Post: #1

Whats your opinion and life stories about working in stressful jobs, and if it's worth it or not.

Here it's my story. I had just finished my masters degree in Computer Engineering and applied to several jobs. Managed to work for a few months at a research department of my uni but there was no continuity so I applied everywhere.

Got in a junior consultant program in a Big4 company. Had no idea what was expecting me, the first day in the job one of the old timers from that company gave us a speech.

Legit thought the guy was in his 80s, maybe 90s, found out several months after that he was still in his early 50s.

Anyway, started to work in that fast paced long hours environment and soon I was just over that shit. Couldn't really believe life could be that bad. I got up at 7 am, commute to work, stayed there until 8 pm in the good days (some of my friends stayed there until 10/11pm regularly). After some months couldn't get quality sleep and had my head fucked over. Call it quits and found another more peaceful job.

During my stay in that environment found out that a lot of the guys that worked there had some sort of precocious aging process going on. Some wouldn't take bath and would stink, and I had to sit near them lool.

Most didn't like to be there but they didn't had another option, several of them were there because of the cv it gives you. Although I would argue that companies would only want you because you were once a slave so you can be one again.

Definitely wont go back to that environment, my goal now is to do my own business and have that as my main source of income in about 5/10 years.

This story happened like 4 years ago but found it important to share with you as I believe people that take the consultant route or the long hours for someone else route, sometimes don't really think about what they are doing.

Post: #2

My view is that having a stressful job slaving away for someone like that is not worth all the money in the world (unless it literally is paying millions).

For that 10-15k extra, of which you would probably pay 50% anyway to tax, is it really not worth having no life whatsover? Even if it's for higher salary you need to balance whether it's really worth it.

It destroys your life, health and your soul.

Why should you suffer any stress and the best years of your life working for any company. You are just a cog in the machine.

Always keep things in perspective, it is all fucking bullshit.

You have no time for outside interests and outside possibilities for business and investments which could get you out of that. In effect they lock you in to your death and you have no oppurtunities to get out.

At worst do it for 1-2 years.

Get out. Fuck it become a teacher in Thailand.

A 20k job somewhere would give a better quality of life.

Let the cucks cuck and run themselves to the ground.

You can live.

Post: #3

How much were they paying?

Post: #4

(10-28-2018 01:39 PM)Vincent Chase Wrote:  My view is that having a stressful job slaving away for someone like that is not worth all the money in the world (unless it literally is paying millions).

For that 10-15k extra, of which you would probably pay 50% anyway to tax, is it really not worth having no life whatsover? Even if it's for higher salary you need to balance whether it's really worth it.

It destroys your life, health and your soul.

Why should you suffer any stress and the best years of your life working for any company. You are just a cog in the machine.

Always keep things in perspective, it is all fucking bullshit.

You have no time for outside interests and outside possibilities for business and investments which could get you out of that. In effect they lock you in to your death and you have no oppurtunities to get out.

At worst do it for 1-2 years.

Get out. Fuck it become a teacher in Thailand.

A 20k job somewhere would give a better quality of life.

Let the cucks cuck and run themselves to the ground.

You can live.

I'm sure your point of view is the point of view of someone outside the IT market. I'm also a recently graduated computer engineer like OP living in Spain (a country which is similar to Portugal). Our countries are not doing that well nowadays, this means salaries are low and there are not many opportunities for young people, even thought computer engineering is one of the jobs with the lowest unemployment.

Let me answer OP now: I understand you have joined a company like Deloitte (Consulting Big4). There are 2 reasons why people join companies like this: CV and "learning". Both are bullshit, Deloitte is not fucking Google, no one cares if you worked there or not, this was time ago and about the learning part, unless you join a job where you do nothing you'll also be learning a lot wherever. For sure working everytime for new client, in a new project you won't be learning as much as if you had to develop your own product and sell it yourself, because in this case you will be very perfectionist so the product sells, if you are working for some client you are just motivated by a delivery time

My advice is (and also what I'm doing) join a mid size company (~1k employees), specialize in something you like (IoT, Big Data, Deep Learning, Embbeded, .NET..), keep learning english and move out from Portugal. After 4-5 years of experience you'll earn big money in UK, Germany, etc..

