Poll: Feedback:

XXL · 07-03-2012 08:20 AM

THE X-FACTOR
lately i noticed the pattern of all of my dates that ended up with sex. surprisingly, i was doing quite the opposite things to the standard pua tips. meaning that i didn't keep it fun/light/banter only, i didn't try to be the mystery man to be solved, i didn't avoid deep topics and connecting deeply, i didn't present myself as too superman/james bond/alpha/etc.

"attraction land" based game maybe works for others but i personally consider it major bullshit. from my experience, with no emotional connection/trust you come across as another replaceable shiny object, another guy from the club, a ghost, a nameless drink causing hangover the next morning, instead of a real human being she can trust and feel comfortable around.

i don't start this vibe at loud nightclubs obviously but there is always a possibility to find some quiet spot or move venues or go to her/my place later and talk about some deep conversations there. dates of course are great scenario for this.

THE PREREQUISITE..
in order to even do this it's essential to be really "the man" at the start when we break the ice. chill or high energy, doesn't matter. what matters is that the approach and basic follow up must be good. like really good. cause the girl doesn't care about some meek shmoe sharing his precious little stories. she wants the fucking champ. so the first of interaction consist approach/enduring tests/physicality has to be tight to switch to deep shit later

THE DEEP SHIT..
anything that conveys comfort, trust, security, vulnerability and emotional connection. what i do is i open myself up to her. i share stories from my life (bad and good), i talk about how i learned from michael jordan to always stay positive and optimistic.. how i view world and people.. how i'm misuderstood.. how i don't relate to people of certain attitude.. how i've always done things my way even in kichten so my grandma is permanently mad at me.. how i despise people's 'magic pill' expectations.. how i love music.. how view sex.. how i'm focused on eating healthy and working out.. how my broken home childhood affected me.. how hard it is to me to trust people.. how i can't find myself.. how i feel introverted and extroverted back and forth which makes me crazy.. how my grandpa was my best friend who understood me..

KEY: these stories/emotions/facts/etc i share don't really need to feed into her ideal guy or even her type of a guy. no need to care too much whether she will like it or not. simply the fact that she knows some personal thing about you (whether she approves it or not) is the difference, i don't know, the content is secondary, what's important is the mere fact you shared it with her so she feels you're opened to her and you trust her to reveal it. it's like with gifts, the act of giving something is the whole thing, not the coolness of gift itself.

ok but i don't just talk talk talk endlessly. it's a two way conversation. smooth changing topics and threads. i'm good at it. of course no active impressing and shit like that. stories just pop up naturally in relation to her stuff. i really paint the picture of me here. i really cement that soulful connection sucking her into our own little bubble where everything around us disappears and she's in trance. THAT'S game. it's ballsy to have courage to be vulnerable in front of a hottie where she can mock you or hurt you somehow.

NO RUSH..
yes it takes little bit more time for not that much. is 2-3 hours too much? i don't think so. i remember how i used to spend the same amount of time trying to attract chicks, playing around, laughing, keeping it too fun too light non stop waaaaaaaaaay too much time. which backfired harshly.

the escalation goes soooooo smooth it's a joke. like we talk and someone gets closer, or we dance to barry white, or we share our favorite ways to do a "kiss toast", thing is, it's so intimate that there are plenty of opportunities so it automatically "just happens" hahahaha. most importantly.. NO RUSH. as soon as i rush too much she closes and that's really bad. i want her to be as open and comfortable as possible. it's like a crocodile who doesn't move and waits until his prey is as close as possible. kind of creepy example but that's how it looks like IMO.

EXAMPLES..
bi polish girl: i go to a bar to meet with with french girl. as i get there she talks to a drunk turk guy with his polish girl. they vibe well so i say 'fuck it swingers time!' and i talk to the polish girl. she's cute. so awesome ass. we sit next to each other. no chemistry. no attraction sparks. we barely even look at each other as we speak. she orders me a drink and says i can drink whatever i want cause her dude is paying. sweet. we talk more, share some deep shit about love and how i stupidly let go the only girl i wanted etc, we're in our bubble right now. second drink. french girl leaves. her shitfaced dude leaves later (turns out they're not together at all). we talk more. i flirt more asking what she does to her ass that it is sooo hot, i nonchalantly throw comments like 'i like upstairs because of the red lights, they arouse me' and she instantly propose to go there, we go, we sit, we talk, i show her 'kiss toasts', we kiss passionately just like that (zero touching before), we drink more, we slowly dance, we go to the next bar, drink, connect more, we talk about her being bi, we get out and i go to her place to bang.

