Post: #1

I have always been curious about the so called "naturals". I have a theory that the "naturals" are created by women. These guys just happen to grow up around a lot of women and girls and are sexualized by them at a very young age, usually preteens. They usually start interacting sexually with older girls and women at a very young age. Because of this they become naturally good with women because they are in essence trained by them.

Maybe the guys on here who considers themselves "naturals" could comment...

Post: #2

I wouldn't say they're "trained" as opposed to their first sexual advances are reciprocated so they never have an innate self-doubt or limiting belief when it comes to approaching or escalating. It comes "natural" to them because their first experiences were positive and they develop their confidence from that. It all snowballs from that. Some of us got a kiss from that first girl we had a crush on in 3rd grade, and some of us snarled at. Chances are, that has shaped your self-image growing up more than you could imagine.

Post: #3

I am not a natural, but I do think it's indisputable that naturals are created by their circumstances. Those circumstances could be being raised around men who were successful with women, (fathers, uncles, older brothers, friends of the family) or encountering women during formative years who were routinely getting played by men, or otherwise demonstrating their unworthiness to be pedestalized. One of the best naturals I have met is such possibly because he really despises women and sees them as only worthwhile for their pussies. He has this attitude because of his experiences with his mother, and also because in his Slavic culture the men always tended to be realistic about the women anyway, instead of painting them as pure, delicate princesses.

Thinking back to high school, though, I think some guys just get lucky. They're handsome or the girl whom they first approach happens to have a crush on them, so they're successful in their earliest interactions with women, and success breeds confidence, which breeds more success. The fifth grader who gets shut down hard and laughed at on the playground the first time he ever approaches a girl is going to have a much harder time forcing himself to do it next time, and he might not try again for years, by which point the 'natural' has had tons of experience cultivating the art of flirting and talking to girls in a non-platonic way, then making a move, then managing them, and seems to be on a completely different plane of social existence entirely from the shy beta who can't even make himself approach. The girls sense this too and naturally gravitate to the alphas who are, after all, much more fun to be around, and don't seem awkward. This perpetuates the cycle, and keeps the newly minted beta from making progress, while confirming the natural in his social status.

But, I do think family example has a lot to do with it. My stepbrother seemed like a total alpha in high school because he had girls throwing themselves at him, joined a fraternity in college, but now that he's graduated (several years) he has no idea what to do when it comes to women. His dad wasn't a player, neither his mom nor my mom were particularly bad examples of womankind, so although he had the makings of a natural, he didn't have the "formation" to really take that step.

Post: #4

(02-10-2013 08:43 PM)Ovid Wrote:  But, I do think family example has a lot to do with it. My stepbrother seemed like a total alpha in high school because he had girls throwing themselves at him, joined a fraternity in college, but now that he's graduated (several years) he has no idea what to do when it comes to women. His dad wasn't a player, neither his mom nor my mom were particularly bad examples of womankind, so although he had the makings of a natural, he didn't have the "formation" to really take that step.

This is why I believe it is important for men to learn game.

I plan to have children. The fact that I am learning this consciously allows for me to explain to my future sons what to do and what not to do regarding women.

If they keep my wisdom in mind, then they'll have the benefit of having the enviroment mould them into naturals, with the benefit of a good foundation to keep them going after university.

Wald

Post: #5

From my experience with guys who were naturals (limited) and guys who had good game is that are they actually operate a bit differently. One natural I know, started having sexual interactions with both adults and girls his own age at 10! The older women initiated him into it and he in turn initiated the girls his age. He was very sexual in his teenage years with both girls and women. This guy doesn't really have any concept of game. He doesn't use any routines, doesn't even think about what he does. He doesn't care if he makes mistakes and he doesn't analyze things when he fails or when he succeeds. Guys with good game on the other hand, think about the stuff they are doing: they plan and strategize. This guy loves women and why wouldn't he? They have been good to him his whole life. Most players are the opposite: they almost hate them. I guess what I am thinking is that I am not sure learning game and being good at it can make you a natural. While both a natural and a good player can get women the way they go about it is fundamentally different - I think.

Post: #6

It's more about knowing what women are actually like "behind the scenes".

Example: Joey on the show Friends
He's the youngest of like 13 kids. 12 of which are women. He's not especially smart, successful or handsome. But he's grown up around enough of them to know how to interact properly.

His classic opener, "How yooooouuu doin" is funny, cute, playful and somewhat childlike. But it works so well that he uses it in every situation. He projects it properly and puts the right confident vibe out there.

Post: #7

Parlay, which other shows have naturals should I watch? Friends is legit right?