Post: #5

My story is in a thread buried in the forum:

Engineering Datasheet

No it's not worth it. Society is trying to push people in every way shape and form to make work their life....it's becoming a neo-slavery in a neo-feudalistic system. "Muh Career." Ridiculous amount of debt keeping you tied to the job. Discouragement of family formation and the replacement thereof with your coworkers. If you are not at work on your "good" 12-hour day, then you need to be trying craft beers with your coworkers and jerking each other off. Got a real family or your own shit to do outside of work? Prepare to be let go in some roundabout legal fashion.

Looking back years after getting out, I had significant negative health effects that I didn't even notice at the time. "Fish in water" principle sorta thing. There's articles out there about people who quit the corporate grind and a number of health ailments like high blood pressure just vanish...



I can only imagine for those who stick with it for decades. Totally believe the guy in his 50s looking like 70s, 80s, even 90s.

I used to be all gung ho about muh career and working for a big flashy company. That all ended pretty quick. Thankfully I don't have such a conformist mentality and can think for myself. As do most of us on this forum. Unfortunately many people in this world do not. If more people stood up, didn't accept being shit on, and brought up the obvious fact that the CEO of a company making 100-200 times more than the average WHITE collar worker is bullshit when they are still human, have 24 hours in the day, and still eat sleep and shit....well we wouldn't be in this position. Because in the end, it's all just a mind game.

Post: #6

Short term for cashflow is ok.

Long term is not ok if you're still shit kicking and stressing.

If you can find a happy equilibrium where you're good at what you do (don't need to love it), get paid well enough for putting up with the situation and to cover life's expenses, then don't let anyone convince you to "quit your job and teach in Asia" whenever you're in a seasonal rut.

Reliable cash flow is still cash flow, something you take for granted when "starting a business and working for yourself".

Working for yourself means you're working for your clients/buyers and competing with everyone undercutting your products and services. So unless you have the market on lock down and you can offer something unique with a high barrier for entry then perhaps, just maybe you would be better off keeping your day job to pay for life while getting the side biz off the ground.

If you're a trust fund kid or won a lawsuit/lottery/inheritance, congratulations, you have more freedom to experiment.


EDIT: I may have gone off topic. Yes, I 100% agree. If you're in a stressful job and it's still stressful after you've mastered whatever it is that you're doing then get the fuck out. Short term stress is necessary so you can harden up and get better at what you're doing. Prolonged stress because of a toxic culture, unreasonable targets and unhealthy environments is 100% detrimental to your health. If it pays very well, you can and should stack cash until you've had enough then GTFO.

P.S. I'm going to throw this in:

Supply & Demand ALWAYS needs to be taken into consideration. You're selling a product, even if that product is you (and your skills). What is the demand for your product and how big is the supply?

Post: #7

(10-28-2018 03:30 PM)Drax Wrote:  How much were they paying?

In Portugal, it was my second job out of college, 1000 euros net salary. It's slightly above medium salary in Portugal.

Post: #8

I don't have experience with this career wise but a lot of work I do has been seasonal or on a short term basis. I'd rather work long hours and make better money so that I have cash instead of barely scrapping by. Doesn't matter if you work 5,8,or 12 ours your day is still disturbed so who cares.

After 40 hours though I will say health takes a hit,it becomes impossible to avoid eating out,you cant hit the gym every day,and you sleep less because you still have to do stuff like laundry. That's why the extra hours you put in for that period of time should provide enough income to make things worth it temporarily. No one would say you should work 80 hours a week for the rest of your life,but if you are afraid to do that in order to have more freedom long term that's all you. The life of leisure and freedom that most people only dream of isn't going to come about out of thin air.

I think its more shitty to spend a bunch of time working and having just enough money when you could work slightly more (although this "slightly more" feels exponential) and have extra money.


