Ah ok thancks , I will check this out , it's more interesting now .

I just filled in a form for a permanent visa at a Dutch/Canadian visa agency. I will hear from them in a few days if i can aply for a permanet Canadian visa. Otherwise i can apply for a temporary worker visa since my education is on the POL ( Priority Occupation List ) I'm a skilled carpenter. well, i was many years ago.

I guess once i'm there i could switch jobs if i find something better paying.

@scotian, i just found this site http://www.cra-arc.gc.ca/tx/ndvdls/fq/txrts-eng.html
According to this i only pay 26 % if i make less than 132k. And 29% above that ( i wish)

Is that correct ? In Holland i used to pay 42% income tax. its 52% if you make big bucks.

is Canada really that low on income tax ? That means i pocket 74k on a 100k salary.

The provincial tax rate for alberta is only 10 %. Whats the difference between provincial and federal ?. Do i need to pay both ?

Damn, i do have a criminal record. That might be a problem. Although its been 12 years since my last conviction and it didn't give an problems landing a nice office job..

Canada has much lower taxes on personal income relative to Western Europe owing to a far smaller welfare state. Government spending as a share of the economy is roughly one-third in Canada, whereas in most of Western Europe it's roughly around half. Canada, the USA, and Australia are low tax countries compared to you guys.

Like Germany and America, Canada is a federal state. Many government functions are handled by the provinces. For instance, the provision of healthcare is a provincial responsibility in Canada. The provincial rate goes to the provincial government, and yes you need to pay both the province and the federal government. Fortunately Alberta has quite low taxes owing to their massive oil wealth.

(01-24-2012 01:10 PM)Thorfinnsson Wrote:  Canada has much lower taxes on personal income relative to Western Europe owing to a far smaller welfare state. Government spending as a share of the economy is roughly one-third in Canada, whereas in most of Western Europe it's roughly around half. Canada, the USA, and Australia are low tax countries compared to you guys.

Like Germany and America, Canada is a federal state. Many government functions are handled by the provinces. For instance, the provision of healthcare is a provincial responsibility in Canada. The provincial rate goes to the provincial government, and yes you need to pay both the province and the federal government. Fortunately Alberta has quite low taxes owing to their massive oil wealth.

Thank you for your quick answer. Yep, taxes are high in Holland. The government feels the need to decide everything for us citizens.

We used to take care of people from cradle to grave but that's ending now. Too much government spending on bottomless pits such as immigration and Europe.

Scotian - I have misdameanor offenses on my record. Nothing serious at all though. I'm guessing only felonies will hold you back? I hope shit I did as a young buck won't fuck this up for me.

(01-24-2012 02:07 PM)houston Wrote:  Scotian - I have misdameanor offenses on my record. Nothing serious at all though. I'm guessing only felonies will hold you back? I hope shit I did as a young buck won't fuck this up for me.

Same here and mine weren't even minor but no jail time. That's nearly impossible in Holland

A young guy punched a cop in the face 6 times a few weeks ago and his sentence was 40 hours community work and a small fine. What a joke !!

Guys I'm not too sure about how a criminal record will fuck up your chances of coming to work in Canada, but I do know of a guy from the States was refused entry to Canada because of a DUI he picked up years before. This guy had all of his papers lined up, he was working for the same company as he does in the states, he was just coming up for a month or two to help out, and they turned him away! You'll likely need to get some kind of pardon before you can come.

Neil, check out these websites, they are major construction firms that employ thousands of Carpenters in Alberta:

http://www.clarkbuilders.com/
http://www.pcl.com/

Also, you can ask the Carpenter's union about working in the oil sands: http://www.workunion.ca/UBC/

(01-24-2012 02:46 PM)scotian Wrote:  Guys I'm not too sure about how a criminal record will fuck up your chances of coming to work in Canada, but I do know of a guy from the States was refused entry to Canada because of a DUI he picked up years before. This guy had all of his papers lined up, he was working for the same company as he does in the states, he was just coming up for a month or two to help out, and they turned him away! You'll likely need to get some kind of pardon before you can come.

