Post: #26

(01-04-2017 09:16 AM)TravelerKai Wrote:  

(01-04-2017 04:56 AM)The Beast1 Wrote:  I bet you freak out when people park in front of your house too.

Do you have a house? Do you have any idea how infuriating it is when someone blocks your driveway and you cannot even pull your own car out of your garage?

It's bad enough to make me want to keep a bulldozer parked in the yard with a sign (in English and Spanish) on it that says, if you block my driveway, your vehicle will be moved.

Where are you at? I had this happen once to me in New England and a call to the cops had a tow truck appearing faster than the cops normally did.

Tow the f*ckers away!

Post: #27

When somebody asks me to watch their stuff

Post: #28

(01-04-2017 12:36 PM)Menace Wrote:  George: "I hate it when people ask me to watch their stuff. Why should I watch their stuff? It's THEIR stuff. I'm doing important work!"

Jerry: "So a little human decency is too much for you? You can't watch someone's phone for even five minutes?"

George: "Five minutes, five minutes! How do you know? They could go outside and get hit by a bus. Suddenly, I'm in charge of their phone until they leave the hospital. That could be weeks! Now I'm carrying the phone around, charging it, answering messages, it's endless Jerry, endless!"

Post: #29

Okay, so, yeah, on the surface, this is a small thing. Sounds to me though like Vince isn't talking about a once in a blue moon happening. If you are out and about like this, doing your work in a cafe or a library, you are essentially solitary in public, and if this happens over and over, I can see how it would get on your nerves.

Like, you were fine saying yes the first thousand times, and then it got annoying. You start to see certain patterns in human behavior, and one that is on the rise is everyone walking around like they are the main character not only in their movie, but in your movie too.

The main character drives the action forward, and everyone else is just an extra, a background guy, who exist only for the convenience of the main character and the plot moving forward. Watch my stuff. Tell me the time. Give me a cigarette. Give me a light. Let me use your phone. Tell me where the jail is.

I'm feeling you here Vince, you are reacting against a bunch of people you don't know treating you like the background guy, and you aren't the background guy, you are a stranger living his own life and getting tired of lazy complacent strangers taking you for granted.

You also feel pressure, as a decent adult, to say yes to small requests, like we all do. Unfortunately there is a small army of people, or in the case of my town a large one, walking around all day trying to get free things and free services from other people. Who knows, ultimately, what the motivation for it is, although I would suspect that on some level it makes them feel valuable, validated even, when they walk around asking for and getting things from strangers without having to give anything back.

It's the real life version of clicking on your posts repeatedly to see what likes you got.

It is definitely on the rise, and people are getting more and more bold about what they ask for from strangers. I have seen the scummiest, rudest people walk right up to other people and basically demand the use of their smartphone. How did this become acceptable, to demand an expensive mini-computer filled with personal information at the whim of some scrapper?

You want me to watch your shit.

Why, does it do tricks?



What makes this situation so sticky is that a bunch of demanding bozos wear you down over time, and so when the next one comes up to you, technically, he has no responsibility for all the other dorks who interrupted you over the years, so you can't really blast him or anything.

Why not take it as an opportunity to work on holding frame, in other words, let your words and actions convey to them that is not your job to exist as a convenience to them.

Obviously, I wouldn't be writing at length about this if I haven't had to deal with it personally, so I will toss in here a few of the strategies I have come up with.

Where I live, there are so many strangers making requests, that one time,while I was telling one person where something was, another one roared up in a truck and tried to interrupt that favor to get me to tell her where the jail was. I told her to wait her turn, and she flipped me off and peeled out of there.

I have had people yell at me and spit at me and threaten me when I didn't hand over a cigarette.

I have had people start to walk away with my lighter after I let them use it.

I have had boyfriends rush over and threaten me when I didn't let their girlfriend use my cell phone.

The real issue is not whether or not you are willing to do a kindness for a stranger. The issue is that there are a lot of people out there now who take and take and give nothing back, and they are taking advantage of social norms, over using them to the point that they truly feel you owe it to them to serve them.

That's what has changed.

Twenty years ago, maybe once a month a stranger would ask something of you, and now I get asked for things between 5 and 30 times every day.

As far as I am concerned, asking strangers for shit is totally played out.

I have had people ask me for the time when there is a huge clock right in front of them at a bus station. I once had a girl in a university library with about ten bucks worth of Starbucks food and drink in front of her ask for a dollar for the copy machine.

Yeah, on the surface, no big deal, but I was totally scandalized. You spoiled little bitch I thought. I just smiled at her, said no, and went back to my computer screen.

I could feel her stewing next to me, until finally she got up and stood over me, in tears, and said, reproachfully,

"Thanks for your concern and compassion!"

This is key to why you should not care about serving strangers anymore. She was calling me out, trying to shame me, treating me like I was a person who had walked away from a hit and run, and all because she didn't get her way.

"You're welcome!" I said in an annoyingly friendly voice, because I had shown her compassion. I hadn't let her suck me in to her selfishness. It was just what was needed, compassion-wise.