Maybe its different in Portugal but in the american economy those long hours are worth it. 1000 Euros a month for a college grad sounds horrible,and I understand why you'd be pissed. (Unless the cost of living is cheaper there?) I'm a student and I can make that in two weeks while going to school if the right work is available during certain times of the school year or during the summer working on a beach.

Post: #9

(10-28-2018 06:39 PM)SteezeySteve Wrote:  I don't have experience with this career wise but a lot of work I do has been seasonal or on a short term basis. I'd rather work long hours and make better money so that I have cash instead of barely scrapping by. Doesn't matter if you work 5,8,or 12 ours your day is still disturbed so who cares.

After 40 hours though I will say health takes a hit,it becomes impossible to avoid eating out,you cant hit the gym every day,and you sleep less because you still have to do stuff like laundry. That's why the extra hours you put in for that period of time should provide enough income to make things worth it temporarily. No one would say you should work 80 hours a week for the rest of your life,but if you are afraid to do that in order to have more freedom long term that's all you. The life of leisure and freedom that most people only dream of isn't going to come about out of thin air.

I think its more shitty to spend a bunch of time working and having just enough money when you could work slightly more (although this "slightly more" feels exponential) and have extra money.


Maybe its different in Portugal but in the american economy those long hours are worth it. 1000 Euros a month for a college grad sounds horrible,and I understand why you'd be pissed. (Unless the cost of living is cheaper there?) I'm a student and I can make that in two weeks while going to school if the right work is available during certain times of the school year or during the summer working on a beach.

The cost of living here is bad, that's why a lot of people emigrate. For example, you can get a room in Lisbon for 300 euros a month, and this is considered a steal, and Im talking about a room. So Lisbon for example, is Berlin house prices with 1/3 Berlin salaries.

Post: #10

Use consulting (or other professional services) job as a springboard, then find a job in industry. Do a lot of research including networking with former colleagues and classmates, combing through glassdoor and other reviews, asking indirect questions and interpreting answers at job interviews.

There are decent 9 to 5 jobs out there. It could take awhile to find one though.

Post: #11

I work for a major transportation company in the USA. I have been in the same position, for 18 years. I am the lowest paid position in my department. My hourly wage is just less that $27 an hour. I have a pension plan that I pay almost $600 a month into. We have vacation time. But it takes 17 years to get 4 weeks and 25 years, to get 5 weeks.

I have stayed in this same position. I am #1 on the seniority roster. I could have days, with weekends off. But I chose to work nights now. There are other jobs at this place that make $90-100,000+ a year (with overtime.) But those jobs work crazy hours.

The last 3 years, we have had 9 employees quit my position. 3 have quit this year and one guy is off on mental stress leave. (He was served divorce papers, walking to his car in the parking lot after work. And he had a mental break down in the parking lot.)

My company has a large amount of business, but the head office is rolling out a new plan to reduce the work force by 10-20% and try to maximize already 1 Billion dollar profits, per quarter.

People keep quitting. The company does not hire enough people to fill positions. I am working all three shifts each week...by choice. I am working 50-70 hours a week.

I am happy to have a job. I am one of the few people that does not come to work, hating their life. Things are not perfect, no matter what you do in life. But I am learning how to handle things and not feel depressed, like every one else.

But I am at the point where I need to make a few descisions: I turn 40, next year. I bought a brand new car and a motorcycle and racked up some other debts. I can get out of my fanacial situation in a short amount of time. But do I want to stay in this position for at least another 20 years?

I have good attendance. I work more than my share of overtime. I stopped people from catching on fire at work and saved some equipment from being damaged a few times from people not doing their jobs. I got letters of commendation for doing these things too.

But when I finally started applying for other positions at my work, I have been told all three times that I have worked here too long by HR in the inteviews . I was told this again, just a few weeks ago.

Right now, jobs are plenty and I am still a relatively young man.

Do you stay at the same company, just for the supposed carrot they dangle in front of you? Or do you take risks and do not doubt or look over your shoulder, in regret, and push out into other areas?