nobody there would be able to tell that we're about to fuck if he looked at us. beside short kisses at the end inside 1st bar, it looked like two friends or siblings chilling out. it wasn't even a date. it was more like a warm approach in the bar since officialy i was with the the girl who already talked to them. in this case i didn't even break the ice too well, it was "right place and time" type of thing.

french girl: we met buying bus tickets. both in a rush, numbers exchange, bye. few days after we meet to eat some ice cream. nothing like to be an adult hahahah. again we talk, people watch, she talks about her studies, i talk how i was stupid student, blablabla, we play around with water fountains, we go to her dorm cause i'm interested in her books from college, we hang out at her place (still very little touching to this point), we fool around teaching ourselves some dance moves, we lay on the couch listening to music, she gives me massage, we talk, she orders pizza, we eat, we drink from our bodies and we bang.

basically it's very textbook. as long as i stay there, connect and obey "no rush" rule. the details are not important, the

NOT THIS HANK FUCKER AGAIN..
yes, again. as you can see it's very similar to that fucking hank moody shit. chill, flirt hard, sexual innuendos, talk talk talk, share your shit, connect and things just in between. as for this hank character, i remember one time some guy here trashed californication for hank being pussy white knight dude. yeah, that's the whole fucking thing. he doesn't get it. it's obvious to everybody that hank is the coolest cat around so attraction part is given but by him showing his warm/vulnerable side THAT'S what get these chicks really open and wet. that scene where he smoked with latina maid is real as fuck to me.

IN A NUTSHELL..
- attraction land kills my game
- breaking the ice and first impression must be good
- i go into comfort ASAP
- we open up, show vulnerability and connect emotionally
- it builds huge trust comfort and security
- unless i do huge stupid shit, it gets intimate smoothly every time

THE LESSON..
get cool, work on your lifestyle and don't be afraid to share your true personality with women patiently. paradoxically this the fastest road to their hearts and pants. also, opening up and connecting emotionally is great intro to injecting more/less "drama drug" later.

i suggest guys to go jeet-kune-do on this thread. take what you find useful and discard the rest and spare yourself opinion before trying it.

BetaSteve · 07-03-2012 08:50 AM

I have also found that the "attraction land," you speak of killed my game as well. In fact, I truly believe the Mystery Method / David DeAngelo products in the end hindered my game more than it helped it. After reviewing those products, I refused to ever show the slightest amount of vulnerability to a woman, thus leading to empty relationships with women.

Women in my experience are just so in tune with vibes, body language, and voice tone. They pick up really quickly if you are gaming. Better to let them play the games and let them think they are gaming you. Smile

That being said, I definitely wouldn't open up to some women. I had a fling with a hot law student last summer, which ended horribly. The girl was a sociopath and had some serious trust issues. Girl broke my heart, but I definitely learned some good lessons.

Nudge · 07-03-2012 10:14 AM

I may be wrong here, but this sounds like a sure fire way to get some serious clingers with this technique. Whats your thoughts/experiences with this? I find keeping it fun/light hearted doesnt have to be about "attraction land", its just about keeping it, well, fun and light hearted so that your both aware its going to be a fun/sexual relationship and nothing more.

Still I'd be keen to give this a go if I was really into a chick and wanted something a bit more fulfilling than just fun casual sex.

XXL · 07-03-2012 12:56 PM

(07-03-2012 08:50 AM)BetaSteve Wrote: I have also found that the "attraction land," you speak of killed my game as well. In fact, I truly believe the Mystery Method / David DeAngelo products in the end hindered my game more than it helped it. After reviewing those products, I refused to ever show the slightest amount of vulnerability to a woman, thus leading to empty relationships with women.

really? i find these guys' stuff helpful, i've learned a lot form both of them cause i discarded some bullshit. david d's cocky-funny was awesome, and some of mystery's teachings really opened my eyes (i really liked bait-hook-reel-release and his take on branding yourself to the girl).

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(07-03-2012 10:14 AM)Nudge Wrote: I may be wrong here, but this sounds like a sure fire way to get some serious clingers with this technique. Whats your thoughts/experiences with this?

yes chicks get hooked quite hard..

- because of our emotional connection between us - i'm a real PERSON in her eyes who's somehow unique cause i showed my cards, revealed my intentions, my background, my flaws so there is real trust there. i'm internally damaged sure but i made it clear.

