Post: #1

I've been lurking off and on for a couple of years, and have read a ton of the threads here. Most recently I was inspired by how you all helped TheWhiteWolf, and TravelerKai's comments about needing someone to talk to resonated with me in particular. I've started posting in the Approach and Player's Lounge threads and gotten some good feedback, but often feel like too much of a newb to be legitimately useful in those threads so I'm starting my own.

I'm 41 (people usually guess I'm mid-30's), divorced 5 years with two young boys 50% time. Since the divorce I was in a 3 year LTR that ended last fall. She is damaged (all her life, not because of me) and I wasted so much time trying to make a ho a housewife, she even lived with me and my kids for almost a year. I've been a serial monogamist my whole life, and have only been really dating multiple women at the same time for the past few months.

I found my way here by reading No More Mr. Nice Guy shortly after my divorce, that lead to Red Pill and Manosphere blogs, reddit, and forums. I've read Bang and Day Bang.

I lift 2-3 days a week, climb at the gym, mountain bike and hike. I'm bigger and stronger than I've ever been in my life and am getting stronger. I read regularly, fiction and non-fiction. I dress better than I ever have, and am more outgoing and social. I have no problem initiating conversations with random strangers, but am not good at escalating with attractive women and converting.

I don't have problems getting with women, unfortunately they are fairly mediocre. Since my LTR I've increased my notch count by 8, have been having sex with more than one woman most weeks for the past couple months, and once had sex with 4 different women in 5 days. It was fun, but not very rewarding. Of the 8 there is only one that I have any real interest in, she's 30 and attractive to me but acts younger and is kind of flaky and doesn't have her life together very well; we have chemistry but aren't very compatible. I don't have oneitus over her but do have some attachment, but we seem to be drifting apart since I don't give her as much of my attention as she wants or exclusivity. The most stable and responsible woman of the bunch quickly got pretty boring to me. Like OGNorCal707 has been talking about recently, I find that I tend to attract and be attracted to damaged women, they excite me and I want to help them become "the happy health women they want to be" (which of course they never do), I'm working on letting go of that compulsion.

I have few male friends locally, really only 1 that I hang out with consistently and a couple more occasionally. The one main friend is a nice, fun guy but isn't redpill or good at game, we chat with girls at the bars but don't have a plan or skills. I have some better friends that live around the country but only talk with them occasionally and only one is redpill with any game, fortunately he and I talk a lot. I am usually the one to initiate hanging out with friends and acquaintances, people rarely seem to call me up or invite me out.

Here's some of the specific things on my mind lately:
* I have no doubts that game works. I am having some struggles with what I want for myself. I enjoy deep connections with women, in particular the sex is better than when I'm pounding some mediocre piece of meat. And I would eventually like to have a quality woman that wants to be a part of my life, including spending time with my kids. Unfortunately I definitely crave attention and validation, at least to some degree, so I'm often seeking new women.
* I have difficulty tolerating what I perceive as a lack of personal responsibility in people. Yes, I shouldn't let people disrespect me, but I sometimes take it personally when people don't behave the way I think they should. This has damaged friendships and relationships.
* Related to the point above, because I shut people out when they don't meet my expectations, I often end up alone and feel like my only choice not to be alone is to tolerate damaged or mediocre people.
* I want to get better at clearly communicating my intentions to attractive women.
* I don't feel like I have a mission in life. Being the best dad I can be to my kids is extremely important to me, but I'm not very happy with my job and don't have hobbies that I'm highly skilled at. I've always been the jack-of-all-trades master-of-none type, a quick learner fast to get decent at something but not putting in the time and effort to excel.
* I want to be a positive masculine roll model for my boys.
* I think people aren't always direct and honest with me, especially about my shortcomings. I like the way you guys rib on each other and really dig to get at the deep issues. I want friends that I can do that with.

I do think I'm generally on the right track with improving my life, it's just very slow going without a mentor or more friends. I live in Northern Colorado, I've PM'ed one local forum member asking to be included at some point if there's a meetup. I welcome thoughts, feedback, PM's, whatever.

Post: #2

This isn't a struggle. This is biology.

Men are always attracted to their sexual reciprocal. If you're a masculine man, you're going to be attracted to feminine, crazy ass women. If you're a feminine man, you're going to be attracted to women who tells you what to do. If you're in the middle of those two, you're going to be attracted to a woman in the middle also.

It's called sexual tension.

That sexual tension is what makes for amazing sex. People get confused when they relate "sexual attraction and mate picking"

They are two very completely different things.

You have to figure out what you want at this point in your life.

Post: #3

(06-30-2016 04:31 PM)RunsWithScissors Wrote:  * I don't feel like I have a mission in life. Being the best dad I can be to my kids is extremely important to me, but I'm not very happy with my job and don't have hobbies that I'm highly skilled at. I've always been the jack-of-all-trades master-of-none type, a quick learner fast to get decent at something but not putting in the time and effort to excel.