Neil, check out these websites, they are major construction firms that employ thousands of Carpenters in Alberta:

http://www.clarkbuilders.com/
http://www.pcl.com/

Also, you can ask the Carpenter's union about working in the oil sands: http://www.workunion.ca/UBC/

Thanks for all the info.
Look at these union wages, even for scaffolder
-------------------------------------------------
Good pay for great work!
Currently, our Carpenter and Scaffolder members receive the following basic pay:

Journeyman (Industrial) $38.63/hr
Journeyman (Commercial) $34.29/hr

When you add 10% vacation pay and fully employer-paid pension, health & welfare and training contributions, the total pay package works out to:

Journeyman (Industrial) $51.04
Journeyman (Commercial) $42.84
-------------------------------------------------

My criminal record dates from 2000 and before, been a good boy ever since it didnt give any problems when i applied for my office job, i had to show some justice department paper to the HRM and i was sweating. I got the paper in the mail and it didnt say anything about my record, they gave me the job.

Ill check all the links you gave me tomorrow morning. Thanks again

I've done some research on the visa issue and found this site:

http://www.international.gc.ca/experienc...spx?view=d

Its a government programme called "International Experience Canada" if you're under 35 and come from one of the many countries listed above (Netherlands and Ireland are there but not the USA, shitty!), you can come and work in Canada for up to a year. Its probably very easy to qualify for, so guys from the UK or Europe can apply, I don't know why we don't have similar agreements with the States, maybe we do?

Neil, those tax rates seem about right, but I'm sure that as a foreigner, you would actually be reimbursed a lot more at the end of the year since you wouldn't be a permanent resident, another thing to look into.

A good opinion piece about skilled Americans coming to work in Canada:

http://www.troymedia.com/blog/2011/10/05...r-alberta/

From the article: "Americans need jobs and Alberta needs workers. A similar culture, language, and geographic proximity can simplify the process of bringing U.S. workers north. What’s lacking is a history of labour mobility. With an appropriate framework in place that makes recruitment and integration more seamless the available labour pool could be greatly enlarged"

how experienced a welder do you have to be to get a job with one of the companies up there? Certified obviously but is there a threshold of years of experience they demand?

I'd be all over this is I had a trade. Growing up I wanted to be an electrician or mechanic, but of course I was brainwashed into the 'you have to go to college or you won't amount to anything' route. I could care less about living in a work camp or shitty conditions, I'd do it for the cash. I looked at some of the companies you posted and it still seems like they require some experience. If I could take courses for 6 months in a trade and it guaranteed me a job there I'd definitely go for it.

(01-25-2012 06:43 PM)Neo Wrote:  I'd be all over this is I had a trade. Growing up I wanted to be an electrician or mechanic, but of course I was brainwashed into the 'you have to go to college or you won't amount to anything' route. I could care less about living in a work camp or shitty conditions, I'd do it for the cash. I looked at some of the companies you posted and it still seems like they require some experience. If I could take courses for 6 months in a trade and it guaranteed me a job there I'd definitely go for it.

I passed the info on to my brother and he told me that everything seems to require some level of experience, of which he has none.

Scotian any advice?

yeah i just PM'd scotian on this.Im sure he'l give us more info

First off, thanks for taking the time to post all that great information. I know a lot of members from this site will get a lot out of that.

Second, my background:

- I'm a US Citizen
- I've got a bachelor's degree in business & economics
- Most jobs I've taken since graduating (in 2006) have been labor intensive, however, none have been in a specific trade. I suppose the most relevant work I've done is some auditing for the auto industry.
- I presently work for an airline, so I could easily travel up there to 'check it out'

So, my question is, would I be qualified to get a blue collar job in the oil fields? If not, would my background possibly qualify me for a white collar job helping to run the business in the oil fields?

