Post: #1

This will only lead to an irreversible change...

There's a thread about the Sesame Credit Score System back in 2015, and it seems that the effects have already been felt for millions of Chinese soon after trialling had begun. Imagine what could happen if the system were fully implemented across an entire country/region.

15 Million People Were Just Blacklisted from Travel by China’s Social Credit Program and It’s Coming to America Soon | Mirror Link
Intellihub Repost | Mirror Link | ScienceNordic Version | Mirror Link | Jing Travel Version | Mirror Link

Quote:

By Meadow Clark

China’s social credit system is in full swing and has already blacklisted more than 15 million Chinese residents from travel. Is it coming soon to the U.S.?

Recently, The Organic Prepper reported some shocking news of China’s newest rollout: a social credit system.

It’s a system of surveillance and governance using a social scoring system based on the state’s perceived trustworthiness of the individual. Not only are social media and financial accounts tied into a person’s “score” – much like a credit score number – but also friends and associates are compelled to distance themselves from an offending person, otherwise, their score can be dropped too.

The program is called the Sesame Score. Symbolically this represents “open sesame” or doorways that are either opened or blocked to the individual who tries to move freely.

A totalitarian dream

This is every totalitarian government’s ultimate dream: a society that polices itself, its thoughts, its beliefs and each other.

It’s the ultimate power imbalance and crushes individual will. If such a scoring system should be used it should be in cases of state or institution accountability such as checking politicians’ funding sources or Glassdoor.com where employees and interviewees can evaluate companies to let others know about the real company culture. But social scoring cannot work the other way around in a free society.

The ramifications of this are perfectly encapsulated by the episode of Netflix’s futurist show Black Mirror called “Nosedive” in season 3 episode 1, where a woman trying to boost her social credit status quickly takes a turn for the worse. Out of all the shows in the series, that episode makes my heart pound right out of my chest because it seems the most real of all the surreal dystopian themes. It’s panic-inducing to realize as you’re watching it that this nightmare is happening now and could happen to you shortly.

Although China’s social credit system had the goal of being in use by 2020, it’s already in full bloom in some regions such as Hangzhou, southwest of Shanghai. Mainstream media reported that the program is optional but that is not really the case because the very nature of the program compels people to join or “die” as you will see.

The Independent UK just reported:

Quote:Millions of Chinese nationals have been blocked from booking flights or trains as Beijing seeks to implement its controversial “social credit” system, which allows the government to closely monitor and judge each of its 1.3 billion citizens based on their behaviour and activity.

The system, to be rolled out by 2020, aims to make it “difficult to move” for those deemed “untrustworthy”, according to a detailed plan published by the government this week.

It will be used to reward or punish people and organisations for “trustworthiness” across a range of measures.

A key part of the plan not only involves blacklisting people with low social credibility scores, but also “publicly disclosing the records of enterprises and individuals’ untrustworthiness on a regular basis”.

“We will improve the credit blacklist system, publicly disclose the records of enterprises and individuals’ untrustworthiness on a regular basis, and form a pattern of distrust and punishment,” the plan states. And, if you don’t make the cut, “everywhere is limited, and it is difficult to move so that those who violate the law and lose the trust will pay a heavy price.”

And now more than 15 million people cannot travel freely.

As a result of the new social credit system, the government blocked 11.14 million residents from flights and 4.25 million from taking high-speed trains as of May.

Again, not really an “optional” program when you are literally blocked from getting on a plane.

According to Channel News Asia, China crimped luxury add-ons leaving 3 million people without business class options for train tickets.

Science Alert reported:

Quote:“This is potentially a totally new way for the government to manage the economy and society,” economist Martin Chorzempa from the Peterson Institute for International Economics told The New York Times in July.

“The goal is algorithmic governance.”

If that isn’t scary enough, the stated goal of the program according to Hou Yunchun, former deputy director of the development research center of the State Council, is to make “discredited people become bankrupt.”