Baby Central! We are living in spoiled little baby central.

So, here are some ways to deal with these monsters.

1. Say no. Not madly or coldly, that just gives them the excuse to have a tantrum. Say no with a friendly smile on your face, and go back to what you are doing.
2. If you have headphones on, gesture for them to wait, turn off what you are listening to, and say, "I was listening to a lecture. Now what did you want?" This lets them know they interrupted you, and that you are not just the background guy waiting for orders. If they are being just too stupid, say, "You interrupted me for that?' Not angrily, quizzically.
3. Say, "I'm not the background guy." This confuses them, and will usually make them go away.
4. This is my favorite. No matter what they ask, say, "I'm on strike." Good because it is true, and slightly confusing, so they can't jump in on a guilt trip. If they ask why, you can say, truthfully again, "Better pay, better working conditions." No one has ever given me trouble after this one.
   

Getting mad, getting cold, getting short with them just prolongs the interaction and isn't worth it.

I will tell you what never to say. I have tried a bunch of things, and this one, though it made sense at the time, was the worst one of all. Don't say,

Quote:I don't do things for women.

I know, a deeply satisfying thing to say, and a strong bit of frame. Unfortunately, the drama isn't worth it. I have been at the center of a couple of insane public freakouts just for quietly and calmly uttering these words. I have had girls go and get their boyfriends to come over and threaten me, and women shriek like banshees when they hear it. Not worth it. Too red pill.

If it is a woman asking for a favor, and you want to game her, my go to is, no matter what she asks,

"I already have a girlfriend." This one gets hilarious reactions and is pretty fun. She starts instantly qualifying herself: "I just wanted a light!" Sure, sure.

That's about it I guess. I will finish by saying that there is something deeper going on here than just doing a favor for a stranger.

Strangers these days are more demanding than ever, and they get so mean if you say no that there is something deep seated going on.

If I had to guess what it was, I would say that we are more separate and atomized than ever, and when people come up for air from their electronic bubbles, and notice people around them, on some level they must realize their alienation and their lack of connection to their fellow human beings, and their instinctive impulse is to take something (God forbid they would give anything.) to feel that they still have some sort of standing with other people. Watch my stuff. He did? Cool. I am a cool person and people are cool with me. Back to Twitter.

The reason I think it is a deeper issue is they take it so badly when you say no. It is as if you have reached into their emotional pocket and stolen their self image.

I have had people standing over me screaming, "It's just a cigarette!" repeatedly in a manic voice, and nothing I say changes it:

"And I just said no."

"You could try asking someone else."

"It's good to hear no sometimes. Keeps you from taking people for granted."


Anyway, like people parking in front of your house, sometimes the small stuff really is the big stuff, and you have to give it some thought and deal with it, and not let anyone make you feel guilty about having your gut response to it.

And also, if you are having a good day, and they ask nicely, just watch the stuff.

(Edit: Ha! Here's something funny. I am writing this in a library, and just as I was finishing it up a fat ugly chick with neck tattoos interrupted me to try to borrow my phone so she could do a Craigslist post. She didn't say excuse me. She didn't ask nicely. And when I said no, she just turned and walked away, like you would for a soda machine that doesn't work. Lucky for me I am a black belt in favor-fu. I repelled her attack without getting kicked out of the library.)

Post: #30

This is what I do:

Guy: Hey I'm going to grab a coffee next door, could you watch my stuff?
Ringo: How long are you going to take? I'm waiting for a call so I might have to leave in X minutes (usually how long I plan to stay/3).
Guy: A) I'll be quick or B)I might take longer, let me ask someone else, thanks.

You don't sound like an asshole and retain plausible deniability if they take too long and you decide to take off.

Post: #31

Maybe your a part of a YouTube prank!

Post: #32

(01-04-2017 01:04 PM)The Beast1 Wrote:  

(01-04-2017 09:16 AM)TravelerKai Wrote:  

(01-04-2017 04:56 AM)The Beast1 Wrote:  I bet you freak out when people park in front of your house too.

Do you have a house? Do you have any idea how infuriating it is when someone blocks your driveway and you cannot even pull your own car out of your garage?

It's bad enough to make me want to keep a bulldozer parked in the yard with a sign (in English and Spanish) on it that says, if you block my driveway, your vehicle will be moved.

Where are you at? I had this happen once to me in New England and a call to the cops had a tow truck appearing faster than the cops normally did.

Tow the f*ckers away!

That might work in Boston, but no cops are going to come over here for a stupid car blocking a driveway, in Texas.

Even if you ask them to move their shit and they will, having to put up with it is painful enough. If you are trying to get somewhere on a time limit, like work or a sales meeting, it is even worse.

Post: #33

I get asked this a few times a year. If I know the person and they're a few metres away from me I say 'sure, bring your laptop and iphone over here'. That's it.

If they can't move their stuff for whatever reason and I'm annoyed, I'll say "sure, but I'm leaving in 5 minutes ... sooo" and shrug. They know.