I'm curious as to what type of opportunity I'd have to make some serious money here. I doubt I'd spend an eternity up there, although it would be nice to be somewhere that appreciates hockey as much as I do. Course, I suppose I am in one of the two US cities that actually does like hockey, but our employment rate is atrocious, and I need better options.

(01-25-2012 03:34 PM)raliv Wrote:  how experienced a welder do you have to be to get a job with one of the companies up there? Certified obviously but is there a threshold of years of experience they demand?

You don't need any experience in theory(it definitely won't hurt!), you could get hired on as a welder's helper, basically a labourer's job, you'd make around $20/hr starting out and if you played your cards right, the company would enlist you into the provincial apprenticeship programme. After about 6 months of field work, you'd to to school for 6-8 weeks and do this 3 times over the course of 3-4 years, after each school session you'd get a raise until you hit the top journey man rate, which in most trades is $40-45/hour, plus about $6hr into you pension. So if you're 18, by the time you're 21-22 you WILL (theres no grey area here!) be making about 150K, you'll get paid to go to school and make big money during your 4 year apprecticeship, I have a friend who is 25 and hasn't made less than 100K/year since he was 17!

Or, you could take a Bachelor of Arts in basket weaving and women's studies and graduate with 30K in debt!

As for Americans or anyone else, you'd have to prove your skills when you get to Canada through some tests. I'm not too familiar with that process, but if they can bring in a few thousand Filipino and Indian welders each year, I imagine they'll recognize USA certificates. Welders would likely need their B pressure ticket and all other processes (SMAW,GMAW,FCAW,TIG,etc), for more info you can check out the American Welding Society ( http://www.aws.org).

Welding is an excellent trade, contract rig welders in the Mac make $100-120/hr, 80-100 hrs week, do the math on a 24 on 4 off rotation! Warning, welding ain't for pussies, its a trade many guys learn IN JAIL! lol, there's so much riff raff in the trades, its great....this isn't the place to work if you have thin skin or are easily offended, working in the trades esp. in fort mac, is like being in a locker room all the time. Its a male dominated environment, not many women around you don't have to walk on egg shells, worrying about offending anyone, I get told to fuck off and tell other guys to go fuck themselves multiple times everyday, wouldn't have it any other way!

Great post man. I hate to keep repeating the 'will this experiance work for me' question but I have a degree in Marketing. WTF can I do up there?

(01-26-2012 12:18 AM)CJ Wrote:  First off, thanks for taking the time to post all that great information. I know a lot of members from this site will get a lot out of that.

Second, my background:

- I'm a US Citizen
- I've got a bachelor's degree in business & economics
- Most jobs I've taken since graduating (in 2006) have been labor intensive, however, none have been in a specific trade. I suppose the most relevant work I've done is some auditing for the auto industry.
- I presently work for an airline, so I could easily travel up there to 'check it out'

So, my question is, would I be qualified to get a blue collar job in the oil fields? If not, would my background possibly qualify me for a white collar job helping to run the business in the oil fields?

I'm curious as to what type of opportunity I'd have to make some serious money here. I doubt I'd spend an eternity up there, although it would be nice to be somewhere that appreciates hockey as much as I do. Course, I suppose I am in one of the two US cities that actually does like hockey, but our employment rate is atrocious, and I need better options.

Interesting background

You could join the health and safety field. Safety is mainly about auditing and inspecting areas, sites, scaffolders, tanks, etc

Because you have done auditing for the auto industry, that would qualify you as having experience.

There is this sunderland university ( in the UK) that runs a post graduation course online, with that degree in hands i think you could easily join the oil industry.