Same, and I'm just one year older. Supposedly there's a way to figure this out. I know I want to do something creative, but nowadays, I have less energy and my creativity seems to have waned quite a bit.
I heavily invested in physical fitness in the last 4 years, but it has not really helped my purpose.... just my confidence and the understanding that "practice makes perfect". It's made me more attractive to girls, but the girls are dumber and more annoying than ever. Most girls still just want my attention, not my dick. I'm lucky if I'm the backup plan. I'm nowhere as successful as you as far as notches. I find it interesting that you're still unhappy, because I often find just talking to women often makes me unhappy. They have no sincerity. It's almost always bullshit. I hate that. I want a real connection with someone, not a narcissitic orifice to ejaculate into.

Quote:* I think people aren't always direct and honest with me, especially about my shortcomings. I like the way you guys rib on each other and really dig to get at the deep issues. I want friends that I can do that with.

This is why women make terrible friends. I just wanted to say that out loud, not that most of us didn't know that already.

Post: #4

Life may be shit, but it's better than the alternative.

Post: #5

LINUX Wrote:You have to figure out what you want at this point in your life.

This is true. It's hard when the quality is low, I want these women to be happy, healthy, productive, interesting women but they've always got some significant issues, the ones I like best end up not being able to take care of their own lives effectively. Maybe I'm expecting too much.

ThundercockVeritas Wrote:I find it interesting that you're still unhappy, because I often find just talking to women often makes me unhappy.

Fucking them is better than talking to them, for sure. My problem is the method that works for me, at least with the chicks I've been getting, is the relaxed, low-key, have some dinner and wine at my place then take a walk down to the park/river then back to my place where I escalate. I talk a lot and ask them a shit ton of questions, I'm pretty sure I'm putting off the boyfriend vibe way more than hookup and then when I get tired of them after a couple of get-togethers and text them less, they drift away. I've been working on being more consistent with the way I present myself from the beginning.

RatInTheWoods Wrote:Life may be shit, but it's better than the alternative.

I can see how my post may come across this way, but I don't think life is shit. There are things I want to change and I know I can be a better, happier man. I'm looking for some support and advice.

Post: #6

Listen man,

You're a bullet point guy and a correcter.

You invest too much emotions into others. When you have happiness in yourself you both drop the need to criticize and also put out energy that attracts people that just want to love others and live a good life, women included.

I think you need to bang another 10 random chicks over the next year or two and get the validation out of your system while working on your own self actualization.

It is good you see your own faults and are honest with yourself. Relaxation and peace of mind will come with some more experience. You are at a Jaded Hump asking is this it? They are some really great women out there. You have to be a great man to get them though. You need rock solid inner peace and satisfaction with your life outside of women.

Post: #7

Interesting perspective. I often wonder what older single men go through, especially as I come up on 30 wth 4 years in the active Army (fuck this shit). Anyways I hope you find your happiness.

Post: #8

(06-30-2016 10:02 PM)Travesty Wrote:  You invest too much emotions into others. When you have happiness in yourself you both drop the need to criticize and also put out energy that attracts people that just want to love others and live a good life, women included.

I think you need to bang another 10 random chicks over the next year or two and get the validation out of your system while working on your own self actualization.

But he can only do this if he has a life purpose. I'm not sure banging more chicks is going to help with this. It's the go-to answer on here, but the process of banging women can be emotionally draining or just offer very little reward for the amount of work you put in. Some of us due to no real fault in our game have to work much harder just to get fairly mediocre results... whether that's because of genetics, disability,
or some other fixed variable that can't be changed.

While it's true men can get better, and age better than women (I know I have), they still hit the wall eventually. All the self-actualization in the world isn't going to change that. All we have left at that point is our purpose and our legacy.

But I don't have a better answer.

Post: #9

choichoi Wrote:Interesting perspective. I often wonder what older single men go through, especially as I come up on 30 wth 4 years in the active Army (fuck this shit). Anyways I hope you find your happiness.

Thank you. I was a total beta loser while I was married in my 30's. I road-raced motorcycles for 5 years before that, I spent time with friends. I wasn't alpha but I was comfortable being alone, even preferred it a lot of the time. That all went away during my marriage, I let myself become soft and weak, quit racing due to time and money, let the wife wear the pants in the family. Divorce was the best thing to happen to me but it's been a long hard time since, made even harder by having to fight in court for my kids.

Travesty Wrote:It is good you see your own faults and are honest with yourself. Relaxation and peace of mind will come with some more experience. You are at a Jaded Hump asking is this it? They are some really great women out there. You have to be a great man to get them though. You need rock solid inner peace and satisfaction with your life outside of women.