- because of emotional rollercoaster - i'm "broken home rebel seeking his place and love" in her eyes now so i'm this wild card guy fighting with different demons emotions and desires at the same time, my behaviour is unpredictable, i want to trust her but i say i shouldn't, one day i want relationship another day i say fuck all this and go for SNL, i say i made mistake opening myself to her, then i say deserve only easy skanks etc etc. so all of this ensures quite a drama going on and girls eat it like drugs/pills. it's addicting. they're pissed and happy at the same time but they can't erase me for a long long time. and i don't do it as a technique, i am like that, i am messed up, i have trust issues for real and different shit going on.

beside all that, it fits my personality. most of the times i care less about SNLs, i'm more about casual long term 'friends with benefits' flings. and this 'style' allows me to be authentic cause i really am that guy i wrote about in "deep shit" section. so it's congruent for to play this "damaged and misunderstood child of divorce with good heart deep down" card. and if chicks dig it then.. cool : )

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(07-03-2012 10:14 AM)Nudge Wrote: I find keeping it fun/light hearted doesnt have to be about "attraction land", its just about keeping it, well, fun and light hearted so that your both aware its going to be a fun/sexual relationship and nothing more.

it's my pure personal thing. i don't diss casual/fun/distant style. i've just found that TO ME, the longer i kept things fun/lighthearted/ the worse my interactions ended later. it felt like i had to keep her in that fun/happy/crazy emotional state at all cost cause once she wakes up and come to her good senses it's done. sometimes it worked but really inconsistently. and next time we met i was weird, like full strangers starting over again. but one day i just said fuck it! (like in that book) and decided to stop giving a fuck and express myself honestly to hook girls with me, instead of keeping her in a trance all the time. well, lesson learned.

key: emotional connection does not equals commonalities only, like two soulmates pairbonding or shit like that. no no no, it just means that we see a fucking human with a life story behind the external image. of course, the more fucked up this story is the better. the more emotional the communication is the more both people get invested.

example:

let's say i tell a girl something like... damn.. i'm so fucked for life.. i'm broken home child.. i don't know my father.. and i'm a man.. how the fuck can i be good father? i'm so scared.. i have no idea how to be the good father.. i had no real life example.. have you any idea what it means for a guy?

so obviosuly not the best DHV right especially if she's from normal family but..

..but i studied and read a lot about being a father.. i educated myself so hard.. and asked a lot of people how they feel about their parents.. i will never be like him.. i want to be the best father in the world.. like a johnny depp/captain jack.. i will show everybody.. the shit i've gone through only made me stronger.. it gave me the real perspective and leverage to never fuck up.. blablabla..

boom! i flipped that shit like a pancake. at that point she's overwhelmed emotionally, she's hugging me, looking deep into my eyes, caressing me, thinking that i'm ALREADY the best dad ever just by seeing my struggle and determination for maybe 30 seconds. and this moment will stay in her heart forever. it's so moving, incomparable to let's say running cube routine on her or some shit.

if they say qualification prevents flaking/LMR then i say this is the ultimate "how to hook" material ever

Kitsune · 07-03-2012 03:04 PM

I firmly agree with this theory XXL.

I've been unconciously doing this a long time. Basically, any form of conversation is intoxicating if you sound like you're an expert, because girls process conversation in terms of who is saying it and what the vibe they give off is.

If you are an expert on say, computer programming, she'll zone out on the actual words after about a minute or so, or, whenever you mention something she doesn't understand. What she'll leave with is the feel of the conversation, and by extension, the idea you're an expert. If you can make lots of connections to lots of different topics, she'll think you know about everything. The only real pre-requisite I can think of is having some sort of emotional triggers embedded in your story, but you said you use childhood stories, so they'll already be there.

An easy way to do this is to say why what you're talking about is important to you. Like, "I'm a computer programmer [blah blah.] Once I was a little boy, and the tv wouldn't work. My Gran, who was 90 and didn't really understand tv's, got really upset. By luck, I worked out the battery on the remote had come loose. That was the first thing I ever fixed, and seeing how happy it made her must have stuck with me because since then I've wanted to know how technology works. And at this point it doesn't really matter what you say because you've regressed her to childhood I'm working on this [technical jargon] that'll blah blah blah. It'll have this effect on the world, and then I'll get to retire and surf. I like surfing because [blah blah] and [back to the technology] and then..."

If she speaks, let her run for a while. She'll let you have the story back after she's done some story telling. That is a good thing because she is buying into your world. And it basically works with any topic as long as a) You know about it, b) You can relate it to the wider world, and c) It has emotional hook points where she can feel different emotions.