(01-25-2012 06:43 PM)Neo Wrote:  I'd be all over this is I had a trade. Growing up I wanted to be an electrician or mechanic, but of course I was brainwashed into the 'you have to go to college or you won't amount to anything' route. I could care less about living in a work camp or shitty conditions, I'd do it for the cash. I looked at some of the companies you posted and it still seems like they require some experience. If I could take courses for 6 months in a trade and it guaranteed me a job there I'd definitely go for it.

I graduated with a BA after 5 years of uni in 06', I worked at a call centre getting bitched at people whose cell phones were smarter than them, at $12/hr, I made $24G in 07' back east.

I took a chance and moved to Alberta with $1500 to my name took a 12 week pre-employment at a community college (look up Lethbridge college,SAIT,Red Deer College, NAIT, Keyano college).

08' grossed 65K- 10K in pension 2 months layoff AKA party! (remember when oil plunged big time?)
09' grossed 80- 13k in pension 3 weeks vacation (in the middle of the worst recession in decades, I couldn't get any more time off work we were so busy!)
10'(started working in Fort Mac) -grossed 120K 22K in pension 5 weeks off
11-Grossed around 135-140K, forget pension (25K?), 3 months off!

Guys those numbers are low, I took some easy low paying (good experience though) jobs for lifestyle reasons, I know many guys in Fort Mac who are MACHINES and work 24 on 4 off ALL YEAR (maybe 1 or 2 weeks off, max!), and gross 250-350K, power to those guys but I don't think its really worth it to work that much, I'd rather work 6 months and take my 100K then peace out!

Damn I'm giving you guys some handy intel here, I wonder how many will make the move?

I just hope that guys, especially Canadians, who think about moving out, or know someone who is interested, will do so, I'd love to work with more people who read forums like this and have similar interests and less meat heads like these guys (from the movie FUBAR):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4iZqfzQmr...re=related (that plant is Syncrude, you can see the camp at 0:17)

"The workers comp hustle": http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aBAmItGEx...re=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mceMfWmJp...re=related

Those videos accurately reflect the types of shit heads I work with on a regular basis!

(01-26-2012 12:45 AM)pitt Wrote:  

(01-26-2012 12:18 AM)CJ Wrote:  First off, thanks for taking the time to post all that great information. I know a lot of members from this site will get a lot out of that.

Second, my background:

- I'm a US Citizen
- I've got a bachelor's degree in business & economics
- Most jobs I've taken since graduating (in 2006) have been labor intensive, however, none have been in a specific trade. I suppose the most relevant work I've done is some auditing for the auto industry.
- I presently work for an airline, so I could easily travel up there to 'check it out'

So, my question is, would I be qualified to get a blue collar job in the oil fields? If not, would my background possibly qualify me for a white collar job helping to run the business in the oil fields?

I'm curious as to what type of opportunity I'd have to make some serious money here. I doubt I'd spend an eternity up there, although it would be nice to be somewhere that appreciates hockey as much as I do. Course, I suppose I am in one of the two US cities that actually does like hockey, but our employment rate is atrocious, and I need better options.

Interesting background

You could join the health and safety field. Safety is mainly about auditing and inspecting areas, sites, scaffolders, tanks, etc

Because you have done auditing for the auto industry, that would qualify you as having experience.

There is this sunderland university ( in the UK) that runs a post graduation course online, with that degree in hands i think you could easily join the oil industry.

Pitt, good info man, safety is very fast growing industry, its huge in the oil sands, actually I find it a bit much when I have to do a half an hour of paper work and safety checks before I do a simple task that takes 20 seconds, but oh well, I'm paid by the hour!

For anyone looking into getting into safety, check out these to companies: http://www.hseintegrated.com/ and http://www.unitedsafety.net/

I know for a fact that these two companies hire inexperienced newbies off the street, probably $18-22/hour doing safety watch for confined space entry, gas monitoring in vessels, ensuring SCBA/SABA ensuring oxygen cylinders are full and maintained, etc.

Also, those other 2 I mention, clean harbors and and CEDA hire guys off the street.

