's desirability increased until 50. [/u][/b]It is important to note, particularly for everyone who’s not an 18-year-old woman or a middle-aged white man, that the study results were based on averages, and there is a wide range in what people are looking for in a date.

The age observation is great. First, because its true, and second, because of the extreme levels of salt, denial, and cognitive dissonance it produced in the comments section:

"You ignore this bs article. Desirability is completely subjective. Some men like little girls. Some think that's disgusting. Some like older women. Some are attracted to personality. This article, and the "study" it was based on are meaningless and useless."

"Further proof of where the male brain is actually located in their bodies."

Yes, so sorry men aren't in a sagging body, entitled and bitter attitude, and barren womb. Desirability may be "subjective" in a sense, but the fact that your nipples hang next to your belly button is not.

Post: #5

Im pretty surprised actually that they posted those findings with what appears to be objective language and only a halfhearted attempt at a muh averages gotcha, even though they put "a few more findings" aka the uncomfortable truth at the end with no commentary needed.

Some of those comments though...

Quote:Oh no, why did nobody tell me earlier?! If I had just patiently waited until 50, I could have had tons of uneducated and inexperienced 18 year old girls throw themselves at my wallet. Instead, I had to settle for making babies with my slightly older, exceedingly mature and overeducated PhD wife. I've so missed out! NOT.

Translation: I cant lead my way out of a wet paper bag and I need to be told how to dress and how to live my life.

Quote:We just did an intervention of sorts over beers with a male friend of ours in his 40's who's dating profile says he's open to women 20-35. My husband and another married friend pointed out that he might think the youngsters are more desirable, but they're not as good in bed as older women who know what they want. Then they high-fived.

This never happened.

Quote:As a single woman in Seattle, I can assure you that this v scientific study has missed the mark. While there may be a large number of single men here due to the tech industry, the overwhelming majority are incredibly socially awkward and will bang on about the algorithms they developed at MS/Amazon/Google/FB/startup that was acquired by MS/Amazon/Google/FB if you agree to a date.

Tingle-less in Seattle, sad!

Quote:I love this research. My guy and I met on OKCupid. We both thought we were “punching upwards” and we both thought that we got someone significantly more desireable than ourselves.

I messaged him first. We’ll be married late next month.

Message to all you guys who thought they could get that 18 year old babe, and who, I see, are all still single: LOL!

She is bitter at being passed up for younger hotter tighter.

Post: #6

This study seems to have been conducted on a non-swipe dating platform. I'd like to see data on swipe apps like Tinder and Bumble.

Post: #7

(08-09-2018 07:18 PM)Rhyme or Reason Wrote:  This study seems to have been conducted on a non-swipe dating platform. I'd like to see data on swipe apps like Tinder and Bumble.

I'm sure this has been done as both Tinder and Bumble have the data but the results were too damaging to the progressive leftest narrative so it was never published.

Post: #8

In this weeks installment of "This week in patriarchy"

Men like youthful beauty not overeducated bitches, news at 11:00.

Guardian: Men's fixation on young women is another sign of masculinity in crisis

Quote:Men attracted to emotionally unstable women, preferably no older than 18, studies show

This week’s peer-reviewed portrayal of fragile masculinity comes to you from the journal Science Advances, which recently published a depressing new study about online dating. Researchers looked at nearly 200,000 heterosexual users and found that while men’s sexual desirability peaks at age 50, women hit their prime at 18. And then it’s all downhill from there apparently. Can I just remind you that 18-year-olds are teenagers, and so this study is basically saying that straight men don’t find women attractive; they like girls.

#NotAllMen, I’m sure. However, this isn’t the first study to find men are fixated on women a lot younger than them. A 2010 study by OKCupid found that “the median 30-year-old man spends as much time messaging teenage girls as he does women his own age”. No doubt Roy Moore might have a thing or two to say about that.

I promise you I’m not here to promote the gay agenda and undermine heterosexuality, but I’ve got another alarming report to really top things off. A recent study, published in the Journal of Sex Research found that “men whose partners had less emotional stability reported better sexual function”. Sounds really healthy, guys.

While these studies may focus on sexual relations, they’re yet another reminder that we’re facing a crisis of masculinity that is reverberating across every aspect of our society. The far right is dominated by men, many of whom seem to be searching for a sense of identity. For feminism to get anywhere we must seriously address how we think about masculinity.

Manjaw? Check.
Thousand cock stare? Check.
Post grad degree? Probably.
Dumped for a younger hotter tighter? Definitely.

Post: #9

(08-19-2018 11:24 AM)Adonis Wrote:  

Manjaw? Check.
Thousand cock stare? Check.
Post grad degree? Probably.
Dumped for a younger hotter tighter? Definitely.

And...the small dog as a child-substitute.

Post: #10

(08-19-2018 11:24 AM)Adonis Wrote:  In this weeks installment of "This week in patriarchy"

Men like youthful beauty not overeducated bitches, news at 11:00.

Guardian: Men's fixation on young women is another sign of masculinity in crisis

Quote:Men attracted to emotionally unstable women, preferably no older than 18, studies show

This week’s peer-reviewed portrayal of fragile masculinity comes to you from the journal Science Advances, which recently published a depressing new study about online dating. Researchers looked at nearly 200,000 heterosexual users and found that while men’s sexual desirability peaks at age 50, women hit their prime at 18. And then it’s all downhill from there apparently. Can I just remind you that 18-year-olds are teenagers, and so this study is basically saying that straight men don’t find women attractive; they like girls.