What’s “good” and what’s “bad”

Some of the “good” behaviors include:

• Giving blood
• Volunteer work
• Financial good standing
  

Good behaviors can result in:

• Better loan interest rates
• Promoted profile on biggest dating site (gets you better matches)
• Discounts on utility bills like energy
• Rent appliances without deposit
• Skipping lines while traveling
  

While some of the “bad” behaviors include:

• Outstanding bills, loans, etc.
• Violating traffic laws
• Posting so-called fake news
• Paying under the table
• Buying too many video games
• Or, otherwise being an idle person and not contributing to the greater good
• Smoking in non-smoking zones (reminiscent of Demolition Man with the cussing fines)
  

Although not clearly outlined, some of the punishments for social credit infractions are thought to be:

• Blocked travel
• Slowing/throttling internet speeds
• Reducing access to good schools (both adults & children)
• Barring people from certain jobs
• Blocking them from booking at certain hotels
• Losing the right to own pets (!!!)
  

It should also be reiterated that part of the ratings come from all the people around you.

3 Reasons the Social Credit System and Potential Travel Restrictions Are Coming to America

Firstly, China is a growing world superpower. If the U.S. wants to play ball, or play other countries’ markets for that matter, they may have to acquiesce to the system. Sadly, China’s government appears to treat its nation as a “test ground” of sorts for social engineering.

Furthermore, a report by The Guardian discusses how China’s social credit system will interfere with other nations’ sovereignty. It says that the system is already shaping the behavior of foreign businesses and is “reaching beyond China’s borders to impact foreign companies.”

Secondly, as OP readers pointed out in the comments section of Daisy’s report, MyLife.com already exists.

It’s a bonafide social scoring system!

In English.

For Americans.

What started out as a “friend finder” or one of those “get a report on this person” websites, now uses social media, government information, financial accounts, personal reviews from others and more to give someone their own score. And it can be used to check for job suitability.

Quote:“Reputation is more important than credit. Only MyLife provides public Reputation Scores based on public information gathered from government, social, and other sources, plus personal reviews written by others.” – MyLife

It is now one of the top 1,000 websites in the U.S. and top 6,000 websites in the entire world at the time of this writing.

You can even look yourself up. You might be surprised to find out you’ve been scored. It will even definitively show you whether you are “good” or “bad.” Those are the actual labels you are given. Talk about omnipotence…But DO NOT provide any information, especially your email. It’s a baiting site.

Lastly, America is launching biometric retina scanners starting at Atlanta International Airport. I first saw the machines in the airport in 2012 so I knew it was only a matter of time before Real ID and retina scanners slid into normal use. We probably don’t balk at this type of news any more thanks to Facebook.

Facial recognition is tied into China’s social credit scoring as well as other unprecedented mass-scale surveillance programs.

So, yeah, social credit scoring is already here in the U.S. but it’s up to us to decide where it goes next.

Social Media: The Ultimate Social Engineering Test Simulator

If you need more proof that America is gearing up for a social credit system, just look at the one that many people – maybe even you – probably use every day. It teaches people to be divisive and block others for expressing beliefs that are different from their own or the approved social agenda.

Just think about how social media started out under the banner of self-expression and connection.

Now, look how things twisted up soon after. Facial recognition, blatant censorship, politically correct algorithms, data breaches, aggressive ads, and more. Are people heard now? Are they closer to their friends? Doubtful.

Facebook is the perfect testing ground for social policing.

It is of utmost importance that we circumvent such privacy violations as much as possible and take up a fighting stance.

I’m with Daisy on this one. Among all the battlefronts there are in the more independent communities, this one may be the most important and should be fought tooth and nail before anything else. We can’t let our children be forced to choose between being outsiders; the dregs of society with no rights or access to resources, or else totally immersed in the system; probed beyond anyone’s wildest imaginations with no real identity except one that is state-sanctioned.

