Post: #1

Syriza Rides Anti-Austerity Wave to Decisive Victory in Greece:

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2015-01-25...-poll.html

Quote:Alexis Tsipras’s Syriza brushed aside Prime Minister Antonis Samaras’s party to record a decisive victory in Greece’s elections, after riding a public backlash against years of budget cuts demanded by international creditors.

Tsipras’s Coalition of the Radical Left, known by its Greek acronym, took 36.5 percent compared with 27.7 percent for Samaras’s New Democracy in Sunday’s election, according to official projections. The far-right Golden Dawn placed third with 6.3 percent followed by To Potami, a potential Syriza coalition partner, with 5.9 percent.

Post: #2

Greece is completely and utterly broke. Rumors abounding on ZH that the EU wants to drop Greece and may do so this year.

It won't matter who is in power in Greece, because no one (especially the Gov) will be able to afford anything. That the Greek people are dumb enough to believe if they elect an anti-Austerity party suddenly they will have lots of free things again is laughable.

Post: #3

(01-25-2015 04:27 PM)Samseau Wrote:  Greece is completely and utterly broke. Rumors abounding on ZH that the EU wants to drop Greece and may do so this year.

It won't matter who is in power in Greece, because no one (especially the Gov) will be able to afford anything. That the Greek people are dumb enough to believe if they elect an anti-Austerity party suddenly they will have lots of free things again is laughable.

The main point is renegotiating the bailout.

I doubt the EU wants to kick out Greece from the Eurozone since that would set a bad precedent.

How much the new govt in Greece will get in concessions is still up in the air, but I wouldn't be surprised if in the end the EU caves in at least a little on the bailout. This is the EU we are talking about after all. They are the most gutless, spineless and cowardly national organization out there.

Post: #4

Live updates:

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-01-25...ve-webcast

Post: #5

Governments will change, but the lies will stay the same.

Proposed partial solution: Let the country bankrupt and reorganize under a financial structure that allows people and businesses to thrive. Leave the European Union, the Euro and NATO, and go back to the former currency and peg it to gold. Charge political officials with high treason.

Fiat money is just like girls and the cock carrousel... it never ends.

Post: #6

It's the first chip to fall in the Euro system.

Post: #7

(01-25-2015 04:27 PM)Samseau Wrote:  Greece is completely and utterly broke.

And? The ECB merely needs to create virtual euros and the problem is half-solved.

Post: #8

Greece leaving the EU would, as you say be a bad precedent for the EU, but a good one for those who are against the EU.

Can't see it happening though, as the EU is clinging desperately to its fragile reputation.

Post: #9

I bet the idiot women over there think by voting in this bozo that magically they can retire at 50 years old again and get a huge pension for the rest of their lives.

It will be funny when the EU gives them a small concession to stay, they expectedly waste it within a year, and then have even more strict austerity shoved on them.

Post: #10

It took a lot of work to create the Euro Zone, people aren't going to ditch it lightly .

Think of all the headaches for trade just from every single thing bought or sold by Greece to other Eurozone countries having to be converted at a floating rate from one currency to another.

I've read Greece has been borrowing and defaulting for centuries. If they don't like it, they should QE their way out of this and stop lending them money. Lending money in hopes of profit-- like borrowing it-- is addictive too.

Post: #11

(01-25-2015 05:21 PM)iknowexactly Wrote:  I've read Greece has been borrowing and defaulting for centuries.

Most of modern Greece was under Ottoman rule from the 1450s until the 1820s.

Post: #12

All this talk of "kicking Greece out of the Euro" is just talk. German politicians have to talk tough because the idea of bailing out the Greeks once again is extremely unpopular in German and other Northern Euro states. Nevertheless, some sort of compromise will be found. You can bet on that.

In the meantime, the Euro is probably heading for parity with the dollar as the Euro QE and Greek crisis continue to play out.

Post: #13

Since 36.5% of Greeks are gullible enough to think they can get free money with no consequences, I'm catching the first flight to Athens with some magic beans to sell.

Post: #14

The situation in Greece over the last 5 years has, if anything, gotten worse.

I don't know much about Syriza but it will be interesting to see a change of pace for Greece.

Post: #15

(01-25-2015 04:47 PM)LouEvilSlugger Wrote:  Governments will change, but the lies will stay the same.

Proposed partial solution: Let the country bankrupt and reorganize under a financial structure that allows people and businesses to thrive. Leave the European Union, the Euro and NATO, and go back to the former currency and peg it to gold. Charge political officials with high treason.

Fiat money is just like girls and the cock carrousel... it never ends.

This is what I thought. I figured that this new party will pull a 'financial north korea' and just threaten to spend into oblivion in hopes that the EU will bail them out before they go over the cliff.

Its like the 'too big to fail' banks. They know they have a safety net if they play with fire because the consequences of them going over the cliff are too big.

Post: #16

I am no economist and maybe my analysis is crap but...what if Greece leaves the euro zone?

Greece can't control its monetary policy while in the EU.

The main industry in Greece is tourism, followed by shipping and some others.

Cheaper money in Greece would benefit tourism and their other homegrown industries.

Leaving the EU would be bad precedent to the big players in Europe and their central banks because but it may be good for Greece and its people - but I might be wrong. We will see.

Either way, Zito Hellas.

Post: #17

The pro-austerity people here seem ridiculous to me.

Greece has endured a huge depression unparalleled in any other European economy, their situation is not improving, and you want them to vote for austerity?

