(05-20-2014 05:19 PM)Greek kamaki Wrote:  The easiness of the Russian girls is directly related to oil prices. Only when oil price falls under 60$ per barrel will Russia become better than Poland or Ukraine.

Short Rosneft Stock Game:

Roosh - do you get questions of "where are your friends", especially when you are talking to younger (students) girls? If yes, how do you deal with it?

(05-20-2014 05:19 PM)Greek kamaki Wrote:  The easiness of the Russian girls is directly related to oil prices.Only when oil price falls under 60$ per barrel will Russia become better than Poland or Ukraine.

You mean you won't have to give such large padarack?

I live in MOS for the summer so in case any of you would be down for drinks.. shoot me a PM

(05-20-2014 05:50 PM)whoishe Wrote:  Roosh - do you get questions of "where are your friends", especially when you are talking to younger (students) girls? If yes, how do you deal with it?

I've developed a new tactic to deal with that. My first approach in the club is on a guy. I have small talk with him, maybe buy him a shot. Then later, when a girl asks me who I'm with, I point to him. I don't say he's a good friend, just an acquaintance, and they don't inquire further. Being solo in the club does demonstrate low value here.

To expand on my update yesterday, I'm learning that a strong initial reaction is not necessarily good. Two approaches I did today serve a good example.

First girl showed strong initial interest, asking me personal questions off the bat. She was expressive and smiley, but the energy of the conversation died down towards the end and she didn't give me the number (that surprised me).

Second girl (same beauty level) showed almost no initial interest. She didn't ask me questions and wasn't giving strong eye contact. She was very stoic and emotionless. But she stayed put as I rambled on and eventually gave me the number, along with detail on when she would be free. This mirrors what I experienced in Ukraine.

Selecting for positive initial response (day or night) seems not to be the wise move. I don't fully understand why, but my best guess is that if a girl gives you a strong positive emotional response, you need to close the deal while she's still on that high (i.e. same day/night). If a girl gives you no emotion and is stoic she will likely come through on future dates, because she's making a firm logical decision to get to know you, which will not fade right away. In Ukraine I had bangs with these stoic types. In Poland I had a greater mix of emotional ones, leading to a lot of one-night stands.

On a language note, I open 90% in Russian both day and night. Every day my Russian is improving greatly because so few girls speak English. Even if this city ends up being a dud for me (it could go either way at this point), I will stay a while for that reason alone.

(05-21-2014 06:54 AM)Roosh Wrote:  

(05-20-2014 05:50 PM)whoishe Wrote:  Roosh - do you get questions of "where are your friends", especially when you are talking to younger (students) girls? If yes, how do you deal with it?

I've developed a new tactic to deal with that. My first approach in the club is on a guy. I have small talk with him, maybe buy him a shot. Then later, when a girl asks me who I'm with, I point to him. I don't say he's a good friend, just an acquaintance, and they don't inquire further. Being solo in the club does demonstrate low value here.

Sounds good. And I agree 100% about solo=low value in Lviv as well.

But yesterday I've got a questioned this way when I approached 3 girls when they were switching clubs.

Btw, is there a specific term/name for game when you approach girls during the night, but you do it outside of the clubs, usually in situation when they are moving from one club to another? I am thinking "Night game" is "inside the club area" only, but maybe I am wrong?

I experienced pretty much everything Roosh mentioned about Russian girls! After living here for 5 months now I realize it's not a good country for hook ups! It's a great country to find a wife!
American mentality on dating puts us in disadvantage. I'll explain: I can message several girls right now and ask them to come walk in the park,hand in hand - it means nothing to them! Yet it would be a romantic date in my mind. That's just what it is for her - a walk in the park! A trip to a Walmart is a date in America but here you have to call it! Many couples get engaged before any sex took place and then start dating. You like a girl - you come to her and propose to start dating.
Initial good response means nothing! I opened and talked for over 30 girls for half an hour minimum only to find out she is married or has a bf sitting two feet away from us. They give you their number - no problem! But you are not getting sex!
Saying " I like you and I want to be with you" is the first step it seems. If she doesn't run away - you are getting somewhere! - this needs to be verified but that's what I think.
The only indication you are getting laid is if she comes to your apartment!