I agree with everything you said. At this point, learning to game women feels a bit like any other hobby I've taken up in my past; I'll get to a certain level of proficiency where I'll be decent at it then either stagnate or move on to something else that catches my interest because getting to the top takes more time and energy and investment than I'm willing to make. Or maybe I'm afraid to fail.

Post: #10

Something tells me you're on the right track. I think you have a good chance of reaching that satisfied level. Personally, I just get tired of how lopsided and deceptive this world is. Sometimes no matter what you do or where you're at, it doesn't work. There was an article written awhile back... I forgot what it was called... but it basically advocated doing everything you possibly could... and only give up when you think you've tried everything. I've tried quite a few things and I'll keep trying, but eventually I'll run out of time and I know there are certain things that will never change save divine intervention.

Post: #11

Decide what type of men you want your sons to be and learn everything you can about those things. If you want your sons to go to college, make education, reading, and learning your focus. If you want them to race motorcycles, dedicate yourself to being an expert in motorcycles. In this way you will commit to a hobby long term that brings you satisfaction. And that hobby will help you make closer friends.

For women, date younger women. Focus on finding a 22yo who is into fitness. A cool younger woman will give you hope. 30 year olds are going to be focused on finding a husband and having kids. Two things you don't care about.

And come join the Older Guys (40+) thread.

Post: #12

TornadoByProxy Wrote:Decide what type of men you want your sons to be and learn everything you can about those things. If you want your sons to go to college, make education, reading, and learning your focus. If you want them to race motorcycles, dedicate yourself to being an expert in motorcycles. In this way you will commit to a hobby long term that brings you satisfaction. And that hobby will help you make closer friends.

For women, date younger women. Focus on finding a 22yo who is into fitness. A cool younger woman will give you hope. 30 year olds are going to be focused on finding a husband and having kids. Two things you don't care about.

And come join the Older Guys (40+) thread.

Yes, when I've invested time into hobbies I've begun to make friends. It's tough with my 50% schedule with my kids, I'm often left choosing between the gym, a meetup group for a hobby, or a date. I would do better to shift my gym routine to early morning.

The 30 year old is the youngest I've ever dated, it's intimidating to think of seriously approaching 22 year olds. My other notches have mostly been mid-30's up to my age. Though I'm quickly realizing I don't want a woman my age. My ex-wife was 7 years older than me <shudder>, I'll never make that mistake again.

I believe I've posted in the 40+ thread, I know I'm at least subscribed to it.

Post: #13

I'm going to be a bit contrarian here and say that your problem of dissatisfaction with your life as it currently stands, isn't going to be solved by women. I think that especially at our age (I'm in my late 40s) women need to be considered as a side interest and not a preoccupation. You could up your notch count by 100 over the next 6 months and I'm not sure it would improve your life very much. The thing that stands out the most to me is that you're saying that you have no mission in your life. You're not happy with your work situation, you're craving for some real male friendships and you have two boys who you need to raise. In short, you have a lot of stuff to work on, stuff that with all due respect RWS, you should have been working on the last few years since your divorce.

My guess is that you got focused on your rebound LTR and neglected all of this other stuff. The fact you moved this LTR in with your boys tells me that, this relationship was your focus. You have to come up with a vision for your life, your whole life, not just your sex and love life. If your career is lagging, you need to take steps to fix it. Do what you can to make more money. Seeing as you have your boys 50% of the time, that's 50% of time you have to make more money. You need to forget about bringing anymore chicks around your boys, that shit will do tremendous damage to them. Focus on raising them, not finding a new mommy for them. Take up a hobby or two, involve your son's in them if appropriate and get good at them. For instance, learning to play guitar, piano, shooting guns etc. Keep looking for tight male friendships, they're out there but you got to work for it. You should travel too, that will help give you a feeling of liberation. Meet up with RVF guys across the country. Roosh, Mike CF etc do meetups, go meet them. Go to a random city like Chicago and meet some RVFers. Snowplow is always good about welcoming out of town RVF guys (just don't bring your daughter around him ). There's so many things you can do to put your life on a positive track.

I'm close to finishing a divorce myself and while I've enjoyed meeting new chicks and fucking new pussy, it sure as hell hasn't been my focus. I've created a vision as to what I want in the years to come and I intend to make it come alive. I will say my vision and my mission does not include finding a new mommy for my kids. I could give two fucks about finding another LTR because I have zero desire to bring any strange chick around my kids. Bottom line man is that you're in your 40s and as such you need to have a much better idea of what you want. You need to spend some time with yourself, alone and envision your ideal life. Then you need to go and get it. I know this is a rather harsh post but I see too many divorced guys do stupid shit post divorce, thinking another woman or women will solve their angst and they never get their shit together. Then their kids suffer. Don't be that guy.

