Post: #1

Just got back from a night out in a mainstream loud club here in SP.

Earlier today I was re-reading Bang and Day Bang and it got me thinking about the club scene.

I realized that 90% of the time this is what happens when I go to a loud club:

-Spend lots of $$ on transport, entrance fees and expensive booze.
-Deal with too much bitchy attitude
-Usually a Sausage fest,or at least a bad guy/girl ratio.
-In the end I usually settle for the 5/6 girl who was more open to game.Rarely I get a 7+ in a club.

for me its getting clear that the golden age of the club scene is long gone.
I'm in São Paulo,Brazil, so I think that this is true for most capitals and big cities worldwide. Night game for me from now on will be in pubs/bars or chilled venues.

When I think about my last bangs, the best ones were achieved by day game. I just don't see why I should keep going to mainstream clubs anymore.

Maybe I'm just pissed off because of my mediocre results in the club scene recently.I don't know.

But right now I'm feeling that unless you are super good looking or Rich , club game is not worth it.

Thoughts?

Post: #2

I have been saying this on here for months, if you want to score high numbers, you need to go hard on the day game.

This is the reason why i stopped going clubbing, its just not my scene anymore. I have it a lot easier in the streets doing day game, if i go to club, i will do it when everybody is about to leave, then again, i would approach the girls outside the club and try to make my night from there.

Post: #3

I can't wait till I'm old enough to get into the clubs because thats the most brutal environment to learn. Especially here in Toronto, the clubs here are brutal venues if you don't bring your A game.

But I doubt the clubs here are good for anyone who's already gotten their fair share of club game experience in unless they are very skilled.

I think club game does have its uses in many cities. I went clubbing in Stockholm and the girls were friendly.

Post: #4

High end venues will always have friendly ratios and fly girls. Roll in dressed sharp as razor blades acting like you own the joint and you'll get in. If you can't afford the booze there drink beforehand at your crib. Unless your cities clubs are spread out, live as close to the nightlife zone as possible. Ideally 10 minutes, max 15 by foot or public transport. Unfortunately Sao Paulo's subway system doesn't run at night correct?

Post: #5

Mr.GM, do you regularly try different venues? Some venue change might prove worthwhile, you might not be going to the places that fit your style best.

Post: #6

Club game is not dead. You just have to adapt.

Post: #7

(01-08-2012 02:50 AM)P Dog Wrote:  High end venues will always have friendly ratios and fly girls. Roll in dressed sharp as razor blades acting like you own the joint and you'll get in. If you can't afford the booze there drink beforehand at your crib. Unless your cities clubs are spread out, live as close to the nightlife zone as possible. Ideally 10 minutes, max 15 by foot or public transport. Unfortunately Sao Paulo's subway system doesn't run at night correct?

The subway works till midnight and re-opens at 4 am. So its possible to use it to go out,if the place you want to go is near a subway station.
Night is spread out but there are some zones with a high concentration of night clubs ans bars.I live near Vila Madalena, one of those places.


I don't know if High End places are worth it anymore, unless you have the mean$ to Show instant DHV. I don't see sense in this "competition" anymore,at least in big cities where bitch shield is high and every other dick is trying to do the same.

(01-08-2012 03:54 AM)Amour Fou Wrote:  Mr.GM, do you regularly try different venues? Some venue change might prove worthwhile, you might not be going to the places that fit your style best.

I agree 100% with you Amour,What I'm saying here is targeted against mainstream/loud clubs. Like yesterday, I was convinced by some friends to go to one of those clubs(in Vila Madalena -similar to Rio's Baixo Gávea). Although the place was more about live MPB/Rock performances than Techno/Eletronic(more common in Loud clubs) the crowd was definetely mainstream. I'll resist to go to these places again. I'm more prone to do like you do in Rio, and try different/chilled venues.
I need to go out more solo.

That said , the other thing is that I need to sharpen my game. My current skills are not sufficient to yield above mediocre (bangs in the 5/6 range) results anymore.

Post: #8

(01-08-2012 09:15 AM)Mr.GM Wrote:  I need to go out more solo.