Post: #8

(02-10-2013 10:20 PM)el mechanico Wrote:  Parlay, which other shows have naturals should I watch? Friends is legit right?

A GREAT show for watching a 'natural' alpha is Nip/Tuck, the character Christian Troy. Start with Season 1 and watch all of em.

Post: #9

(02-10-2013 10:20 PM)el mechanico Wrote:  Parlay, which other shows have naturals should I watch? Friends is legit right?

Friends is a dumb show. Everyone watched it though. But Joey is a prime example of a guy with natural game, charm, charisma or whatever you wanna call it. People purposefully avoided bringing women around him because he would end up sleeping with them.

Post: #10

OT but there are some excellent alpha characters in Mad Men (Don and Roger) and it's actually a show worth watching. I've also just started House of Cards and the main character Frank Underwood is about as alpha as it gets and as a show is positively brilliant. If you want I'll start a thread where we can suggest more.

Post: #11

No.

Post: #12

Are there any gay (in real life) but red pill natural alpha lady killers I should be following on TV?

Post: #13

(02-10-2013 10:20 PM)el mechanico Wrote:  Parlay, which other shows have naturals should I watch? Friends is legit right?

Lmao

Post: #14

I think it's complicated. I think some female family influence in your life growing up will make you good with women but too much or the wrong kind will make you beta with feminine and/or white knight characteristics. The same can be said of male influence. You really have to look at all the different aspects of your childhood.

As for romantic female interests, this obviously plays a huge role. One of my more vivid memories from childhood is my first "gf" in 1st grade. We would sit under the desk and talk about getting "married" and other kids stuff like that. I also remember giving some old necklace my mom had to this girl in another class for Valentine's Day. I had never talked to her but thought she was pretty. I never talked to her after that either and my affection was never reciprocated. So basically I had the less attractive gf but the girl I really wanted rejected me. I was much more shy with women after that and though I was attractive enough to have girls crushing on me but I never knew what to do.

At the same time, I think comradery and acceptance from your male peers is just as important. You could be great with women but scrawny and getting shoved in lockers. A "natural" with women but not a "natural alpha" and thus not maximizing your success with women.

Post: #15

I would not say that I’m a natural, but I am more of a natural than 99% of the men. I grew up around many girls and women. Until I was 7 I lived in a neighborhood with boys. From 7 until I was 12 years old, I lived in a neighborhood with all girls and no guys. My parents had to drive me to the nearest guy’s house. I learned at an early age what to do to get girls attention, make them laugh, and be popular. I had my first girlfriend at 6. I’ve written about this on my blog.

http://partytravelsexlove.com/about/

http://partytravelsexlove.com/2012/09/19...rn-agains/

I did not know I was good with girls until I went to college. When I started college, I discovered that I was much more experienced with girls than 95% of the guys. I was surprised to meet many 18 year old guys that were clueless about girls. This was also before the feminization of America. Now the percentage of clueless guys starting college is at about the 99% level.

I’m not sure there are any naturals. There are just guys that are better with girls than other guys. To an outsider that doesn't know what a natural is doing, it looks like magic.

Nomad77, one other comment I want to make. You mentioned that this natural guy loves women. Yes, I agree with this statement 100%. I love women. I think women are crazy, but I love women. If you hate women, you're just faking it, and you will have problems. Women can see through this facade. So if you are a player that hates women, you are going to have a much harder time.

Nomad77 you should start your own blog, because you have a lot of original ideas.

Post: #16

(02-10-2013 11:15 PM)el mechanico Wrote:  Are there any gay (in real life) but red pill natural alpha lady killers I should be following on TV?

I don't think you can look at TV or movies to find them. The women are being directed and told what to do.

Iceberg Slim was probably a natural and he fits the profile.

This concept of being "alpha" is not necessarily very evident in these guys either. Some of them can be bi-sexual or even have a somewhat feminine side to them. The one common trait I did find in all of them is their love for women. They love women and find them fascinating the same way men love football and cars. And I think this is probably the key, as brianmark pointed out. Even an animal knows when you love them, kids do too, and they respond to that in kind. Sex for a natural is just an expression of his love and for women and this is exactly how women think and what they want.

It's not enough just being around women or girls, you have to interact with them sexually and intimately. The other characteristic of these guys that makes them different from "gamers" is that it's very hard to find women that hate them. Even their ex-girlfriends and wives still love these guys. Another thing I noticed about them, they attract a wide variety of women. Their appeal cuts across race, age, money, etc.

Post: #17

(02-11-2013 03:12 AM)brianmark Wrote:  Nomad77 you should start your own blog, because you have a lot of original ideas.