Obligatory Comments Section Quotation:

Quote:

• First: you have credit scores, the government is all over them. Second: we are being watched by government on what we look at online. Third: you use debit cards, the government knows what you buy and your needs. It is already happening in the US of A only on a smaller scale.
• maybe they should call it “not my life” – it says I am a single christian democrat. i’m not any of those. scary. it’s just knowledgeable enough to be misleading. what could possibly go wrong?
  • Mylife shows me as being African American when I am white. Also shows me as living in places I have never been.
    • My experience is similar. I haven’t had access to that for a long time now, so had my husband leave a public comment about no longer having access and outlining what info was wrong on my old profile. I only hope it helps. As for my husband’s site, his situation is Similar to yours
      
• It’s already here. The department of homeland security is taking public response on a program just like the one I China and India this month. Facial recognition is being used at the white House and airports are using it. Sweden is implanting citizens with chips. That’s all I need to know.
• Saw an episode of Black Mirror called Nosedive. The story line was this exactly. .Watching it in ’16 I saw it as extreme, but possible. Now I know it’s here.
• China was originally an agrarian society and DIDN’T want to adopt the whole modern industrial way of life. She didn’t do too badly, and there was very rarely such extreme control over the people, if only because of the lack of modern technology. It was the West that forced China to leave her traditional way of life behind, and destabilised the society so greatly political opportunists such as the CCP eventually gained power. So if now China has developed this horrid system of control and it’s seriously coming to the West, the West will have only itself to blame.
  
  Call it ‘PAYBACK’.
• It is such cruelty to prevent these people from traveling on planes and trains. Around February is the biggest family holiday of their culture, the Lunar New Year, where there is a mass migration of millions of people wanting to spend the holiday with loved ones. Now these poor people can’t go home for the Lunar New Year.
• “The Nazis are well remembered for murdering well over 11 million people in the implementation of their slogan, ‘The public good before the private good,’ the Chinese Communists for murdering 62 million people in the implementation of theirs, ‘Serve the people,’ and the Soviet Communists for murdering more than 60 million people in the implementation of Karl Marx’s slogan, ‘from each according to his ability, to each according to his needs.’ Anyone who defends any of these, or any variation of them, on the grounds of their ‘good intentions’ is an immoral…enabler of the ACTUAL (not just the proverbial) road to hell.” ~ Rick Gaber
  “We are all born originals; why is it so many die copies?” ~ Edward Young
• It’s Heretics Who Save the World https://www.freemansperspective.com/its-heretics-who-save-the-world/
  

What do you think about the contents of this article?

Quote:What do you think of China’s new social credit system and travel restrictions?

Do you think it’s coming to America/Canada/Europe? Will it include travel restrictions? Sound off below!

My thoughts are that this will be attempted across the entire world and will be heavily enforced. It's said that there is a mark, but this is just a mere enforcement of the mark.

Quote:Revelation 18:3 (KJV)
3 For all nations have drunk of the wine of the wrath of her fornication, and the kings of the earth have committed fornication with her, and the merchants of the earth are waxed rich through the abundance of her delicacies.

It looks like the rage of this era is almost unstoppable now.

_______________________________________________
"It's almost at the point of no return." #231

Post: #2

Trump was right when he says in so many ways that China is the biggest modern threat.

Chinese are docile and conformist people from ages ago. Probably most suited mentally for Communist rule. They are not like French who will go and overthrow monarchs and bad rulers and demand rights. They are not like Americans who will demand individual's rights to be included in constitution.

Any economic or cultural influence China leaves on the world will lead to spread of similar patterns where government is the Great Red Dragon and an individual is totally expendable and has no rights.

We in west need (((saboteurs))) to destroy our individualism and freedom oriented societies. Chinese in the east would do it to themselves. They have been moving in that direction for centuries even before Mao and communism, this characteristic of theirs only made grounds for cultural revolution more fertile. Their long history of unification, Confucianism, dragon worship - it all leads to this.

Do not think that sweet judgement and fall and decline of the west will make the world a better place. If China takes place as Nr. 1 superpower instead of USA or Europe the freedom of the world is still threatened.

Post: #3

I think I already lost 50 credits by just reading this thread.

Post: #4

If we don't break the Silicon Valley corporations before it's too late, the same will happen to all of North America and Europe.

Post: #5

I bet a lot of those chinese on that list are citizens from the troublemaking western muslim regions/provinces like Xinjiang.
Also, in a country of over 1 billion people, 15 million is nothing.

Post: #6

...