My other observations :

Girls are not desperate for a man. They become more westernized every passing year. Many wait into their 30s to have children and get married. Being western means nothing at all to them. I have yet to meet one girl who has a different view (from Putin's propaganda) on politics. Sometimes I think that's how North Korea is - everyone thinks exactly the same! Brainwashing works! I have not met ONE gay person - and I am all around arts and dancing. Strange,right?

Okay okay,.. after reading this I'm short before quiting to learn the russian language..

Even though my observations have to be put into the right spotlight as I live in Moscow (which many Russians do not consider to be "Real Russia" in terms of overall societal identity), I would have to confirm what other posted before. A western influence is clearly visible with women visiting posh or upper-class clubs on a regular basis.

Further, what I find to be quite interesting: In my opinion Russian girls tend to higher value feeling "secure" with a men, i.e. if they look like dumb body-builders. I for instance had high success rates with semi-pro and pro-models in Milan and Paris, however, do feel at disadvantage as I am rather skinny and not interested in gaining extensive masses of muscle.

Here, overall beauty is less important: Most important is an economic security and overall body shape (more like 90's overdone body builder). However, this is really subjective as Mos is such a metropolitan city that you can find all types and characters of women

(05-21-2014 11:58 AM)Wayout Wrote:  My other observations :

Girls are not desperate for a man. They become more westernized every passing year. Many wait into their 30s to have children and get married. Being western means nothing at all to them. I have yet to meet one girl who has a different view (from Putin's propaganda) on politics. Sometimes I think that's how North Korea is - everyone thinks exactly the same! Brainwashing works! I have not met ONE gay person - and I am all around arts and dancing. Strange,right?

The Russian girls I've dealt with in LA have put me through the ringer before sex.

Note: these girls I dated/fucked were straight from Russia and had only been in LA anywhere from 3 months up to 1 year, but they all displayed the same attitude etc.

-Had one girl literally throw a fit when I said she could pay for the first drink at a dive bar we were at. She got so upset almost to the point of tears that I would expect her to pay. I wound up walking out of the bar and she chased after in the parking lot. I calmed her down and we resumed the 'date' (wasn't our first) and she was fine.

-ALL of the girls responded very well to my dominance and Frame, but my sarcasm and 'jerkiness' wasn't as appreciated. I had to to tone down my 'game' and just be dominant, but nice.

-The amount of hoops I jumped through to get my 1st Russian flag was insane. It got to the point where I told her "You're nothing but a tease and therefore a waste of my time". She then folded.

-The sex is different. It's hard to put my finger on it, but I would say it's more intimate like and in all of my instances they definitely wanted pillow talk and to sleep over.

-The girls are so damn pretty it's almost worth jumping through some hoops.

-Immediately following sex with 3 different girls (seperately) they each brought up relationships and a 'future'. While it was refreshing to see girls still want to be exclusive, something I see rapidly disappearing from Western girls, I wasn't ready to settle down obviously and once they found that out got pissed as hell.

-One of them quickly got married after me and moved back to Moscow.

-The others also quickly got BFs and cut me off, one heading to Vegas and becoming a bottle waitress at a major club.

-I have a buddy who's fluent in Russian and lived there for some time. While I only met 1 of the girls through him, it definitely helped with that particular girl due to her being familiar with him in her social circle.

-The rest of the girls I met through nightlife and cold approach (1 on the street). While I got numbers immediately, I didn't pull for the ONS so I'm wondering if it's less common to do this. However my sample size is small, so it's hard to say.

-The girls were definitely not as affected by good looks on males, like other girls in LA. I saw pics of exes etc and was surprised at the extreme low level of looks on their men. They did say most of the men were financially secure, albeit not rich.