That said , the other thing is that I need to sharpen my game. My current skills are not sufficient to yield above mediocre (bangs in the 5/6 range) results anymore.

Going out solo (especially in a foreign country) makes your balls double in size. After going out solo here (Hawaii) and facing the most hardcore sociopathic bitches I've ever dealt with in my life, everything else feels much easier.

And yes, the trick is to experiment some new grounds every once in a while, as absurd as a place can be, till you find what works for you.

I have a friend in Rio (not that wing of mine you've met) that usually hangs out at underground hip hop spots. Although hip hop is not my thing, those are the first places I'll try out upon returning home, as my friend keeps insisting girls there are much better/easier than the places I usually hang (ex: Casa da Matriz).

Be open to the new!

(ps: SP is on my radar when I return... be ready! )

Post: #9

Club game in Poland was very fruitful. Little attitude. I'm sure this will change in the future, but in a place like Poland night game will you get more bangs at faster speed.

The more Westernized a country is, the more iphones the girls have, and the more likely she's on Facebook, the lower ROI you'll get from club game.

Post: #10

Looks like night game requires a top notch body language...this guy called Cajun seems to be the cutting edge of it:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x1N57tj-Agk

Post: #11

Strict Dui laws had a lot to do with the decline of this here in the states. When I first moved to Florida I noticed on my way home from work the bars were packed and by the time I went out they were dead and the clubs were weak but the dive bars picked up later.

I asked around about this right in the beginning and the responses were that people just didn't want to risk driving late. The term strength in numbers was used a few times. So from what I see most girls go out in groups to clubs with the illusion that one of them is the designated driver(she only gets half plowed and cockblocks) but in a happy hour scenario you will see women showing up alone. Go sit in a parking lot at a busy happy hour type place and you will see. So what are your chances of pulling a girl who came with three girlfriends into a place where dudes are hardwired to run lame game and cockblock against a place were people go to decompress after work? Also, the fact that girls will reject you to show her friends that she has high standards at the club. The same girl would give you love in a different place.

My choice...Take a good look at the venues available in your area and find places that are not a nightclub but can erupt into one at a moments notice. Lets say there's a dancefloor but nobody ever uses it and a upstairs bar that's usually dead. Add a decent live band and it's on. The bad competition will be sleeping at the clubs and not have a clue a pussyfest is happening right down the road. Bitch shields are low and these places usually make cheaper stronger drinks.

Post: #12

(01-08-2012 09:35 AM)Amour Fou Wrote:  Going out solo (especially in a foreign country) makes your balls double in size. After going out solo here (Hawaii) and facing the most hardcore sociopathic bitches I've ever dealt with in my life, everything else feels much easier.

And yes, the trick is to experiment some new grounds every once in a while, as absurd as a place can be, till you find what works for you.

I have a friend in Rio (not that wing of mine you've met) that usually hangs out at underground hip hop spots. Although hip hop is not my thing, those are the first places I'll try out upon returning home, as my friend keeps insisting girls there are much better/easier than the places I usually hang (ex: Casa da Matriz).

Be open to the new!

(ps: SP is on my radar when I return... be ready! )

True. I'll force myself to improve my Solo night game. My wings here are still "locked" to the get hammered -> mainstream club/Cave man game behaviour. I have reached the point where they're more hurting than helping my game(Like Roosh correctly pointed in Bang). Too bad that we r not based in the same town bro..it would be epic , cause we have a similar approach to the game. Make sure to hit me when you come to SP, I'll definetely hit those Hip-Hop Clubs next time I get to Rio.

(01-08-2012 09:59 AM)Roosh Wrote:  Club game in Poland was very fruitful. Little attitude. I'm sure this will change in the future, but in a place like Poland night game will you get more bangs at faster speed.

The more Westernized a country is, the more iphones the girls have, and the more likely she's on Facebook, the lower ROI you'll get from club game.

And that's coming from the guy who is walking the footsteps of casanova. Another "proof" that mainstream Club Game is dying in big cities for the average guy.

In smaller cities here it stills fruitful.I'll do some datasheets about some 3rd tier Brazilian cities that I know.