Post: #7

Suits what's your Social Credit Score

Post: #8

@Mage, I don't understand why everyone assumes that if the US power declines then that means China will automatically take over, and will be ruthless in its treatment of the rest of the world. First of all, the world is moving towards a multi-polar direction. Most likely you will have several powerful nations but not one will act unilaterally. That means no more frivolous and illegal wars or invasions US - style. China WILL cooperate with other nations.

The argument of "if you think we're bad just wait till you get the Chinese" makes no sense. Last time I checked, China wasn't bombing the ME, promoting degeneracy and consolidating the world's wealth into Jewish hands. It's time to try something else.

Post: #9

I've never been, but I've read that Chinese people are rude as hell. There is no social convention for basic manners as are common in Western societies.

On the one hand, this idea of a social credit score sounds Orwellian. On the other hand, from what I've read it would be pretty easy to maintain a good score with this system, especially if you learned to show some basic courtesy and consideration to the people around you.

I remember reading years 20-30 years ago about a Chinese government campaign to promote basic manners and courtesy. This might be a newer way of seeking the same goal by using social media.

I think this is similar to the kind of reputation vendors and sellers have on sites like eBay, Amazon, Uber, and Airbnb. It has the potential for abuse, but it also has the potential for trustworthy people to be recognized more clearly.

The key is that when a person gets a bad score, they have to have a legitimate path to significantly improve their score with at most a few months of effort, and the penalties for having a low score shouldn't be so severe that your life is ruined and there is no way to get things going again.

Post: #10

Just wait until a feminist government implements this sort of thing in Sweden, all in the name of "safety for women". Muslim guys, of course, get a different set of standards.

Post: #11

(12-12-2018 11:24 AM)RoastBeefCurtains4Me Wrote:  I've never been, but I've read that Chinese people are rude as hell. There is no social convention for basic manners as are common in Western societies.

This is correct.
Chinese people from Hong Kong complain about "mainlanders" terrible manners, rudeness and bad habits all the time.

When you visit the great wall of china, they are announcements over loudspeaker every few minutes telling people not to ruin the great wall.

Also, I'm no vegan/vegetarian....but Chinese people's treatment of animals is horrifying. Just as an example: a type of people that sells small living animals trapped inside small plastic keychains WHICH ARE NEVER MEANT TO BE OPENED, is of a special kind of cruelty. No mercy whatsoever.

Post: #12

In China, the government directly calls the shots. In the U.S., the government serves as a front for the corporations who call the shots.

Their system isn't all that different from the one that's evolving now, where if you have "wrong" opinions you get thrown off Patreon, GoFundMe, Amazon, and other places.

Because people are mindless sheep, they're terrified when governments enacts measures to control opinion but fine when corporations do it ("It's their company, they can do what they want!").

But either way the end result is shaping people's ideas by putting the squeeze on them socially and financially. They have formal social credits, we have unspoken ones.

Post: #13

(12-12-2018 11:24 AM)RoastBeefCurtains4Me Wrote:  The key is that when a person gets a bad score, they have to have a legitimate path to significantly improve their score with at most a few months of effort, and the penalties for having a low score shouldn't be so severe that your life is ruined and there is no way to get things going again.

I'm not sure what is more dystopian - political dissidents being reduced to lifelong poverty and existence on the fringes, or being allowed to atone for it by making apologetic social media posts and supporting the government agenda in word, deed and wallet.

Remember, Winston doesn't die fighting Big Brother. By the end, he loves Big Brother.

Post: #14

Absolutely terrifying in its totalitarian perfection. Joe Average will have no defence against it whatsoever. Reminds me of when I first read about 'Slaughterbot Drones' on this very site. I get that same sinking feeling reading this - that the future is going to be hell and that citizens of tomorrow won't even be aware that there was once a better, happier time without slaughterbots and 'social credit scores'.

On the plus side, if the West opts for a similar system, but one built upon 'likes given out' by citizens, then Built to Fade can look forward to a life of cheap energy bills, no queuing and high-speed internet!

Post: #15

(12-12-2018 06:29 AM)Handsome Creepy Eel Wrote:  If we don't break the Silicon Valley corporations before it's too late, the same will happen to all of North America and Europe.