My gut instinct is to pay off my debts, take a vacation and travel and come back and find new employment.

I think this is what I have to do. I know it!

Post: #12

I'm going to make this really simple

What everyone is really looking for is happiness and fulfilment, and a big part of that is freedom to live a life that you find happy and fulfilling.

There's really only three ways you can achieve freedom:
1) Find a job you actually like, or start a business or learn skills in an industry you like and be self employed and dictate your own career
2) Work a job you don't like (that pays really well) for a shorter amount of time, save money, invest it, and build up your passive income so you have more freedom in the future
3) Live super minimally to reduce your need money, so you don't have to work as much in general, or work in jobs you don't like. Some guys move abroad to less developed countries for this reason

You may even combine or do two of these at the same time e.g. live minimally to reduce your need for more money (and subsequently work less), and try to start a business with that extra free time

A stressful job that pays really well (100k +) may not be bad if you live super frugally for 2-3 years and save up a few hundred thousand dollars that gives you a huge safety cushion and freedom for the future. Obviously there is a toll to pay for that, but nothing comes easy in life, and that's a pretty big reward for most people.

First decide what route you want to take to freedom (based on what you want out of life - you may have to sit down and think and write those things down) - and then obsessively execute your plan.

Just try to spend as little time as possible doing something that doesn't serve your future wants and goals.

Know what you want (or at least be prepared to routinely reflect on it if you don't know right now) - and stick to it.

Post: #13

Stress is in the eye of the beholder. I was a military engineer for a decade and I loved it. I also spent a year as a "bond borrower" where I handled the physical settlement of multimillion dollar transactions, sometimes under tight time pressures.

In the other hand, I got moved to am other desk called "investment advisors" where I was a general trouble shooter for dozens of relatively small clients. I fucking hated it because I had the clients complaining about something fuck up with their account, I had their iadvisors bitching at me, and there was nothing I could do directly to solve the problems do most of my day was spent riding the phone to annoy people in other departments to make the correction.

I also spent 4 years as a divorce attorney and by the end of that I was an alcoholic.

Fuck that. Now I teach English in China and generally work less that 20 hours a week.

Post: #14

(10-28-2018 06:38 PM)pk9090 Wrote:  

(10-28-2018 03:30 PM)Drax Wrote:  How much were they paying?

In Portugal, it was my second job out of college, 1000 euros net salary. It's slightly above medium salary in Portugal.

I think that salary is very low for (west) European standards, especially in your sector. If you are willing to work hard and a lot, then that factor must also be rewarded accordingly. Leave Portugal as soon as possible.

Post: #15

I spent 5 years working for 2 different big4 companies in 2 different EU countries (audit department).

Like Vincent Chase said unless they literally pay you millions, its not worth it.


I am currently busting my ass off working 7 days per week to set up my own accounting firm. I don't think I would have the motivation to do it otherwise - working as a wage cuck is so disturbing and disgusting that the idea of continue doing it motivates me to work during every single free hour of my day to be fully self-employed soon.

Also I personally think most motivational self-help advice for employees is wrong. When I was younger (I'm 30 now) I used to read a lot of RSD material etc telling you things like 'dont be a couch potato, hit the gym' 'most people watch TV to escape reality, don't be like them. Dont let your life become work-tv-sleep-repeat'. The ugly truth is that your willpower is a limited resource. Spending 45+ hours every week in the office drains the life out of you. It literally is harder to go to the gym or eat healthy.

I think you need a solid plan to escape this cycle while you're still young. I think its pointless to try and make things work in this environment. Its unnatural, its like swimming against the current.

Post: #16

I think men need a certain level of stress. After all, what is stress but stimulation?

Like stimulation, too much stress can and will kill you.

It's trite to say, but balance is key.

The chef life is notoriously stressful. I've gone through intensely stressful periods and moments to get to where I am, and have had many long days and nights where, by the end of the day, I was ready to throw in the towel and walk away from this life forever.