(01-08-2012 11:17 AM)el mechanico Wrote:  Strict Dui laws had a lot to do with the decline of this here in the states. When I first moved to Florida I noticed on my way home from work the bars were packed and by the time I went out they were dead and the clubs were weak but the dive bars picked up later.

I asked around about this right in the beginning and the responses were that people just didn't want to risk driving late. The term strength in numbers was used a few times. So from what I see most girls go out in groups to clubs with the illusion that one of them is the designated driver(she only gets half plowed and cockblocks) but in a happy hour scenario you will see women showing up alone. Go sit in a parking lot at a busy happy hour type place and you will see. So what are your chances of pulling a girl who came with three girlfriends into a place where dudes are hardwired to run lame game and cockblock against a place were people go to decompress after work? Also, the fact that girls will reject you to show her friends that she has high standards at the club. The same girl would give you love in a different place.

My choice...Take a good look at the venues available in your area and find places that are not a nightclub but can erupt into one at a moments notice. Lets say there's a dancefloor but nobody ever uses it and a upstairs bar that's usually dead. Add a decent live band and it's on. The bad competition will be sleeping at the clubs and not have a clue a pussyfest is happening right down the road. Bitch shields are low and these places usually make cheaper stronger drinks.

Exactly.Couldn't agree more.

You know , DUI laws got very strict here in SP since last year .Maybe this can be one of the factors,I haven't tought about it.(Even though I find them necessary because of the number of killings in our streets due to drunk drivers.)

Plus cab fees in São Paulo are High as hell, what makes the ROI of night game even lower.

Post: #13

(01-08-2012 09:59 AM)Roosh Wrote:  Club game in Poland was very fruitful. Little attitude. I'm sure this will change in the future, but in a place like Poland night game will you get more bangs at faster speed.

Get it while the gettin is good, boys.

Post: #14

Mr. Gm, it sounds like you need a pep talk of sorts.

Nightlife game is a very random experience. Some nights are on, some nights are off. There are times I'm chatting up dimes. Other days, average girls act like they're too good. Important point to realize: everyone's got a different agenda for being there that may have nothing to do with you at all. Case in point, a girl goes there because she's hoping to meet some guy she has a huge crush on. How open is she to you? Not much. What can your game do? Not much.

Nightlife game requires that you bring your killer instinct A game. I went out last night, and I was going to check another spot. I couldn't find it and ended up walking five blocks aimlessly until I found it. When I got there, I decided to go home. Why? The cold just really dissipated my desire/energy, and walking aimlessly that long in cold weather didn't help. Some girl gave me a flirty look on the way there, but it didn't matter. Just like that. I knew I didn't have it. I'm not spending money just to talk to some girls not at full capacity. Whatever. Time to pack it in.

Girls have it way easier in this environment. It's obvious. We have the deck stacked against us, so you got to clear higher hurdles.

The biggest motivation to invest/continue with night game is that it is still one place where you can get away with being a man. I can't emphasize this point enough. I mean, there's girls in my other settings that are interested, but if I were to fuck and chuck 'em, I'd get some serious blowback, you know? I don't know to what extent Brazil is like America, but being a player is universally condemned in most work/educational/social settings in the USA. I hate this country.

Post: #15

(01-08-2012 03:00 PM)scorpio Wrote:  The biggest motivation to invest/continue with night game is that it is still one place where you can get away with being a man. I can't emphasize this point enough. I mean, there's girls in my other settings that are interested, but if I were to fuck and chuck 'em, I'd get some serious blowback, you know? I don't know to what extent Brazil is like America, but being a player is universally condemned in most work/educational/social settings in the USA. I hate this country.

Thanks for your input bro.
São Paulo is definetely "westernized" , so there is lots of similarities to the life in a big city in America.
But here (and in latin culture in general) day game / cold approach is somewhat accepted , I'll give you that.No one will automatically think that you are a stalker/serial killer just because you flirt with a beautiful girl outside of a night club,unless you do something disturbing/too aggressive.People see it as "A Man's duty" to approach hot girls.