It'd be interesting to have a mini-relationship with one, which maybe I'll do for RVF Research purposes.

(05-21-2014 03:30 PM)Christian McQueen Wrote:  ALL of the girls responded very well to my dominance and Frame, but my sarcasm and 'jerkiness' wasn't as appreciated.

Outside of Anglo girls sarcasm seems to really fall on its face. Some people even interpret it as hostile.

Every so often I'll meet a Thai girl who speaks English really well. Because I know she can understand me, I tend to fall back on my old habits of mumbling witty/sarcastic shit. And I have to remind myself to tone it down. Less Woody Allen, more Don Draper.

That's why I actually like having a bit of a language barrier. It means you can communicate the essentials but then shut up, be a man, and let your body do the talking.

(05-21-2014 11:58 AM)Wayout Wrote:  I experienced pretty much everything Roosh mentioned about Russian girls! After living here for 5 months now I realize it's not a good country for hook ups! It's a great country to find a wife!
American mentality on dating puts us in disadvantage. I'll explain: I can message several girls right now and ask them to come walk in the park,hand in hand - it means nothing to them! Yet it would be a romantic date in my mind. That's just what it is for her - a walk in the park! A trip to a Walmart is a date in America but here you have to call it! Many couples get engaged before any sex took place and then start dating. You like a girl - you come to her and propose to start dating.
Initial good response means nothing! I opened and talked for over 30 girls for half an hour minimum only to find out she is married or has a bf sitting two feet away from us. They give you their number - no problem! But you are not getting sex!
Saying " I like you and I want to be with you" is the first step it seems. If she doesn't run away - you are getting somewhere! - this needs to be verified but that's what I think.
The only indication you are getting laid is if she comes to your apartment!

My other observations :

Girls are not desperate for a man. They become more westernized every passing year. Many wait into their 30s to have children and get married. Being western means nothing at all to them. I have yet to meet one girl who has a different view (from Putin's propaganda) on politics. Sometimes I think that's how North Korea is - everyone thinks exactly the same! Brainwashing works! I have not met ONE gay person - and I am all around arts and dancing. Strange,right?

Pretty much I would ask them if they are married, when they say nyet , I would inquire about a bf.
I would ask about it and when they say NO.. I would ask "why not?". Basically asking them shows interest and "asking why not?" plays with their natural insecurity since its a country that women mary young and are expected to pursue relations. It is I guess a form of light negging on a sub level. I always follow though with"I don't believe it", and a compliment explaining why I don't believe it.
In this way within a minute I find out her status, neg her in a way that brings her status down a bit and then compliment her at the end bringing her status up again.

That there are very few gay persons in Russia(at least open) it is not a bad thing.
How many Russian girls sees someone in expensive automobiles and how many polish or Ukrainian?How many Russian girls do you see with furs and how many polish?How much gold carries a Russian girl on her in average?

Quote:In this way within a minute I find out her status, neg her in a way that brings her status down a bit and then compliment her at the end bringing her status up again.

Diabolical!

(05-21-2014 05:23 PM)Greek kamaki Wrote:  That there are very few gay persons in Russia(at least open) it is not a bad thing.

This is not my experience. I can only refer to Yekaterinburg which is the fourth largest city and I think it goes for all the other bigger cities.

The girl I was staying with had a bunch of lesbians in her social circle. I even hanged out a few times in the lesbian park in the center. The city is full of them and they are not afraid of showing it openly, not even in front of the police.

When I was sitting there as the only guy in a park full of lesbians I tried to understand the reason behind this.

- None of the lesbians were smoking hot. Some could have been, but they had cut their hair short and wore men clothes and so on....

- But if you're lesbian why you choose to hang out with girls that look like guys and not like women? I didn't see any lesbians with long hair, nice dress or heels or anything.

I got curious and asked them how they are thinking.
I got some mixed answers like being born as a man in a female body and blah blah..