No routines or peacocking required.

EDIT: I say 'expert' because I was talking about a job. You basically want to temporarily be the centre of her Universe, whether that is intellectually, protectively, or seductively. Whatever your story, portraying wisdom, experience and congruence is the key.

XXL · 07-03-2012 03:47 PM

oh shit.. that was profound. couldn't say it better

btw, it's not theory at all. it's an accurate desciption of my world and relationships. it's very personal and written with no intentions to preach anything. the gist of this tread is the impact of emotional connection/communication on my game.

~~Greek kamaki~~ · 07-03-2012 04:45 PM

With polish girls it is different because they correct you.Meaning you can do huge mistakes and still get success because they accept mistakes they have the autocorrector.They usually tell me you are very perfect,very elegant,very sympathetic etc.I usually talk about random stuff.The main problem recently when dealing with polish girls is the other guys reaction.

XXL · 07-03-2012 05:19 PM

interesting hahahaha

yes Polish girls are forgiving indeed but it's totally irrelevant in the context of this thread. and why actively connecting emotionally with a girl to hook her heart hard can be seen as a "mistake to be forgiven" in the first place? this is as basic and effective as qualification but on hardcore steroids.

i've done it with English, French, Spanish, Portuguese and Ukrainian girls and see not surprisingly i see no real difference. and frankly, how could i? in the end girls are girls.

again, just my personal experience

Hotwheels · 07-03-2012 05:36 PM

I've often said I don't "game" as it is generally defined.

The above is the closest description to what I do I have seen anywhere.

Since I don't think about it, I've never really been able to describe much other than saying I just talk to them.

Just talking is enough to build a connection if you can interest her. From there things just naturally happen.

Converse, be confident, lead. If you can do those things panties become wet.

~~HiFlo~~ · 07-03-2012 08:30 PM

what is a "kiss toast"?

~~Hades~~ · 07-04-2012 02:18 AM

(07-03-2012 10:14 AM)Nudge Wrote: I may be wrong here, but this sounds like a sure fire way to get some serious clingers with this technique. Whats your thoughts/experiences with this? I find keeping it fun/light hearted doesnt have to be about "attraction land", its just about keeping it, well, fun and light hearted so that your both aware its going to be a fun/sexual relationship and nothing more.

Still I'd be keen to give this a go if I was really into a chick and wanted something a bit more fulfilling than just fun casual sex.

being emotionally unavailable (absolutely not vulnerable) can make some serious clingers

"Attraction land" is something like bullshit.
Mystery overthought it, I think. Nobody has passed up more one-night stands than the guy who consistently uses tight relationship game. Nobody has had more vengeful ex-girlfriends than a guy like Mystery. She fucked his friend in "The Game" for shit's sakes.

XXL · 07-04-2012 04:57 AM

(07-03-2012 05:36 PM)Hotwheels Wrote: I've often said I don't "game" as it is generally defined.

The above is the closest description to what I do I have seen anywhere.

Since I don't think about it, I've never really been able to describe much other than saying I just talk to them.

Just talking is enough to build a connection if you can interest her. From there things just naturally happen.

Converse, be confident, lead. If you can do those things panties become wet.

yes, you're absolutely right. this thread IS very "duuh.." for anybody who can easily talk and relate to girls in general. i get that

i felt very nerdy writing about something simple and obvious like 'talking and connecting' in such detailed way hahahaha but i wanted to be as accurate as i could to describe it in a way to avoid a bunch of stupid questions and misunderstandings. besides to me it's huge key to fast intimacy

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(07-03-2012 08:30 PM)HiFlo Wrote: what is a "kiss toast"?

in poland we got this thing called "brudzio". it's a routine where two people cross arms with each other, drink their shots like that. if you do it with a woman there's an unspoken understandment that both of you kiss immediately afterwards which usually is nothing but very lame and childish peck on the cheek. so this is how the the drinking part of standard "brudzio" looks like:

[Image: 83517499.jpg]

[Image: k,Mjk2NTQ1MzQsNDg5Nzg4,f,IMG_0082.JPG]

MY VERSION
i call it "the remix" since that's what actually happens. meaning that we take a sip a little amount of alkohol, we don't swallow it, we kiss, and the whole gig is to kiss passionately enough to let liquids in our mouths mix up without spitting out even a drop. so it's full on sexual makeout no doubt.

since it's very intimate i usually warm the girl up a bit before doing it by talking how awesome it feels to make a toast like that, how epic it is, how they do it only in the movies, how only big girls can handle, i tease asking if she's ready for "the remix", etc etc..