Don't hate your country, from what I've read here, day game works well in the US and being a player is more accepted than in places like Germany/Norway/Sweden etc were people tend to be more introverted ,"closed".

Post: #16

A lot of guys bash clubs. Depending on the club, I pull quality. Here's why.

Look around the club. Eveyr guy looks the same. It/'s like there's a uniform. Designer jeans, black shoes, and dress shirt (with sleeves rolled up). That, or Afflction gear.

Every guy looks like every other guy.

I have a lot of personal style, and do not look like the rest of the guys.

So I always pull.

Go out in a custom suit with a pocket square and pink dress shirt. Then see if rumors of club game's death have been greatly exaggerated.

Post: #17

(01-08-2012 06:34 PM)MikeCF Wrote:  A lot of guys bash clubs. Depending on the club, I pull quality. Here's why.

Look around the club. Eveyr guy looks the same. It/'s like there's a uniform. Designer jeans, black shoes, and dress shirt (with sleeves rolled up). That, or Afflction gear.

Every guy looks like every other guy.

I have a lot of personal style, and do not look like the rest of the guys.

So I always pull.

Go out in a custom suit with a pocket square and pink dress shirt. Then see if rumors of club game's death have been greatly exaggerated.

+1 on this.

I'll also add for better results, roll dolo early in the week, and use a wingwoman on the weekends.

Post: #18

Great info btw.
Mike, where do you usually go out? Did you go for mainstream/big clubs or you usually hit high end spots , hotel bars etc?
I generally "pull" in clubs as well , but not in the quality that I want. Would say honestly that you are pulling regularly girls above 8?

Post: #19

(01-08-2012 06:34 PM)MikeCF Wrote:  A lot of guys bash clubs. Depending on the club, I pull quality. Here's why.

Look around the club. Eveyr guy looks the same. It/'s like there's a uniform. Designer jeans, black shoes, and dress shirt (with sleeves rolled up). That, or Afflction gear.

Every guy looks like every other guy.

I have a lot of personal style, and do not look like the rest of the guys.

So I always pull.

Go out in a custom suit with a pocket square and pink dress shirt. Then see if rumors of club game's death have been greatly exaggerated.

I mean, there are so many ways to pull a club, but yes it's all about standing out.

Dressing with a custom suit is going to get you girls more interested in class and money, which generally means hot women over 25. I definitely see myself doing this someday.

My dancing game occasionally gets older women, but it's so much more effective on girls under 25.

Both custom suits and dancing, just to name two examples (there are many other ways to game, for example: be the club DJ) are ways to stand apart from other men.

And that's what it boils down to:


The right venue + standing out with a certain type of game = pulling a certain type of woman.


If you go to a shitty venue or don't have a solid game plan, you're fucked. Think of a creative way to stand apart from all the other men and go for the score.

Don't go to clubs and expect to talk your way into a girl's pants. That's just newb, talking game is the bare minimum to get laid, every guy needs something else going for him if he wants pussy.

Mr.GM Wrote:I generally "pull" in clubs as well , but not in the quality that I want. Would say honestly that you are pulling regularly girls above 8?

Quality is always the number one issue, isn't it?

Fucking totally right, I hate it when I go to a club and none of the girls really turn me on. Feels like my entire night is wasted.

The real challenge of game isn't fucking girls, but fucking hot girls.

That's why I envy men who can get boners for ugly girls or fat chicks. Even gay men, to an extent. For them it's literally an all-you-can-eat pussy buffet.

Post: #20

(01-08-2012 07:14 PM)Mr.GM Wrote:  Great info btw.
Mike, where do you usually go out? Did you go for mainstream/big clubs or you usually hit high end spots , hotel bars etc?
I generally "pull" in clubs as well , but not in the quality that I want. Would say honestly that you are pulling regularly girls above 8?

When rolling dolo: Not Hollywood style clubs. I go to clubs with good music (not house music, old women are house music fans) and where bottle service is minimized.

I like to drink and dance, and especially dance after drinking. I have supreme confidence, and get girls dancing within a few minutes of meeting, and am making out within 30-40.