Thanks, but I actually think I am lousy writer and don't have the time right now but I will certainly check yours out.

Post: #18

One of the best natural players I know met and got blown by a 12 year old chick (who is today a gigantic cumdumpster) back when he was only 13. I think having such an early sexual experience gave him a lot of confidence which spurred more success and more confidence, creating a feedback loop of it similar to what happens to guys who learn game. Today he's got super tight natural caveman game, any girl left in alone in room with him is going to get fucked. I don't think that would've been the same had he started first started getting action when everybody else did.

Post: #19

Naturals usually just have more experience and/or better role models to aid the learning process. Naturals learn via trial and error from a much younger age by trying what they've seen work for other people. If they hung around a lot of other players when they were young, they're more likely to have been equipped with more useful tools right from the start and get more opportunity to perfect their technique, rather than dick around trying to find what works. There's no inherent difference between a natural and someone who "learned game," the late bloomers just know better how to describe what they're doing and how/why it works.

Post: #20

I think naturals are more created by their parents. I know when I was young, my folks would always over-emphasise my interactions with girls. 'OHH you're on the phone to a GIRLLLL!?, what's her name?, is she your girlfriend? what does she look like?!'. From a young age I was conditioned into believing pretty girls were a big deal.

I think the aloof approach or 'her shit still stinks' from Dad would have got me further in my younger years.

Post: #21

(02-11-2013 06:49 AM)Prophylaxis Wrote:  I think naturals are more created by their parents. I know when I was young, my folks would always over-emphasise my interactions with girls. 'OHH you're on the phone to a GIRLLLL!?, what's her name?, is she your girlfriend? what does she look like?!'. From a young age I was conditioned into believing pretty girls were a big deal.

I think the aloof approach or 'her shit still stinks' from Dad would have got me further in my younger years.

Yeah, my parents and siblings all did that to me. Assholes.

They don't do it anymore, though.

Post: #22

(02-11-2013 03:12 AM)brianmark Wrote:  Nomad77, one other comment I want to make. You mentioned that this natural guy loves women. Yes, I agree with this statement 100%. I love women. I think women are crazy, but I love women. If you hate women, you're just faking it, and you will have problems. Women can see through this facade. So if you are a player that hates women, you are going to have a much harder time.

my housemate is a natural. he loves women.

i don't hate women but don't love them either. i make barely any effort to talk to average girls and zero effort if they're unattractive. there's a really small percentage that i really enjoy - usually hot and similar in outlook to me.

the natural can talk to ALL girls with ease - actually enjoys it - and creates opportunities in doing so: friends of friends, party invites, etc.

Post: #23

Yep, this is the kind of natural I am talking about. The love all types of women and just like hanging out with them. Sex is really a by product of who they are and what they like to do. For guys coming from a gaming angle Sex is the primary objective.

Post: #24

(02-10-2013 07:59 PM)Nomad77 Wrote:  I have always been curious about the so called "naturals". I have a theory that the "naturals" are created by women. These guys just happen to grow up around a lot of women and girls and are sexualized by them at a very young age, usually preteens. They usually start interacting sexually with older girls and women at a very young age. Because of this they become naturally good with women because they are in essence trained by them.

Maybe the guys on here who considers themselves "naturals" could comment...

I think it's a one of three ways principle.

1. Man has strong male figures in his life, they mould him to be confident and assertive and he is successful with women as a result. Usually serial monogamists who don't get too caught up on women, but have excellent success with them, and focus on building a career or skills throughout life.

2. Man is around a lot of females (usually raised by one as well) and a woman interacts with him at a young age sexually. He grows up to become fearless around women. Becomes a gentlemen of game and sleep with a lot of women, but the second women play him, he crumbles to pieces harder than gentleman number one or three.

3. Man has strong male figures in his life (usually raised in a traditional father and mother home), interacts with a lot of females, and women interact with him sexually at a young age. He grows up to become fearless around women and treats women as interchangeable. Rarely has issues finding new women and finds fulfilling relationships at his own discretion.

That's my take on the whole moulding of naturals. I think in some respects it's a number of factors. Early sexual interactions I believe play a huge part in how men interpret sexual situations later in life, and become "naturals." In that respect men are moulded by women, but I think like how most humans are raised, both man and women play a vital part, or else you end up hitting rock bottom at some points like number two does.

Post: #25

It's been alluded to, but I'd like to highlight it: naturals have an almost total absence of neediness, around anyone, not just women.

I think that comes from a number of factors - good genes, loving upbringing with a strong male role model, a non-narcissistic mother, early +ve experiences with girls, good friendships with both sexes. It's a perfect-storm of true high self-esteem.