PUBLIC PLACE
to pull this off smoothly in public place (club/bar/date) you can't treat it like a big escalation move or something to this extent. show her that you're not gonna be too excited after the toast like "yeah! so we kissed!". be completely cool chill and nonchalant about it, like it happens to you all the time. last time i did it, after the kiss we simply continued talking like it didn't even happen.

i really like it. chicks never complain afterwards. i guess it's one of these 'justified' type of things, even though she knows it's actually just an excuse to make out, she probably "it's just a toast, it's ok, hee hee.."

INTIMATE PLACE
the move itself is smooth as fuck especially for anyone who have a girl there and wants to pull the trigger. often times girls get carried away in the middle of the kissing so then it's very easy to lead her body to whatever position you like to initiate the foreplay at

good luck

Giovonny · 07-04-2012 01:28 PM

XXL,

I really enjoyed your post and for the most part I agree with it. I never really learned how to run any formal type of "game". I just talk to girls about my life and theirs and when they start opening up about personal shit I know am on the right track.

I don't have time for a full response right now but later tonight I will breakdown what I really like about this thread.

pitt · 07-04-2012 02:47 PM

Game denialist? haha Im kidding.

Great post. Actually i have done the same for years and i believe the more you think about using ''game'' the more you are likely to fuck up your chances.

One of my good friends, a great player in the game, used to tell me a lot ''you love to talk about life'' (with girls). We were really good friends but our games were extremmely different. His game was super direct, approach, either escalate right in the place where he just met the girl or get the number and call her and start talking to her about sex on the phone, on how he would love to lick her pussy and that he will lick her pussy till she comes on his mouth bla bla. The only thing he used to talk to women was sex. My game was more the listener type..i get girls to talk about their problems and advise them..and then keep it funful..just throw jokes all the way. After a while, me and this friend started living together and going out everyday..our games became so identical that both of us started stealing game from each other. So now after gettting to know whoever girl for few minutes, i am changing the conversation to sex..but i notice that being too sexual before the sex with non-british girls doesnt work very well. British girls are more into sexual talk comparing to other girls so i usually just use normal conversation with most of girls from other nationalities.

I think the WORSE mistake that many newbies are making is that they are FAKING it hard and women can see it through them. They want to act like a total arsehole and they believe being an arsehole will get them laid, they dont think that a true gentlemen gets laid. Fuck, i fucked so many hood chicks and when i HAD to say sorry, thank you or excuseme, i didnt even think twice about it.

Being real will get you laid more than anything else. Its like you being a rapper and you meet a guy dressed as a rock and roll kid and he wants to tell you how much he loves rap, that he thinks rapper x is cool and you can see through him that this is not him, that he is only trying to connect with you but you disconnect from him because he is being fake, he is not talking shit that he knows, he is not showing or bringing value.

I remember when i was younger i used to ask girls (after fucking them) why did they sleep with me..they used to tell me..''because you are just you, you are unique'' me: what do you mean? ''well you are not like these other fools, trying to be people they aint''..i think this just helped me becoming the guy i am today. I just stay me in whatever place i go to.

XXL the only downside to your theory is that most of women are not that interesting. Some girls are not interesting enough for you to bring life subjects or for you to connect with them in the way you want to connect. Many girls really want to hear a guy talking shit, they really want this crazy ass kid that just keeps it crazy all the time.

With your approach, its good to take different variables into consideration such as culture for example.

~~Hades~~ · 07-04-2012 03:42 PM

(07-04-2012 04:57 AM)XXL Wrote:
(07-03-2012 05:36 PM)Hotwheels Wrote: I've often said I don't "game" as it is generally defined.

The above is the closest description to what I do I have seen anywhere.

Since I don't think about it, I've never really been able to describe much other than saying I just talk to them.

Just talking is enough to build a connection if you can interest her. From there things just naturally happen.