The venues (good music, good dance floor, no bottle service) means you get young girls, who are struggling on their 30-40K salaries. They are not bottle skanks, since there's no bottle tables. They want to dance, have fun, but don't have much cash. They are bitchy like "independent" women who have stupid HR or marketing careers.

I have great fucking style. I rock cowboy boots. I've put together an outfit with a cardigan with a cowboy hat. I'm also good looking - not a model, but a 7 looks wise, and in the right outfit, close to an 8.

I rolled in a bar, saw a girl dancing alone, within 5 minutes was making out with her. My friend overheard two guys, "Does he know her?" They didn't understand what happened, since they had seen guy after guy get rejected.

When with my crew: My friends and I do OK money wise, so when we want to party, we can go big. We even hire our private bodyguard to walk with us, walk to our table, and grab girls for us. We'll get bottles, where hanging out is #1 priority.

Then girls come over, and we always bang the best of the bar.

Game is better than money, but don't believe the hype. Money and game is way better than just game.

So when guys complain about clubs, I'd like to know two things: What are you wearing and what's your bank roll?

Post: #21

(01-08-2012 06:34 PM)MikeCF Wrote:  A lot of guys bash clubs. Depending on the club, I pull quality. Here's why.

Look around the club. Eveyr guy looks the same. It/'s like there's a uniform. Designer jeans, black shoes, and dress shirt (with sleeves rolled up). That, or Afflction gear.

Every guy looks like every other guy.

I have a lot of personal style, and do not look like the rest of the guys.

So I always pull.

Go out in a custom suit with a pocket square and pink dress shirt. Then see if rumors of club game's death have been greatly exaggerated.

Well said.

I don't really go to big clubs too much anymore.

I go to:

Hotel bars
High-end restaurant bars
Street Game at night (so key, been meaning to write on this for a while)
Lounges or Smaller clubs that are hard to get into with good ratios

Try those on for size and tell me Night Game is dead.

Quote:Game is better than money, but don't believe the hype. Money and game is way better than just game.

So when guys complain about clubs, I'd like to know two things: What are you wearing and what's your bank roll?

Sh*t.

I have been saying this for years on mostly deaf ears.

Post: #22

(01-08-2012 11:53 PM)thegmanifesto Wrote:  I go to:

Hotel bars
High-end restaurant bars
Street Game at night (so key, been meaning to write on this for a while)
Lounges or Smaller clubs that are hard to get into with good ratios

Definitely looking forward to a post on item #3. Totally agree with #1 and #2. "Hard to get into" probably excludes me at the moment from #4.

Post: #23

gman, i like your thinking. i think im starting to see this more often as well in my adventures. definitely need to do more of the suiting up and seeing how that changes the game.

Post: #24

Clubs can be great especially when in a place like Brazil where it is normal to kiss a girl very soon after getting to know her. There's no better place to make the move fast than in a club environment. It's rare you'll meet a girl and land a kiss within 5 minutes during the day, but at a club in Brazil, it's not rare to kiss a girl within a minute of meeting her.

Post: #25

(01-08-2012 09:35 AM)Amour Fou Wrote:  

(01-08-2012 09:15 AM)Mr.GM Wrote:  I need to go out more solo.

That said , the other thing is that I need to sharpen my game. My current skills are not sufficient to yield above mediocre (bangs in the 5/6 range) results anymore.

Going out solo (especially in a foreign country) makes your balls double in size. After going out solo here (Hawaii) and facing the most hardcore sociopathic bitches I've ever dealt with in my life, everything else feels much easier.

And yes, the trick is to experiment some new grounds every once in a while, as absurd as a place can be, till you find what works for you.

I have a friend in Rio (not that wing of mine you've met) that usually hangs out at underground hip hop spots. Although hip hop is not my thing, those are the first places I'll try out upon returning home, as my friend keeps insisting girls there are much better/easier than the places I usually hang (ex: Casa da Matriz).

Be open to the new!

(ps: SP is on my radar when I return... be ready! )

Is Hawaii a difficult place to game? I will be visiting there later this wear and was wondering what kind of gaming climate the place is like.