Post: #18

Syriza has garnered votes for a number of reasons peculiar to the Greek political landscape. This is not simply a case of left wing vs right wing ideology. To date, Greece hasn't had capitalism. It has had CRONY CAPITALISM where the big vested interests have been cozy with the government and engaged in rent seeking, anti-competitive, behavior. The system fostered by both main parties was built on close relations with the oligarchs and many much needed reforms were stymied by vested interests.
The loans which the state took out in the good times went into the pockets of these vested interests. For example, the big construction companies (with French and German partners) which undertook big infrastructure projects made abnormal profits and the costs of these works far exceeded the costs of similar projects in France and Germany. Everyone turned a blind eye to these corrupt practices, including the Germans and the French because they all had their snouts in the trough.
When the crises hit, the French and German banks were on the hook for massive losses. The “bailout” transferred these losses onto the backs of the ordinary Greeks, the workers and the middle classes, the very people who did NOT profit from the good times. These people have been crushed by the austerity reforms and for five years the majority copped it because there was a genuine hope that a new political culture would rise from the ashes. However, five years on, the vested interests continue. Indeed, many oligarchs and their “hangers on” have become richer! Except for a very small number of cases, no one has gone to gaol. The Greeks on the “Lagarde list” have not been investigated. Austerity has caused the economy to shrink by 25% so that now Public debt as a proportion of GDP is WORSE than when the crisis hit!
Syriza has campaigned on a platform of attacking the “client politics” and elites whose corrupt practices brought the country to its knees. For a people who have lost everything, the prospect of at least seeing justice done is a tempting one.

Post: #19

(01-25-2015 06:02 PM)Sonsowey Wrote:  The pro-austerity people here seem ridiculous to me.

Greece has endured a huge depression unparalleled in any other European economy, their situation is not improving, and you want them to vote for austerity?

So should the Greek women be allowed to retire at 50 with a full pension and sit on their asses for another 40 years, and the Greek men be allowed to work 25 hours a day for a high salary...

All of it paid for by the tax payers in other European countries?

How is this reasonable or far what so ever?

Post: #20

(01-25-2015 06:42 PM)It_is_my_time Wrote:  

(01-25-2015 06:02 PM)Sonsowey Wrote:  The pro-austerity people here seem ridiculous to me.

Greece has endured a huge depression unparalleled in any other European economy, their situation is not improving, and you want them to vote for austerity?

So should the Greek women be allowed to retire at 50 with a full pension and sit on their asses for another 40 years, and the Greek men be allowed to work 25 hours a day for a high salary...

All of it paid for by the tax payers in other European countries?

How is this reasonable or far what so ever?

The current crisis was made worse by Europe not bailing out Greece in the beginning, all this pain and suffering could have been avoided, but it was not out of a desire to "punish" Greece.

I don't know if the best solution is to leave the Euro, or simply negotiate different terms, but a radical change is in the cards since their current situation is so dire and pro-austerity people only want to continue it.

Post: #21

Greece needs to drop the Euro like a bad habit. It's been a horrible thing for them. Let the drachma float.
For the average Greek, this election was NOT about getting a bunch of free shit. Let's not view this through a USA centric drugereport prism.
It was about a state that has completely failed in its duty to regulate the economy in a competent way.
When you have unemployment that meets or exceeds levels typically found in Sub Saharan Africa, society fails.
It was about people who literally have nothing left to lose, so the fear mongering of chaos was a joke to them.
The situation of Greece for the past 6 years has been much worse than the USA in the Great Depression in the 1930s, which really only ended with the massive fiscal stimulus of WW2.
Austerity is exactly the opposite of what Greece needs.
The "bailouts" organized by the EU have not in any way been intended to help Greece, they have been self serving fiscal maneuvers designed to protect the balance sheets of their own banks and to do just enough to keep an impossible situation going.
I wish the Greeks good luck, and hope they tell Germany to go fuck off.

Post: #22

(01-25-2015 06:42 PM)It_is_my_time Wrote:  So should the Greek women be allowed to retire at 50 with a full pension and sit on their asses for another 40 years

A more interesting question would be:

Should the Greek children be forced to grow up malnourished to atone for the sins of some older Greeks?

It is obvious that the Greek state needs some major changes, but starving the population may be a bit too radical and pointless.

Post: #23

(01-25-2015 06:50 PM)Icarus Wrote:  

(01-25-2015 06:42 PM)It_is_my_time Wrote:  So should the Greek women be allowed to retire at 50 with a full pension and sit on their asses for another 40 years

A more interesting question would be:

Should the Greek children be forced to grow up malnourished to atone for the sins of some older Greeks?

It is obvious that the Greek state needs some major changes, but starving the population may be a bit too radical and pointless.

The Greeks don't want to change, obviously. This vote said so. If the EU was wise they would kick them out and let them figure it out for themselves.

This whole liberal women's equality is a disaster reaching the breaking point.

Post: #24

Watch if Syriza makes any good changes and things begin to improve on a human level in Greece, pro-austerity people will say "see, this is austerity's impact paying off!"

Post: #25

People in here have forgotten the gargantuan 1.1 trillion Euro QE program. The EU has one more big shot to get things right and if the initial 1.1 trillion does'nt get inflation to 2% they say it will continue until it does so.

This is the madhouse that for a decade or more has not been audited, has taken economic powers away from countries that needed it most and decided "no more for you" to the likes of Greece, Spain, portugal and Italy.

I hope the Greek politicians leave the EU, it will be painful but they will recover and go back to their lackluster ways eventually but to stay in a political institution which denies any movement just to appease the bankers and credit owners is not going to work.

The youth unemployment rate is above 20%. That alone should worry the winning party to mobilise. Everytime in history a country has had poor prospects for its younger generations the country underwent massive upheaval.