Post: #14

RunsWithScissors,

First, I want to say that I really enjoyed your post. It has a rare and striking tone of complete honesty, modesty and trustworthiness, and an utter lack of pretense and bullshit of any kind. You (and others) may not think of these as being very serious virtues, but they are. In fact -- and this is something not often recognized -- they are among the truest and deepest masculine virtues. So if you're worried about being a masculine role model for your kids, don't be -- you're there already.

I don't think that you need to make any radical changes in your life. Like you said, things are generally going in the right direction -- that's really all you can ask for. Be patient, and don't let yourself become frustrated by it being "slow going". The changes that happen slowly and organically are the most important ones.

I think you have to recognize the fact that the world of relationships with women is inherently chaotic, unpredictable, and very often unsatisfying. Most normal men don't particularly enjoy the process of "playing the field", or they enjoy it in some ways but find it tiresome in others. This is just the reality and it does no good to deny it.

You should accept this, and not have excessively high expectations for what you can get out of the world of eros. Too many men make the mistake of expecting that that world will provide them with the greatest happiness or fulfillment in their lives, and they miss the possibilities that other things offer -- like male friendship, like taking your work more seriously and getting really good and successful at it, like generally enjoying the random things that everyday life has to offer. I think you recognize this already to some extent, but let that recognition deepen.

Value those other things -- your work and what it can give you, your male friends and acquaintances, and any other activities you might enjoy -- for their own sake, and not for how they can help you with game or women. Think of the world of women as just a part of life -- a real and important part, no doubt, but just a part. Even if things are not ideal in that part, as they often won't be, don't let it stop you from being interested in all the other parts. Don't feel as if all other parts are just secondary; let them be primary in their own right.

As far as the world of women goes: what you should be on the lookout for is a woman who is significantly younger than you -- I'd say at least 8-10 years younger, so someone in her early 30s or late 20s -- who is sane, sensible, and who you have some sexual chemistry and compatibility with. She doesn't have to be any kind of raving beauty but you need some sexual chemistry. And she can't be crazy or "damaged". If you find someone like that, you may well consider a serious LTR with her, or more if she's interested in having kids, for example. If not, just chalk it up and accept the fact that it may take time to get things right in this part of life. Don't feel as if there is any pressure or any rush -- 41 is not old and you don't owe anything to anyone.

Again, I think things are good and better than you realize. You just need to give yourself permission to enjoy your friends, your work, your kids, and life in general, no matter how things happen to stand with women at the moment.

And lastly -- you should never worry about not having a "mission in life". A continuing sense of "mission", and brooding on that sense, is something that characterizes a few great men, and many more nuts, weirdos and losers. For most normal men, this sense is something that can come and go intermittently; it can be acknowledged when present, but it's not something that needs to be sought. What should be sought is not your mission in life, rather, what should be sought is life itself, and all its modest everyday charms. Keep living it as best you can and trust that it will come to you over time.

Thanks again for the post, and glad to have you here.

Post: #15

Threads like this are what make this a special community. OP, thanks for the honest introspection.

Finding meaning in life is our most important task and we will inevitably get stuck from time to time. This is part of the process.

There is nothing wrong with having blue pill friends. We are all on a different journey here. There is no set way to live life. Many of my most valued friendships are with men wouldn't know red pill if Morpheus slapped them in the face. I suggest reaching out to some forum members and making an effort towards meeting them if you are craving more masculine friendships. It seems like you would have a lot to offer as well.

There is nothing wrong with being a sensitive and relationship oriented man. You can still be Masculine and strong in your frame.

Almost all people in your life will disappoint you..men, women, your family. Try not to take it to heart. People are fucked up and fallible as Dr Albert Ellis was fond of saying. Understanding this will help moderate your expectations.

It seems as though you absorbed a lot of red pill rhetoric. This point of view has to be congruent with who you are otherwise a cognitive dissonance will ensure. Find a balance between this point of view and who you are at the core. Assuming this point of view at the expense of not being true to your core is just more blue pill.

Post: #16

RunsWithScissors Wrote:The 30 year old is the youngest I've ever dated, it's intimidating to think of seriously approaching 22 year olds. My other notches have mostly been mid-30's up to my age. Though I'm quickly realizing I don't want a woman my age. My ex-wife was 7 years older than me <shudder>, I'll never make that mistake again.

I'm one year older and have less notches than you. I've dated an 18 year old and a 25 year old. The most difficult part about it (at least for me) is striking when the iron is hot, and not judging them for being sluts. Because they will often tell you how slutty they are up front. I didn't act fast enough in these cases, and ended up getting mediocre/bad results. Escalation is very important with younger women. They want to be able to say later it was your fault for initiating sex. You know the drill. And they will change their mind A LOT. My point is, it's not really intimidating or out of bounds. One of my ex's was 7 years younger than me. I started having sex with her right when she turned 18.

Anyway, you should give it a shot. I'm at the point that I won't even approach a girl that I think it's older than 27. At 28 most girls go down hill fast. At least at 27 you can see them in their prime still. And if I ever want kids, I still have the option. I will never consider having children with a girl that's over 27 years of age.