But I persisted, and I've carved out a pretty sweet life for myself. I've trained a staff beneath me that handles the bulk of the stress, so I can have plenty of days where I go in, cook some great food, make the rounds in the dining room, and leave at a normal hour while my grunts do the heavy lifting. Most weeks I'm able to hit the gym when I need to, fuck my girlfriend, engage in other hedonistic pursuits, live in a sweet house (that I own) with a sweet car and sweet motorcycle, and make time to stretch and meditate. There are precious few desires I have that remain to be met, which creates its own little dilemma. These are called "First World Problems" and I'm very happy to have them.

Those intensely stressful nights where I was ready to throw in the towel....I'm glad I didn't.

I'd say the key to all of it is make sure you have a long term (5+ years) plan. Don't get stuck in a position where there's no light at the end of the tunnel. The stress must lead to bigger and better things, which will provide their own unique type of stress. Stress must lead to more money, more independence, and a more dynamic life. It must lead to the next step.

Post: #17

(10-29-2018 07:04 AM)the.king Wrote:  I spent 5 years working for 2 different big4 companies in 2 different EU countries (audit department).

Like Vincent Chase said unless they literally pay you millions, its not worth it.


I am currently busting my ass off working 7 days per week to set up my own accounting firm. I don't think I would have the motivation to do it otherwise - working as a wage cuck is so disturbing and disgusting that the idea of continue doing it motivates me to work during every single free hour of my day to be fully self-employed soon.

Also I personally think most motivational self-help advice for employees is wrong. When I was younger (I'm 30 now) I used to read a lot of RSD material etc telling you things like 'dont be a couch potato, hit the gym' 'most people watch TV to escape reality, don't be like them. Dont let your life become work-tv-sleep-repeat'. The ugly truth is that your willpower is a limited resource. Spending 45+ hours every week in the office drains the life out of you. It literally is harder to go to the gym or eat healthy.

I think you need a solid plan to escape this cycle while you're still young. I think its pointless to try and make things work in this environment. Its unnatural, its like swimming against the current.

I was one year in a accounting degree before changing to computer engineering. My father is a retired accountant and setting up your own accounting firm is one of the things I had in mind back in the day.

Right now I'm doing a gap year and backpacking with my savings. Im 28 so I can still start over in a year or two, but this year one of the things I want to do is to start my own business. I'm looking at two possible businesses right now, and one of them I only need the marketing as the product is already developed, the other one I will have to develop the product, but hey, I still have 1 year to do it.

Post: #18

I did two years of an accounting degree. My father was a top accountant and seemed to have it good. I didn't have a gap year but took 6 years out of the middle of my degree to travel, serve in the army, and run my own business.

Post: #19

I love this thread.

Working long hours for a troll consultancy bureau is just a total scam, since all you are doing is making the person you are working for like 10,000$ a month while they pay you 3,000$. All they do is "train" you in a troll academy, sometimes even make you sign a contract where you have to pay them back the training fees if you quit and then just milk you for as much billable hours as possible. You're literally making someone 100k per year in exchange for 2 months education and all of your free time, energy and work.

I can't say that I'm where I want to be yet professionally, but the trick seems to be to respect the principles of supply & demand. I got one buddy making 90 euros an hour as an independent contractor, working full-time as a blockchain java script programmer for a bank's side project. That's 14400 euros a month, with only 25% tax as he's working through his own LLC. The punchline: he's 26 and has only two years programming experience. Granted the project might be only for a year, but he really nailed the formula having 1) An efficient tax entity costing him only 25% (if it was a salary he would be paying 52% tax) 2) Picking a skill that's in demand (IT/programming) and 3) Hitting an even higher demand niche within the skill that's only really relevant right now (blockchain).

For myself I've got some interviews lined up for Microsoft Dynamics ERP Consultancy, I'm thinking Microsoft is up & coming again and Dynamics is considered more accessible than either SAP or Oracle. I can get 1-2 years experience and then just bail and start working for myself or just hop onto the next employer. This is the first industry I've applied for where I was actually treated like I was in demand as opposed to just a piece of shit graduate clone.