Converse, be confident, lead. If you can do those things panties become wet.
yes, you're absolutely right. this thread IS very "duuh.." for anybody who can easily talk and relate to girls in general. i get that

i felt very nerdy writing about something simple and obvious like 'talking and connecting' in such detailed way hahahaha but i wanted to be as accurate as i could to describe it in a way to avoid a bunch of stupid questions and misunderstandings. besides to me it's huge key to fast intimacy

------

(07-03-2012 08:30 PM)HiFlo Wrote: what is a "kiss toast"?
in poland we got this thing called "brudzio". it's a routine where two people cross arms with each other, drink their shots like that. if you do it with a woman there's an unspoken understandment that both of you kiss immediately afterwards which usually is nothing but very lame and childish peck on the cheek. so this is how the the drinking part of standard "brudzio" looks like:

MY VERSION
i call it "the remix" since that's what actually happens. meaning that we take a sip a little amount of alkohol, we don't swallow it, we kiss, and the whole gig is to kiss passionately enough to let liquids in our mouths mix up without spitting out even a drop. so it's full on sexual makeout no doubt.

since it's very intimate i usually warm the girl up a bit before doing it by talking how awesome it feels to make a toast like that, how epic it is, how they do it only in the movies, how only big girls can handle, i tease asking if she's ready for "the remix", etc etc..

PUBLIC PLACE
to pull this off smoothly in public place (club/bar/date) you can't treat it like a big escalation move or something to this extent. show her that you're not gonna be too excited after the toast like "yeah! so we kissed!". be completely cool chill and nonchalant about it, like it happens to you all the time. last time i did it, after the kiss we simply continued talking like it didn't even happen.

i really like it. chicks never complain afterwards. i guess it's one of these 'justified' type of things, even though she knows it's actually just an excuse to make out, she probably "it's just a toast, it's ok, hee hee.."

INTIMATE PLACE
the move itself is smooth as fuck especially for anyone who have a girl there and wants to pull the trigger. often times girls get carried away in the middle of the kissing so then it's very easy to lead her body to whatever position you like to initiate the foreplay at

good luck

Dude, damn. That's 100% solid party game right there. Solid data sheet.

XXL · 07-05-2012 04:49 AM

(07-04-2012 01:28 PM)Giovonny Wrote: XXL,

I really enjoyed your post and for the most part I agree with it. I never really learned how to run any formal type of "game". I just talk to girls about my life and theirs and when they start opening up about personal shit I know am on the right track.

I don't have time for a full response right now but later tonight I will breakdown what I really like about this thread.

good to know. i like the stuff you spread

(07-04-2012 02:47 PM)pitt Wrote: Great post. Actually i have done the same for years and i believe the more you think about using ''game'' the more you are likely to fuck up your chances.

yes. it was actually starting to happen to me few years back when i noticed that it's the subcommunication that makes material/lines work so i focused on universal principles instead of specific content.

(07-04-2012 02:47 PM)pitt Wrote: I think the WORSE mistake that many newbies are making is that they are FAKING it hard and women can see it through them. They want to act like a total arsehole and they believe being an arsehole will get them laid, they dont think that a true gentlemen gets laid. Fuck, i fucked so many hood chicks and when i HAD to say sorry, thank you or excuseme, i didnt even think twice about it.

totally agree. context > content. it's who you are that determines your the results. that's why my "method" ahahahahaha will not work for guys who reek of vulnerability before they even approach.

(07-04-2012 02:47 PM)pitt Wrote: Being real will get you laid more than anything else.
[...]
i think this just helped me becoming the guy i am today. I just stay me in whatever place i go to.

yeah, congruence is freaking huge factor

(07-04-2012 02:47 PM)pitt Wrote: XXL the only downside to your theory is that most of women are not that interesting. Some girls are not interesting enough for you to bring life subjects or for you to connect with them in the way you want to connect. Many girls really want to hear a guy talking shit, they really want this crazy ass kid that just keeps it crazy all the time.

i know what you taking about. the ones that doesn't interest me are screened out in the first place. the ones with ADD usually can't sit for one second which kind of annoys me. this is why screening is the first step to me. only if i got chemistry with a girl i can start my shit.

but with the shy/closed/timid ones who like me:

to me the topic itself doesn't have to be that interesting/exciting/big. just something, anything personal. like one chick was telling me how excited she felt in her new job (big fucking deal). the key here was i kept the convo emotional instead of fact-based, meaning that we talked about.. how that made her feel, how secure she feels now, does she feel that her life is getting better... basically the feeling behind some fact.

i remember that i once read it's good to show some commonalities so that the girl can feel you're on the same page. well, to me it's much better to relate emotionally on commonalities basis. so instead of simple "you can surf? oh really me too, how cool, i like it, it's fun", say "surfing, cool! isn't it amazing how exciting it makes you feel instantly? like it's you and nature on the same side, and nothing else matters cause during that couple of seconds you're free, i feel i'm the king of the world when i catch a wave, i can't explain it". now it's totally different kind of connection. it's possible to talk like that about different things. her taking a big test in her college for example, same thing, fear, glory, stress, with anything relating to these.

however, when i see that she closed and doesn't contribute i start my shit and as i talk i try to engage them in that making them invest emotionally..