(07-02-2016 12:47 PM)The Lizard of Oz Wrote:  RunsWithScissors,

And lastly -- you should never worry about not having a "mission in life". A continuing sense of "mission", and brooding on that sense, is something that characterizes a few great men, and many more nuts, weirdos and losers. For most normal men, this sense is something that can come and go intermittently; it can be acknowledged when present, but it's not something that needs to be sought. What should be sought is not your mission in life, rather, what should be sought is life itself, and all its modest everyday charms. Keep living it as best you can and trust that it will come to you over time.

This is a really good point. I find it when I stop worrying about a mission and just do things that I find presently important, I have a better life.

Post: #17

I am located near OP. PM'd.

Post: #18

You're in Northern Colorado?!

Once you got your non-gaming stuff sorted out...

Fort Collins man. Troll CSU in your free time or jog around campus for a workout. Take a class to improve skills. Find graduate chicks (mid/late 20s) who will be a bit more open to banging a much older dude and a bit more pleasant/easier to deal with (mostly).

Damn....I miss the mountains and FoCo.

Post: #19

Lots of great thoughts here, I can find value in most of what's been said here, so thank you all. This is the support and feedback I was hoping for by posting. I'll respond to a few points.

doc holliday Wrote:My guess is that you got focused on your rebound LTR and neglected all of this other stuff. The fact you moved this LTR in with your boys tells me that, this relationship was your focus.

First, I don't find your post harsh at all, and I agree that focusing on myself over women is likely what I need the most.

I did invest heavily in the rebound LTR, much more and for longer than I should have. However, I also was investing heavily in myself and my life. I spent $10k and more than a year in a court battle fighting to get 50% time with my kids. It was the most difficult thing I've done in my life. I won that fight and learned a hell of a lot about myself and what's important to me during that time. I also learned some hard lessons about damaged women and what I want out relationships with women. I have more work to do. I like the idea of attending a meetup, I'll keep an eye out for opportunities.

The Lizard of Oz Wrote:First, I want to say that I really enjoyed your post. It has a rare and striking tone of complete honesty, modesty and trustworthiness, and an utter lack of pretense and bullshit of any kind. You (and others) may not think of these as being very serious virtues, but they are. In fact -- and this is something not often recognized -- they are among the truest and deepest masculine virtues. So if you're worried about being a masculine role model for your kids, don't be -- you're there already.

Thank you, for this in particular. I strive to be honest and open in my interactions, I've gotten feedback that I can be direct and even intense sometimes, I'm working to temper that a bit.

The Lizard of Oz Wrote:Again, I think things are good and better than you realize. You just need to give yourself permission to enjoy your friends, your work, your kids, and life in general, no matter how things happen to stand with women at the moment.
...
What should be sought is not your mission in life, rather, what should be sought is life itself, and all its modest everyday charms. Keep living it as best you can and trust that it will come to you over time.

I agree with you. I lose sight of this when I'm feeling lonely, and I take it personally that people don't seek me out and include me in activities. I used to be better about organizing parties and events, I need to return to that.

Dantes Wrote:I suggest reaching out to some forum members and making an effort towards meeting them if you are craving more masculine friendships. It seems like you would have a lot to offer as well.

There is nothing wrong with being a sensitive and relationship oriented man. You can still be Masculine and strong in your frame.

Almost all people in your life will disappoint you..men, women, your family. Try not to take it to heart. People are fucked up and fallible as Dr Albert Ellis was fond of saying. Understanding this will help moderate your expectations.

It seems as though you absorbed a lot of red pill rhetoric. This point of view has to be congruent with who you are otherwise a cognitive dissonance will ensure. Find a balance between this point of view and who you are at the core. Assuming this point of view at the expense of not being true to your core is just more blue pill.

Thank you, I agree I'm struggling with some of the red pill rhetoric as you put it. I grew up in a hippy vegetarian family in the South East with an absent father and angry stepdad. I've had to learn new ways to do things, especially relationships, and it's hard finding a comfortable balance within myself. I really do struggle with not taking it personally when people disappoint, fuck it's hard to get past that, I struggle with this every single day.

The Black Night Wrote:Fort Collins man. Troll CSU in your free time or jog around campus for a workout. Take a class to improve skills. Find graduate chicks (mid/late 20s) who will be a bit more open to banging a much older dude and a bit more pleasant/easier to deal with (mostly).

Damn....I miss the mountains and FoCo.

I think I remember reading some of your posts in the past about this area. I tend to avoid campus, sounds like I need to revisit that.

General Stalin and I have connected and are trying to meet up in the next couple of weeks. Thanks again to the community here.

Post: #20

RunsWtihScissors,

I should offer some full disclosure about those younger girls I mentioned. They were all fat. But you have to start somewhere. I've since moved on to better options because I find fat chicks to be more work than the thinner ones.