There already is a no-fly list and a terrorist watch list in the US, made up of about 3 million citizens. Nearly the same rate as China's 15 million deep list. And that doesn't include guys like Roosh, who gets denied travel rights to certain countries. Or millions more with misdemeanor records who aren't authorized to travel into the US, or from the US to Canada. So it's not like we're not there already, it's just that the water in our pot has been simmering at a slower rate, and the populace has been conditioned to accept it through false flag terror.

The US has a lot more people in prison than China, and about 6 times the incarceration rate of China, which ranks in the bottom half globally in the same range as Spain or Canada.

Ranking Title Prison Population Total
1 United States of America 2 121 600
2 China 1 649 804
3 Brazil 700 489
4 Russian Federation 571 007
5 India 419 623
6 Thailand 369 499
7 Turkey 260 000
8 Indonesia 254 052
9 Iran 230 000
10 Mexico 204 422
11 Philippines 188 278
12 South Africa 158 111
13 Vietnam 130 002
14 Colombia 119 125
15 Ethiopia 113 727
16 Egypt c. 106 000
17 Bangladesh 88 424
18 Peru 88 423
19 Pakistan 83 718
20 United Kingdom 83 146


Incarceration Rates By Country
Rank Country or Territory Number of Prisoners (Per 100,000 People)
1 United States of America 655
2 El Salvador 610
3 Turkmenistan 583
4 Virgin Islands (USA) 542
5 Maldives 514
6 Cuba 510
7 Thailand 497
8 Northern Mariana Islands (USA) 482
9 Virgin Islands (United Kingdom) 470
10 Bahamas 438
11 Seychelles 437
12 Grenada 435
13 Rwanda 434
14 Russian Federation 411
15 Guam (USA) 404
16 St. Kitts and Nevis 393
17 Panama 390
18 St. Vincent and the Grenadines 378
19 Costa Rica 374
20 Antigua and Barbuda 373
21 Belarus 364
22 Cayman Islands (United Kingdom) 359
23 Belize 356
24 Sint Maarten (Netherlands) 347
25 Palau 345

Post: #16

15 million bankrupt people. Sounds like a perfect insurgent army with people ready to die since they have nothing to lose. This is what happens when society marginalizes people.

Unlike America, these people will very much be miserable , hungry, and willing to do anything.

This social credit score will be China's down fall .

Post: #17

Thanks for reminding me to do another search on public records.

I just called in and removed the MyLife profile they had on me - CALL IN and ask them to remove it.

I usually do a google search of my name and city to make sure nothing new pops up.

So far it's been good.

Another thing you can do is place false ages, locations, etc.

Post: #18

Time to rescue Suits.

Post: #19

Now go read about Project Dragonfly, Google's joint project with the Chinese government.

Think they aren't learning from the Chinese to implement a similar system (more covertly, of course) on behalf of western governments? And it's a win-win, as the Chinese also benefit from the silencing of conservative, nationalist voices in the west.

Post: #20

^^^^
Just did this now myself--took about 15 minute, easy peasy. Make sure to confirm with them that your entire profile has been removed from MyLife---then refresh the site to make sure it's gone.

Post: #21

In the west you'll get social credits for race-mixing, and automatically flagged if you date within your race.

Post: #22

Is part of it the urge to Empire?

There's nowhere left to run to. Used to be that you got sick of your environment - say you're one of the Hatfields or McCoys who's sick of the violence - you jump on your horse and head out West.

Nowadays you'd better have horse insurance, a list of hotels you'll be staying at along the route, and make sure to carry your Internal Visa if you want to make the trip hassle free.

On the one hand, there is no "Live and let live" anymore; everybody shoves their nose into your business. At the same time, "Live and let live" is mandatory; I/We can't form a community of Christians, or of a particular ethnic group, or just a community of people that enjoy smoking in our damned bars (there are federal laws against that). We have to embrace everyone into our community, regardless of their lifestyle, while being denied the right to live as we see fit.

Everybody is feeling this pinch, but the default response is to try and restrict the other, rather than liberate the self. This creates a ratcheting effect. No free market. And no social safety net. Just coroporate tyranny.