#NotAllMen, I’m sure. However, this isn’t the first study to find men are fixated on women a lot younger than them. A 2010 study by OKCupid found that “the median 30-year-old man spends as much time messaging teenage girls as he does women his own age”. No doubt Roy Moore might have a thing or two to say about that.

I promise you I’m not here to promote the gay agenda and undermine heterosexuality, but I’ve got another alarming report to really top things off. A recent study, published in the Journal of Sex Research found that “men whose partners had less emotional stability reported better sexual function”. Sounds really healthy, guys.

While these studies may focus on sexual relations, they’re yet another reminder that we’re facing a crisis of masculinity that is reverberating across every aspect of our society. The far right is dominated by men, many of whom seem to be searching for a sense of identity. For feminism to get anywhere we must seriously address how we think about masculinity.

Manjaw? Check.
Thousand cock stare? Check.
Post grad degree? Probably.
Dumped for a younger hotter tighter? Definitely.

Oh dear lord already guessed what the author might look like before clikcing link.
How can anyone not be redpilled at this point remains a mystery to me.
It's like denying physics when seeing the newtonian mechanics everywhere around us.

Post: #11

Haven't done online dating since 2015 and Tinder is just an App which I haven't been on since 2015 as well. Women have weaponised being an animal mum, career slut or just an outright bitter cunt with CAPS LOCK profiles.

Thirsty men drive these things and I refuse to compete with the crowd just to get scraps.

Post: #12

I'm deleting my tinder profile that I've had for a month simply for the purpose of pipelining a party in another city for me and a couple friends.

I have 200 matches, have spoken to dozens of women, and exactly 0 have come through for a meeting. That's actually untrue, one did, and she was a SIF. I have no interest in meeting a girl that is 30 pounds heavier than her pictures, and I'm not sure the mentality of these girls that post slim pics of themselves and then show up looking like they've ate a whole grocery store.

I think that these apps are garbage, I would much rather spend 20 minutes and speak to a girl a day at a coffee shop of something. Or go out and meet 5 girls a night. At least then I know what they look like in real life, and I can instantaneously get rejected or accepted, instead of talking to a girl for a couple days that decides to flake.

I also have an idea for a better way of doing these apps without the superficiality. Probably won't catch on, but who knows.

Post: #13

She says "masculinity in crisis" but it's really a crisis of feminism.

Post: #14

(08-19-2018 01:04 PM)Foolsgo1d Wrote:  Haven't done online dating since 2015 and Tinder is just an App which I haven't been on since 2015 as well. Women have weaponised being an animal mum, career slut or just an outright bitter cunt with CAPS LOCK profiles.

Thirsty men drive these things and I refuse to compete with the crowd just to get scraps.

I use a simple algorithm on tinder.

If it's white, I reflexively swipe left every time.

If she's a slim, non-ghetto looking latina or black girl, I check the profile to make sure there is no mention of "single mom" and swipe right

If she's Asian, I click on the profile to determine whether she's American born or FOB. If American born, I swipe right, if FOB, I burn my super like for the day.

Post: #15

I know I'm late to the party here, but a couple of these conclusions are clearly retarded interpretations of the data. I'm endlessly amazed by journalists' inability to think through the trash they type up. The worst offender:

Quote:Men's desirability increased until 50.

How an assertion this idiotic could get published is beyond me. Of course the article doesn't go on to explain how 'desirability' is defined, but it's obvious from this absurd conclusion that the metric is highly flawed and probably grossly oversimplified. My guess is they're simply defining 'desirability' based solely on messages received and response rate with no regard for whom these men are contacting- so a 50 year old man messaging the 40+ crowd and getting a 40% response rate is "more desirable" than a 27 year old man messaging 23 year old hotties and pulling 20%. Like concluding that your local high school football team is better than the Cleveland Browns because they have a better record.

Honorable mention:

Quote:It also found that both men and women messaged potential partners who were on average 25 percent more attractive than they were.

Nothing wrong with this statement on the surface, but it's misleading. They're trying to lead you to believe everyone is shooting out of their league when really this statistic is trivial and doesn't prove shit. Of course more attractive people are going to be messaged more. If someone messages people equal to or greater than their own attractiveness, but would be happy with someone equal, that's not shooting out of their league, that's just being rational. Why not take a shot at the ones you perceive as more attractive? There's nothing to lose.

Last thing... and this goes for all "studies" on online dating... they really need to split things out by age. I'd love to see a study that only looks at under 30's. The inequality would absolutely shock those who haven't lived it.

Post: #16

Quote:As a single woman in Seattle, I can assure you that this v scientific study has missed the mark. While there may be a large number of single men here due to the tech industry, the overwhelming majority are incredibly socially awkward and will bang on about the algorithms they developed at MS/Amazon/Google/FB/startup that was acquired by MS/Amazon/Google/FB if you agree to a date.

I want to make a few points about Seattle, since I live here.

Two thirds of Amazon employees are men. No other tech company in the area even approaches that ratio. All of these fuckers live in downtown and a good chunk are either limp wristed hipsters or IRT's. So, for guys who have some looks or game... the city is not that bad. I would not call it great either... most of you would hate the logistics.