Best of luck.

Post: #21

Here's a follow-up after a few months, I could use some support/pep-talk/ass-kicking, whatever you gents think is appropriate.

My lifetime notch count is currently at 37, +20 since my divorce nearly 5 years ago, +12 over the past 6 months. Lately I've been craving more quality over quantity, and deleted my Tinder/Bumble accounts with the intent of learning to cold approach women primarily through daygame. I'm good at making situational small talk with anyone from the hot 21 year old in yoga pants to the 80 year old geriatric in line at the grocery store, but terrible at reading IOI's (from strangers, I'm better at one-on-one in a date situation) and in short don't know how to game. All my notches are from social circles or online. I've never taken a woman home from a bar though I've had several single night lays from online. I've learned how to escalate once I know a girl is into me but have no clue how to make them interested in me unless it happens naturally.

My work situation has improved a bit, I still don't love it but am more focused and have been thinking about how to either make that situation a lot better or to move on. My life with my kids is fantastic, we do a lot of fun activities and I'm heavily involved in their school and extracurricular activities. I'm working out more often and harder than I ever have, setting new PR's on all my lifts, lost a couple pounds of fat and have put on muscle.

My confidence took a big hit recently. A girl I've known for a few years and have always had mutual attraction for each other recently became single, we immediately had an amazing weekend together and a week later I got the bang. I was trying my damnedest to not get attached to her, but I felt amazing when I was with her, in a way that WIA has been talking about lately of chicks that inspire you. One of the very few women in my life who I didn't feel like was dragging me down. This girl was the hottest woman that's ever shown interest in me, and one of the most fun and interesting I've spent time with. Last week she told me she and her ex were trying to figure things out, that she was into me but needed to resolve things with him and that she jumped into things with me too quickly. I told her she could hit me up after she figured things out with him and have gone ghost on her since with no intention of reaching out to her. As awesome as I think she is, I don't have oneitis over her and know there's other amazing women out there. But it does hurt my confidence to think that the hottest, most interesting chick I've ever been with rejected me.

Tonight the neighbor kid was over playing with my kids, I was wrapping up carving our pumpkins and the kids mom comes over to hang out and chat with me since it's been a while since we've talked. She's very attractive and intelligent, she's sitting in my home expressly to talk to me, and I have no clue how to game her. I talked to much, tried to think of how to add emotion to the conversation and steer topics to her, but it felt boring to me. I didn't feel confident and didn't know how to express interest in her, in part because of my shaken confidence in myself.

I have a main plate that was giving me some grief about exclusivity last month, I didn't see her for a few weeks and when she pressed me I told her exclusivity wasn't right for us. Since then she's been a sweet kitten all over my dick. She's a good woman and is sexy but has her kids full time and is too hard to get time with. What I understood is that as long as I'm taking care of her physical needs she's ok with things as they are.

I figure it's good to get a couple more plates so I signed up for a free week at match.com and have a couple dates lined up but that site is a shit-show as far as it's functionality, though there does seem to be some hotter women and I lied about my age by a few years to try to get with younger girls.

I still have very few local friends that invite me to do things, I have to initiate with the majority of them. I'm slowly building some relationships with the families of my kid's friends. I'm attending events with a dad's group once a month, and keep inviting my friends out to do stuff, but would find value in some local forum members. I connected with LINUX and General Stalin a couple months ago thanks to this thread and really appreciate those guys but they live an hour away and it's tough to sync up with any regularity.

My ex-wife took me to court a couple years claiming I was dangerous for my kids and that she needed full custody. Bitch is crazy, her accusations were all unfounded, she lost big time, and I got the 50% parenting time I'd been wanting all along that she had withheld. Two years later she's reaching out and wants to talk to me one-on-one, something we've not done in 4+ years, apparently to apologize for her past mistakes. I don't trust her, but am willing to hear her out. Nothing big here other than it's an emotional issue I'm dealing with.

In summary, my confidence is hurt from having spent time with arguably the best woman I've ever been with and then being rejected by her. I'm uncomfortable and inexperienced with trying to cold approach women with an attempt to date them, in particular if they are hot and/or young. I don't have much of a social circle. I think the answer is just to put in the hard work of continuing to hit the gym hard and eat well, force myself to approach without giving a fuck, and put myself out there to try and build my social circle. But I feel pretty alone and that's a big list of things to do on my own.

Post: #22

Mate, thanks for posting back in and updating us.

(10-27-2016 10:41 PM)RunsWithScissors Wrote:  In summary, my confidence is hurt from having spent time with arguably the best woman I've ever been with and then being rejected by her.

Don't let this get you down, you got her and you can get another hotter, more interested women just as easily again!



I am similar age and similar history (ugly divorce rape story) and I have a lot of similar thoughts and issues to yourself. I am however 15 years down the track from divorce.