ENGAGE
instead of just sharing my shit (like a one way street conversation) i add something teasing (push) here and there like:
- damn, i shouldn't be telling you this, i will shut up now
- why am i telling you this? i feel like an idiot, i'm such an idiot
- shit, i will regret i told you this, forget it, just... forget it ok?!
- fuck, not again, i will be hurt again, i can't believe i gave in to you, let's change the topic
- my trust issues are blocking me, i'm sorry

and they bite it like "no no no, please, keep on talking, i want to hear it, i won't hurt you, blablabla..". they get invested, they want more, they get emotionally attached to the emotions they feel. and like i said earlier, the fact i even talk like that IS what matters the most, not the content. so she now understands that there is something about HER that makes me want to open up to her. so she feels that she can open up too.

if they got something they want to unleash i listen listen listen and i encourage them (pull) like:
- you make me feel comfrotable sharing very personal things, go on
- we can keep this as our little secret ok, it's important to me, let this be our little thing
- i promise i will never tell anyone

and then once she's opening up, she's opened. she lets me in, feels comfortable, allows herself to be seduced, gets excited and with time gets turned on. that's why to me patience is the best possible option.

-----

i know that reading it on the screen it sounds very dramatic. well it can be dramatic, but most of the time, it's really just normal conversation about you and her, exactly like you would have with your best friend. i'm sure everybody talks from time to time with somebody close to them about the insecurities, doubts, successes, failures, personal shit, loss, etc. this is the same what i'm talking about.

so thing is, provided that girls already like you (chemistry is there) they fucking listen attentively to you. like really listen. and if you can express wide range of emotions, like fear, happiness, anxiety, courage, sadness, affection, shame, optimism, hatred, lust, sympathy, sorrow, empathy, loneliness, guilt, they're overwhelmed like OMG.
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Handsome Creepy Eel · 07-05-2012 05:02 AM

I have to admit that I don't get the point of this thread. Is this "just be yourself," something that I have overwhelmingly found not to work? Or is it "use game as normal without seeming unnatural", which is the main point of game anyway?

Just being a confident nice guy has never brought me any success. Maybe it would work in a softer environment like Poland, though.

pitt · 07-05-2012 05:13 AM

(07-05-2012 05:02 AM)Handsome Creepy Eel Wrote: I have to admit that I don't get the point of this thread. Is this "just be yourself," something that I have overwhelmingly found not to work? Or is it "use game as normal without seeming unnatural", which is the main point of game anyway?

Just being a confident nice guy has never brought me any success. Maybe it would work in a softer environment like Poland, though.

Really? So whats your strategy playboy?

Handsome Creepy Eel · 07-05-2012 06:02 AM

Game?

Giovonny · 07-05-2012 11:41 AM

I basically do the same thing as XXL. I talk to girls about my life, my experiences, my dreams, fears, talents, passions, etc. I never really learned any game routines or formal game strategies. I am just honest and open. (at least I pretend to be)

I can barely remember the proper order for game - attraction, comfort, qualify? - attraction, qualification, comfort??? I still don't even really know what qualification means? And I don't care, I gave up on all that stuff about a week after I heard about it. I just like to act natural and find some way of connecting with the girl. But, I admit, it might be good for me to learn some more basics about the fundamentals of outer game. I have always just gone "by feel".

Anyways, I think the point here is to just be open with the girl and show some vulnerability. (or fake it) This encourages them to do the same thing. We don't always have to try to be super cool and alpha. Sometimes its better to just show her your softer side. She might connect better with that version of you. When I am open and honest and not giving a fuck about it, I think that makes the people around me feel comfortable and safe about sharing their experiences.

Now, that is the key moment! When the girl starts opening up and sharing some of her personal experience, you are making a connection. She is telling you things that she probably wouldn't tell just anybody. She is starting to trust you and feel comfortable with you. Now, it will be much easier to start touching and escalating. Now, you are on the path to sex.

This is just another way to play the game. I like it because its honest and natural and I don't have to adjust my normal personality. It doesn't require any extra effort on my part. And, its surprisingly efficient. It gets her to talk about her experiences and her emotions. The sooner she starts talking about her emotions the better! You want to make her feel a wide range of emotions, this is one way to do that quickly.