Post: #20

I work 45 hours a week at a sales job right now and do a bit of freelance in my often in the form of video editing or shooting weddings with my Uncle. I make about 45K a year and I'm single. I'm not complaining too hard right now, but I can't do it forever. Answering 100+ phone calls a day, arguing with my coworkers on a daily basis..... It's all accumulates in so much stress that no doubt has taken a toll on my health. (My hair has begun to thin this year and I'm 26.) Some of the people who work for my company though are total corporate slaves/drones. Kamoz post is ace. Wage slavery is a real thing and I feel bad for dude who blindly obey their corporate masters and let themselves be exploited by way of labor.

Post: #21

(10-29-2018 06:05 PM)Echovoid_52 Wrote:  I work 45 hours a week at a sales job right now and do a bit of freelance in my often in the form of video editing or shooting weddings with my Uncle. I make about 45K a year and I'm single. I'm not complaining too hard right now, but I can't do it forever. Answering 100+ phone calls a day, arguing with my coworkers on a daily basis..... It's all accumulates in so much stress that no doubt has taken a toll on my health. (My hair has begun to thin this year and I'm 26.) Some of the people who work for my company though are total corporate slaves/drones. Kamoz post is ace. Wage slavery is a real thing and I feel bad for dude who blindly obey their corporate masters and let themselves be exploited by way of labor.

Saw several studies that linked work stress to reduced life expectancy.

I noticed that there were several guys in their late 20s with thinning and white hair, and also wrinkles.

I believe some of this is genetic, but a lot of those guys just seem to be tired.

Post: #22

I don't really count the hours I'm working. I work as a transportation design engineer and I work on a project that will improve the life of 4,000,000 people, including my own life and my future family.

And I love it, yes it doesn't pay as much as it should about 85,000 $ in Montreal but life is cheap here. And I love that I'm part of a project that everybody will talk about for the next 100 years and that my own design outputs and ideas are applied...

Post: #23

I also worked at a big 4 for almost 4 years back in Australia. After graduating from the top university in the country for my bachelors degree, it was really a rude awakening. I was expecting meaningful work and something satisfying. The first year of work was brutal but also instilled a lot of discipline for me too. I was leaving the house before 7am and working late into the night, it wasn't fun especially at 21. However, I decided to slug it out at that age to build my CV. It was grueling but ultimately built a lot of character, but I definitely wouldn't be willing to go through that again though, especially on that sort of Salary in Australia.

After that I moved to Asia and took a break and taught for a couple of years whilst studying for a masters degree. As much heat as teaching gets on here, for me, It was a great switch up from the stress and deadlines of client service work in Financial Services. Of course it was just a short term thing for me whilst I studied, and towards the end of my masters I got headhunted into an industry role also in the Accounting/Finance space, these days its not as busy as what I went through back at the start of my career since I have a few assistants that do the grunt work but there are times of the year where I do get that pressure. Overall, I enjoy living abroad and working in a different environment to back home and enjoying the lower stress levels too.

Post: #24

(10-28-2018 06:39 PM)SteezeySteve Wrote:  Doesn't matter if you work 5,8,or 12 ours your day is still disturbed so who cares.

Of course this matters. 5 and 8 make a huge difference.

Post: #25

I began working as a consultant recently. It seems there is virtually no room for life outside of work and it's not uncommon to still be at work after 7pm. I'm doing this to reduce debt, invest and build up an investment income.

I hope to grind up the ladder and avoid the lifestyle inflation that goes with it. Like wearing expensive clothes to impress corporate jerks and going travelling to far flung locations for an instagram photo. Not sure how I am going to escape the horde of commoners just yet though.

One thing I have noticed having returned to the corporate environment is there's not many people with good muscle-mass or health? They mostly look sick. Many of the women are overweight and a lot of the guys have poor posture and poor muscle definition.
It seems there's this huge industry around serving office workers shitty comforting food and providing disposable services to them. You work this unbearable job and then waste most of the proceeds getting by because you don't have time to prepare decent food or step too far from the office.

Surely there is a way to game the system and benefit.