I want to agree with a few other posters about reminding you that you have things pretty damn sweet at the moment.
Don't forget to appreciate that you have a reasonable job, get to be in the lives of your two young men (so many men get erased from their children's lives by crazy bitches) and you have no trouble getting women to become involved into your life, if and when you want. You enjoy excellent health and still have many fruitful decades left. You also took the red pill, so you are no nobody's sucker.

That said, I can understand the sort of mid-life funk you can get into. Work is a bit ho-hum (its work - its not meant to be fun:-)

Women are uninspiring and you don't have a "lifes purpose" flashing in neon for you. Hobbies, sports and social activities don't really bring much joy either.

I feel exactly the same.

So from my learnings, I can give you some "tough love" to give you perspective.

Work isn't meant to be fun, you do that so you can live and have fun.

Women are icing on the cake, but do not make them your lifes purpose. Protect yourself from another round of divorce rape. If they take more than they give, then un-invite them from your life.

Not everyone has a golden purpose to their lives, and you need to stop thinking that there should be one. You are healthy, productive and have two children, isn't that a pretty good purpose to life?


That said, the only purpose to life is one you create or attach to it, so you can and should try some new things in your life to see if they bring happiness and joy. Travel, volunteering, hobbies, etc. Experiment and test.

I have found travel to be incredible, but I know its difficult with your boys. So perhaps do some them with them or negotiate a few weeks off. Also start saving money to do some when the boys get older.

I think (and practice) that internet dating is the way to meet a quality women who can add a lot of joy into your life. I don't agree with the many other posters who want to chase stupid hot young women for sex. I think you and I can agree that a mature, authentic relationship is better for guys like us.

I wish you all the best, and urge you to remind yourself of all the good things in your life, and pat yourself on the back for being a pretty successful man.

Post: #23

(10-27-2016 10:41 PM)RunsWithScissors Wrote:  +12 notches over the past 6 months.

Congratulations. But... at our age, more notches does not necessarily equal more happiness...

It sounds like you are learning this..

Sexual gratification is a fleeting type of excitement.

On the surface, it's fun.. But, it doesn't bring deep, lasting peace of mind and contentment.

It doesn't cure loneliness.

It doesn't solve our existential issues.

(10-27-2016 10:41 PM)RunsWithScissors Wrote:  Lately I've been craving more quality over quantity,

Yes!

Quality over quantity!

(10-27-2016 10:41 PM)RunsWithScissors Wrote:  I have no clue how to make them interested in me unless it happens naturally.

You don't know how to make a girl interested in you unless it happens "naturally".. ?

I'm not really an expert in that either.

That is why I am here. To study game!

We are still studying and learning.

(10-27-2016 10:41 PM)RunsWithScissors Wrote:  My life with my kids is fantastic

Sounds like you have a decent life.

(10-27-2016 10:41 PM)RunsWithScissors Wrote:  it does hurt my confidence to think that the hottest, most interesting chick I've ever been with rejected me.

Huh?

You fucked her!

That is not rejection!

She is involved with another man.

But, you still fucked her, so.. Again, that is not rejection... That is fucking a beautiful woman who happens to be unavailable..

Big difference.

(10-27-2016 10:41 PM)RunsWithScissors Wrote:  the kids mom comes over to hang out and chat

She's very attractive and intelligent

I have no clue how to game her

it felt boring to me.

If it was boring to you, it was probably boring to her.

Obviously, you were too much in your own head at the time.. Thinking about game.. thinking about how to game her... Thinking about how to create emotion... Thinking, thinking, thinking...

Don't think, feel.

Have fun.

(10-27-2016 10:41 PM)RunsWithScissors Wrote:  I figure it's good to get a couple more plates

Maybe.

Just make sure that they are quality plates.

Lowering standards is not always helpful.

(10-27-2016 10:41 PM)RunsWithScissors Wrote:  I'm uncomfortable and inexperienced with trying to cold approach women with an attempt to date them, in particular if they are hot and/or young.

Uncomfortable and inexperienced with trying to cold approach hot, young women???

So, you are just like 99% of the other men out there.

If you want to get into the 1%, keep practicing your skills and fine tuning your strategies.

(10-27-2016 10:41 PM)RunsWithScissors Wrote:  I think the answer is just to put in the hard work of continuing to hit the gym hard and eat well,

Hard work + Smart work is always a good idea when trying to solve a problem.

The gym won't necessarily help your verbal skills -- But, it will improve your look and vitality -- which, as a byproduct, may increase your confidence and thus, has a positive effect on your "game"

Talking to girls helps improve talking.

The gym is only for muscles.

Do both but be aware of the tool that best fits the job.

(10-27-2016 10:41 PM)RunsWithScissors Wrote:  force myself to approach without giving a fuck, and put myself out there

Fuck yeah, now you are talking!