Great thread XXL

XXL · 07-05-2012 12:56 PM

(07-05-2012 11:41 AM)Giovonny Wrote: I basically do the same thing as XXL. I talk to girls about my life, my experiences, my dreams, fears, talents, passions, etc. I never really learned any game routines or formal game strategies. I am just honest and open. (at least I pretend to be)

yes. it is simple as that. no rocket science. i have no idea how someone doesn't get it. maybe cause i added my dark, twisted & dramatic personality to the mix in my original post so it might sound be over the top for some people.

(07-05-2012 11:41 AM)Giovonny Wrote: I can barely remember the proper order for game - attraction, comfort, qualify? - attraction, qualification, comfort??? I still don't even really know what qualification means? And I don't care, I gave up on all that stuff about a week after I heard about it. I just like to act natural and find some way of connecting with the girl. But, I admit, it might be good for me to learn some more basics about the fundamentals of outer game. I have always just gone "by feel".

"by feel" is the best way. trust me. i'm full on natural now. the only time i get inside my head about pickup is when i post something.

(07-05-2012 11:41 AM)Giovonny Wrote: Now, that is the key moment! When the girl starts opening up and sharing some of her personal experience, you are making a connection. She is telling you things that she probably wouldn't tell just anybody. She is starting to trust you and feel comfortable with you. Now, it will be much easier to start touching and escalating. Now, you are on the path to sex.

yes, this is the whole gig. that connection is what makes random stranger a trustworthy real guy in the girl's head/heart which speeds up the process cause she's open to the idea of seducing her.

(07-05-2012 11:41 AM)Giovonny Wrote: This is just another way to play the game. I like it because its honest and natural and I don't have to adjust my normal personality. It doesn't require any extra effort on my part. And, its surprisingly efficient. It gets her to talk about her experiences and her emotions. The sooner she starts talking about her emotions the better! You want to make her feel a wide range of emotions, this is one way to do that quickly.

efficient right? and the best part, like you said, there are no 'games' involved, no thinking shit up to provoke reactions. like what the hell chick's gonna say, 'oh shit, you're talking about losing a friend?! wtf, you're womanizer, you must've read "the game"...' hahahaha. never ever.

teaser: no attraction routine/tactic gets a super hottie more open and interested than honest emotional connection.

Kitsune · 07-05-2012 12:57 PM

(07-05-2012 05:02 AM)Handsome Creepy Eel Wrote: I have to admit that I don't get the point of this thread. Is this "just be yourself," something that I have overwhelmingly found not to work? Or is it "use game as normal without seeming unnatural", which is the main point of game anyway?

Just being a confident nice guy has never brought me any success. Maybe it would work in a softer environment like Poland, though.

I think what XXL is getting at is more a facet of game. Certainly my post above is.

In game terms, it is less 'being a nice guy' and more 'use storytelling to reframe yourself as a person of (authority/sexuality/adventure) that becomes her frame of reference.'

~~Greek kamaki~~ · 07-05-2012 03:52 PM

Personally I change considerably according to the girl I talk to.But you need to have some sense of the audience to get the vibes.I also seldom get personal.Girls like impersonal stuff because they get comfort.

XXL · 07-07-2012 05:03 AM

(07-05-2012 05:02 AM)Handsome Creepy Eel Wrote: Just being a confident nice guy has never brought me any success.

apparently girls don't see you as confident guy in the first place. if they did then showing your nice side here and there would only melt them. ever thought about it?

(07-05-2012 05:02 AM)Handsome Creepy Eel Wrote: Maybe it would work in a softer environment like Poland, though.

yeah you're aboslutely right, only in softer environment like poland women get hooked up emotionally dude, only there..

(07-05-2012 12:57 PM)Kitsune Wrote: In game terms, it is less 'being a nice guy' and more 'use storytelling to reframe yourself as a person of (authority/sexuality/adventure) that becomes her frame of reference.'

if that's how it sounds in game terms then ok i guess : )
in my terms.. show that you're real person and as long as it's clear that you are badass she will get hooked for a looong time

for guys not in this headspace.. try and use it as a roleplay that lets women fullfill their fantasy of being the special girl who tames the beast with her nurturing caring nature... (yeah, i know)

Handsome Creepy Eel · 07-07-2012 05:31 AM

What you're describing is basically normal game + some vulnerability game. Be the man, be strong / alpha, then open up for contrast value. Awesome. The point is, I don't doubt that it works, I just don't think it's so terribly original, or even innovative.

It's just the pretentious attitude, title and intro ("attraction land" based game maybe works for others but i personally consider it major bullshit) that makes me not like this thread.

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