BUT the real reason seem to be that these girls couldn't find a guy to be with and then chose the lesbian path.
A lot of Russian guys have high standards when it comes to girls and they are only satisfied with the hottest ones, which creates a massive spillover of 7's and below.
and all these lesbians fits in that cathegory.

I was told that a lot of girls don't even know where and how to find a decent man.

100% same I observed, once I clicked through all the vk friends of a lesbo friend, and boy oh boy impossible to find s th above a 5, which in UA is rare.

It's funny in Asia it is not true at all, the lesbo couples here are often a combo of one super cute female, often even a stunner, and one short hair butch chick, both dressed to the 9s in their own way.

Russians are a nation of winners.Whatever you do with a Russian girl her point is to get more of you than you get from her.In this notion she has won.They hate being used and losing.They always want to win.In this antagonism there are no western style compromises smoothness etc.It is big ball game unlimited.
With Russian you will get the hottest girls imaginable but there is price to be paid.Also Russia is tough in general it is not a cake walk like Ukraine or Poland.You face unexpected difficulties and people are combatant and punishing suckers.
Knowledge of Russian,payroll,Slavophilia,Othodoxism are essential.

Packing for my Russian trip today and I can't wait after hearing all these stories. In case people have tips, I'm going to Pskov, Veliky Novgorod, St. Petersberg, Moscow and Kazan.

Please feel free to post tips or PM me. Happy travels brothers!

Based on what I am seeing via VK, I really envy you for Kazan trip. Don't have any knowledge about the place (except for the fact that they have a very strong basketball team), but according to VK quality there is very, very high.

Another negative:

-Most cute girls have boyfriends. Based on Russia's demographic problems, I was expecting a lot more availability than I'm seeing. It has happened many times when I approach a girl in the park and her boyfriend joins to interrupt the approach (I politely exit). Even middling girls in the 6 range have boyfriends. Some are still open to exchanging numbers, but pursuing these has been a waste of time so far. There is definitely more single girls in the club, but then that comes with a different set of downsides.

I had this problem in Poland as well, and it almost felt like the game was "Find a girl who doesn't have a boyfriend." From what you guys say, I get the feeling that Moscow/Peter has more available girls. Don't get me wrong---I don't mind relationship-minded girls since I'm not going for pump and dumps, but she has to be open. 70%+ my day approaches are wasted on girls who are just not open to boning a new guy and I don't have a shared environment where I see her every day to allow her to make the switch.

Moscow would have way more available girls based on sheer numbers alone. However, it has it's well known disadvantages (expense, girls wanting more, etc.).

While the weather is nice, it may be worth taking a train to Moscow (while keeping your apartment where you are), and spend 1-2 weeks there to see how you like it.

Also, any thoughts of a winter strategy? I really think you should migrate to Sochi area.

(05-23-2014 08:46 AM)Roosh Wrote:  Based on Russia's demographic problems, I was expecting a lot more availability than I'm seeing.

I'm pretty sure there are more guys than girls in Russia in the 18-35 age range, just like anywhere else.

Yeah and like I mentioned I'm not seeing girls dating busted dudes, suggesting that there are definitely guys for them to choose. Oh well. But I will stay because it's an okay place overall and my Russian level is skyrocketing from such a lack of English. It's not poosy paradise, but it is still giving value for me.

Here's an example from today about girls with boyfriend:

Sitting in my cafe and a girl waiting for an order is giving me STRONG eye contact. It's unmistakable. So I approach her after she walks out.. very receptive.. asking my questions. And then it's time to go for the close.

Me: "у тебя есть парен?" (Do you have a boyfriend?)
Her: "Нууу, да" (Welll, yes)
Me: "Блин" (Crap)

I have to ask in day approaches, because if I don't, it gets revealed on the first date when I try to escalate. At night I don't usually.

That's the story here: good eye contact and receptiveness that doesn't convert. It doesn't help that I'm avoiding English speakers, who would be most likely to convert.