Forcing ourselves to evolve and grow might be the most important thing in life!

(10-27-2016 10:41 PM)RunsWithScissors Wrote:  I feel pretty alone

We all feel lonely sometimes. Especially, as single men.

Writing this post probably made you feel a little better.

Hopefully, this response helps you feel better.

(10-27-2016 10:41 PM)RunsWithScissors Wrote:  that's a big list of things to do on my own.

Honestly, it's not that bad.

You just have to keep moving towards beautiful women.

And, allow yourself to heal from your "breakup".

I think you are fine.

(10-28-2016 08:51 PM)RatInTheWoods Wrote:  remind yourself of all the good things in your life

Post: #24

Thank you RatInTheWoods and Giovonny, I appreciate you contributing and agree with much of what you both said.

RatInTheWoods Wrote:I want to agree with a few other posters about reminding you that you have things pretty damn sweet at the moment.
Don't forget to appreciate that you have a reasonable job, get to be in the lives of your two young men (so many men get erased from their children's lives by crazy bitches) and you have no trouble getting women to become involved into your life, if and when you want. You enjoy excellent health and still have many fruitful decades left. You also took the red pill, so you are no nobody's sucker.

This is something I frequently lose sight of and I need to remember to reiterate it to myself regularly especially when I'm feeling low. I have my kids 50% and it's tough going from being surrounded by love and energy to being alone. That's part of my desire for more of a social life, to even that out a bit. I'm also practicing being more comfortable being alone even for long stretches of time.

RatInTheWoods Wrote:I have found travel to be incredible, but I know its difficult with your boys. So perhaps do some them with them or negotiate a few weeks off. Also start saving money to do some when the boys get older.

Yes, travel is wonderful and I'm fortunate to be able to do a reasonable amount. Last year I took my boys to Costa Rica for a week and we had an amazing time. We've done two trips back east to visit my family, once at Christmas and again to the beach this summer. We're heading to CA this Christmas (Giovonny I'll be reaching out to you when I get my plans finalized). This spring I took a solo camping trip to Moab for a couple days and am thinking of doing something similar over Thanksgiving.

RatInTheWoods Wrote:I think (and practice) that internet dating is the way to meet a quality women who can add a lot of joy into your life. I don't agree with the many other posters who want to chase stupid hot young women for sex. I think you and I can agree that a mature, authentic relationship is better for guys like us.

I go back and forth on this, most of the interest I garner from online is from single moms, or chicks reeking of desperation as they approach the wall. I get some marginal interest from younger women but it rarely seems to progress. The two women I dated this year that are 10+ years younger than me both turned out to have enough issues that I quit seeing them. I am trying different things in an attempt to learn how to portray myself to get more quality women, different photos, profile text, messaging styles. And I continue to push myself in random encounters with women out in public.

Giovonny Wrote:I'm not really an expert in that either.

That is why I am here. To study game!

We are still studying and learning.

I'm a bit lost here, I read so much, get my mind blown by the things the top guys write about here, but then when faced with a situation to actually use the things I read about here I'm rarely able to put it together into anything that feels like competency. I'm naturally good at a lot of things, but I tend to put energy and practice into those things and a lot less into things that I don't pick up easily and naturally. For example I road-raced motorcycles for 5 years and was generally 2nd fastest amongst my peers, it came easily and naturally to me as soon as I bought a sportbike, but I'm incredibly self-conscious about dancing and don't want to go out and practice even though it's something I'd love to be able to do. Knowing how to be good with women and to attract quality women is something that doesn't feel like it comes naturally to me but it's something I want to learn to do.

Giovonny Wrote:But, you still fucked her, so.. Again, that is not rejection... That is fucking a beautiful woman who happens to be unavailable..

Big difference.

I didn't even consider looking at it this way. My perception has been that after we had sex she decided she'd rather work on things with him, that maybe the intense times we shared weren't as real for her, that she realized I wasn't worthy of getting with her. That's a pretty defeatist attitude I know, thank you for helping me see it in a different light.

Giovonny Wrote:Just make sure that they are quality plates.

Lowering standards is not always helpful.

Yes, I agree completely.

Giovonny Wrote:We all feel lonely sometimes. Especially, as single men.

Writing this post probably made you feel a little better.

Hopefully, this response helps you feel better.

Yes, writing the post helped me feel a little better, and having thoughtful, helpful responses definitely feels good. As you've seen I get caught up in my thoughts too much, getting it out helps.

Post: #25

Quote:For example I road-raced motorcycles for 5 years and was generally 2nd fastest amongst my peers,

I told you to get into motorcycles! And you're even good with them. It's an easy opener with women. They see you on a bike and are all over you. You don't have to wonder about IOI's, they are right in your face.

Do you have a picture of you on a bike in your match profile? That's where I'd start. I agree with gio on everything else so no need to repeat it.