Guys the bar is low here for workers, if you can pass a piss test, wake up at 5am and go to work, you've got it made. Take those 2 safety courses I wrote about above and call different companies, its not that complicated, this year will be THE BUSIEST in Fort Mac since the last boom.

CJ, you'll have to look more into the visa requirements, but our immigration system goes on points and with a uni degree and English language skills, you should be good to go. You don't necessarily have to work in Fort Mac either, lots of well paying office jobs in places like Edmonton and Calgary (which is home to over 30,000 expat Americans).

Try looking into multinational USA companies that have OPS in Canada.

From the United Safety website (career section): http://careers.unitedsafety.net/2012/01/....html#more


Tuesday, January 10, 2012

We're hiring! Spread the word!
Filed under: Alberta, EHS Coordinator, Foreman, Ft. McMurray, H2S Safety Supervisor, Now Hiring, Register for this position, Safety Careers, Safety Jobs, Safety Technician, Safety Watch
We have hundreds of open positions we are looking to fill! Are you interested in a career in safety services? Contact us and introduce yourself. We're hiring junior and senior positions.

We're ramping up for March 1 and we have a positions that will suit your level of experience. We're looking for candidates who have no safety experience, we'll train you and start you on your way. We're looking for candidates who have worked in the energy sector, and are looking for careers in safety services. We're looking for experienced safety personnel for leadership positions. We've got a position for anyone who's motivated to start or develop their career in safety services.

Learn more about United Safety at UnitedSafety.net

Apply for this position:
Form: Fill out the form on this page, in "job title" indicate the position you are applying for (if not sure, put "Safety Watch").
Email your resume: [email protected]
Fax: (403) 948-5190
Mail: United Safety Ltd.
Attn: Recruitment & Training
104 East Lake Road NE
Airdrie, AB T4A 2J8

We thank all applicants for their interest in United Safety. All resumes will be reviewed and short-listed candidates will be contacted.

“Working safe is a condition of employment.” United Safety is an equal opportunity employer and encourages a diverse workforce.


THERE YOU GO INEXPERIENCED GUYS (espeically Canadians): if you want to work an insane amount of hours from March til about mid-November (18-22/hr), apply to this job, get a few bucks together and move out to Alberta. They may even fly you out, they will train you, house you and feed you (you will have 0 expenses, just don't party too hard and piss it away!)....go work 7-9 months, save about 3k per month (you can save 20K EASY), then come party with me in Thailand next winter!

You're welcome.

As scotian said, i am also really wondering who is going to move there after all this info provided by scotian.

If i wasnt working in the safety field now, i would be flying my ass to Fort Mac so i could work there in any type of position. But i am wondering who here will have the balls to make a move to Fort Mac. Guys thinking of doing it, just dont be scaried to fail, take 5k dollars as pocket money and you should be fine.

Soon as you arrive in Fort Mac and you dont find a job, just get any type of work you can find. I believe the macdonalds there or any type of bar jobs pay quiet good (15 dollars per hour minimum if im not mistaken), so do any type of job till you get that job in the oil field.

Specially the younger ones, dont be scaried to try it, MAN up.

Hey Americans, I forgot all about this place, you guys have your own Fort Mac style boom town in you own back yard, Williston North Dakota!

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/11/26/us/nor...wanted=all

The Bakken oil field (which stretches into Canada) is huge and crazy busy now, if you really want to get into the oil biz, why not move there, get the experience and make some good, quick cash then explore other options, such as working in Canada. Remember, if you want to come to Canada, the visa process can be a very loooong one, it could be a year or more before you get one!

One thing though, this is a different type of oil than we have in Fort Mac, its mostly rig work there if I'm not mistaken, Fort Mac is oil sands mining with on-site upgraders and refineries, I personally would never work on an oil rig!!!

I'm almost positive that I'm going to get into this. I'm just trying to decide how and when ito do it since I'm in school. I'm not down with just going up there without a job waiting for me.