Yes, the system can be gamed; but this selects for an elite that's effective at gaming systems. The sort of people who are experts at creating spreadsheets and databases, who will spend more time mapping the ideal loadout in a video game than they do playing it. It does no selection for creativity, prosociability, courage, or honour. Asocial, asexual, schizoids.

I'd rather spend my spare time working on my car, than gaming a system to have a series of new/leased cars for the same price; and that marks me for extinction in this brave, new world.

Post: #23

(12-12-2018 12:47 PM)Oz. Wrote:  Time to rescue Suits.

Too late for that.
Suits stopped posting on RVF a long time ago.
I hear the chinese authorities are treating him quite well with a steady supply of HB5 and HB6 "Sheng nu" and have even allowed him RVF viewing/liking rights, but he blew all his Chinese social credit when he called himself "The King of Beijing".

Post: #24

Only 15 million? I wish it were more

Post: #25

(12-12-2018 03:12 AM)Built to Fade Wrote:  Secondly, as OP readers pointed out in the comments section of Daisy’s report, MyLife.com already exists.

It’s a bonafide social scoring system!

In English.

For Americans.

What started out as a “friend finder” or one of those “get a report on this person” websites, now uses social media, government information, financial accounts, personal reviews from others and more to give someone their own score. And it can be used to check for job suitability.

Quote:“Reputation is more important than credit. Only MyLife provides public Reputation Scores based on public information gathered from government, social, and other sources, plus personal reviews written by others.” – MyLife

It is now one of the top 1,000 websites in the U.S. and top 6,000 websites in the entire world at the time of this writing.

You can even look yourself up. You might be surprised to find out you’ve been scored. It will even definitively show you whether you are “good” or “bad.” Those are the actual labels you are given. Talk about omnipotence…But DO NOT provide any information, especially your email. It’s a baiting site.

(12-12-2018 12:40 PM)kaotic Wrote:  Thanks for reminding me to do another search on public records.
[...]
Another thing you can do is place false ages, locations, etc.

(12-12-2018 01:03 PM)Buck Wild Wrote:  ^^^^
Just did this now myself--took about 15 minute, easy peasy. Make sure to confirm with them that your entire profile has been removed from MyLife---then refresh the site to make sure it's gone.

You can access MyLife (US website) here or in the original post. Depending on your views of MyLife's validity, the information you can access could make you want to blank out that period of searching.


Obviously, don't enter any details into MyLife.

For privacy reasons, I will only share links to profiles of some publicly known Americans:

• LeBron James
• Emily Ratajkowski
• Kanye West
• Taylor Swift
• Barack Obama
• Bill Clinton & Hillary Clinton
• Donald Trump
  

The information in there is incomplete at the moment, but it's a good idea to watch out for these kinds of sites in the future.
_______________________________________________

(12-12-2018 04:40 AM)Sgt Donger Wrote:  I think I already lost 50 credits by just reading this thread.

Then my credits must be in the negatives for starting this thread. It looks like I won't be able to go on an overseas adventure for a while.

(12-18-2015 05:25 PM)Dr. Howard Wrote:  Brave New World mother fuckers! This system is like an SJWs wet dream. We would all get -1000 points for being RVF members.

_______________________________________________

(12-12-2018 12:01 PM)Richard Turpin Wrote:  Absolutely terrifying in its totalitarian perfection. Joe Average will have no defence against it whatsoever. Reminds me of when I first read about 'Slaughterbot Drones' on this very site. I get that same sinking feeling reading this - that the future is going to be hell and that citizens of tomorrow won't even be aware that there was once a better, happier time without slaughterbots and 'social credit scores'.

On the plus side, if the West opts for a similar system, but one built upon 'likes given out' by citizens, then Built to Fade can look forward to a life of cheap energy bills, no queuing and high-speed internet!

I'll only get to enjoy it if the automated drones don't get me first. I don't think Kanye West will like the "likes given out" system though.

_______________________________________________

(12-12-2018 02:08 PM)Selembao Wrote:  Only 15 million? I wish it were more

Be careful what you wish because it may come true.

_______________________________________________

To those who originally posted in the "Sesame Credit - Are you an obedient citizen" thread, what do you think about its effects three years on?
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"I only trust the Book of Life when it comes to the records of a person's life story." #232