Post: #34

(01-04-2017 02:44 PM)TravelerKai Wrote:  

(01-04-2017 01:04 PM)The Beast1 Wrote:  

(01-04-2017 09:16 AM)TravelerKai Wrote:  

(01-04-2017 04:56 AM)The Beast1 Wrote:  I bet you freak out when people park in front of your house too.

Do you have a house? Do you have any idea how infuriating it is when someone blocks your driveway and you cannot even pull your own car out of your garage?

It's bad enough to make me want to keep a bulldozer parked in the yard with a sign (in English and Spanish) on it that says, if you block my driveway, your vehicle will be moved.

Where are you at? I had this happen once to me in New England and a call to the cops had a tow truck appearing faster than the cops normally did.

Tow the f*ckers away!

That might work in Boston, but no cops are going to come over here for a stupid car blocking a driveway, in Texas.

Even if you ask them to move their shit and they will, having to put up with it is painful enough. If you are trying to get somewhere on a time limit, like work or a sales meeting, it is even worse.

I think you're misunderstanding me.

The cops called a tow company and gave the tow company permission to tow the car on behalf of me.

Try it next time and report back!

Post: #35

(01-04-2017 03:24 PM)The Beast1 Wrote:  

(01-04-2017 02:44 PM)TravelerKai Wrote:  

(01-04-2017 01:04 PM)The Beast1 Wrote:  

(01-04-2017 09:16 AM)TravelerKai Wrote:  

(01-04-2017 04:56 AM)The Beast1 Wrote:  I bet you freak out when people park in front of your house too.

Do you have a house? Do you have any idea how infuriating it is when someone blocks your driveway and you cannot even pull your own car out of your garage?

It's bad enough to make me want to keep a bulldozer parked in the yard with a sign (in English and Spanish) on it that says, if you block my driveway, your vehicle will be moved.

Where are you at? I had this happen once to me in New England and a call to the cops had a tow truck appearing faster than the cops normally did.

Tow the f*ckers away!

That might work in Boston, but no cops are going to come over here for a stupid car blocking a driveway, in Texas.

Even if you ask them to move their shit and they will, having to put up with it is painful enough. If you are trying to get somewhere on a time limit, like work or a sales meeting, it is even worse.

I think you're misunderstanding me.

The cops called a tow company and gave the tow company permission to tow the car on behalf of me.

Try it next time and report back!

No I understood you the first time around. Having to go next door and ask someone to move their fucking car is a hassle. When you said to Vincent that he must be one of these people who get angry about this, to compare it to being asked to watch someone else's belongings, it was a bad comparison. I threw it back at your face, because you must not have something important enough to do in the morning to not get upset if someone parks their car in front of your driveway.

Calling the cops takes time. Cops in Houston could take up to 1 hour for a robbery/break in.

The tow truck coming by to pick up the car takes time.

Now you are probably 1 hour late to work or a meeting.

Just to put in some payback, I am not going to bother with that shit. He is going to move his shit and not do it again. I will be late 10 or 15 mins instead.

He does it again, I will most likely Dragon Punch the fuck out of his God Damned car, like I am Ken or Ryu.

So far, I haven't had to do that. Every idiot has gotten the message the first fucking time.

Post: #36

(01-04-2017 11:08 AM)Mage Wrote:  This us usually preceded with a question - "are going to remain here for the next xx minutes?" Then if you answer with a yes, it fallows with "Watch my staff then, please?"

The only staff I watch is my own and even then it's with reluctance

Post: #37

I'll be honest, I misread this thread's title as "People asking you to watch them shit" and clicked out of morbid curiosity.

Post: #38

Read through these two threads you started and notice the similarities

(06-04-2016 02:53 AM)VincentVinturi Wrote:  Every so often I'll get stuck in a stare-off with a dude.

Case in point this morning I'm eating breakfast and working on my computer in a cafe.

2 dudes walk in and I look up just out of curiosity.

One of the dudes starts mad dogging me and I hold his gaze.

He nods to me and I nod back.

But he still has a confrontational look on his face and as he's walking past me says scornfully "do I know you mate?"

I look at him, say "nope" and turn back to my computer calmly.

I felt that was a good moment to de-escalate without backing down.

If I'm going to get into some shit I'm not going to do it while I'm sitting down with two guys hovering above me, out-manned (I was in the cafe alone), and with an expensive piece of equipment sitting on the table liable to get wrecked in the process.

Also, I can't box worth a damn and we're in a confined space where I may not be able to effectively take it to the ground so it's best to disengage for now.

Anyway, the guy then walks past and intentionally brushes me with his arm.

Whatever to that, it's empty posturing as far I'm concerned and it doesn't bother me at all but by this point my body is flooded with adrenaline and I feel like I've had 4 cups of coffee.

Pretty sweet rush actually!

(01-04-2017 04:24 AM)VincentVinturi Wrote:  One of my biggest pet peeves is when I'm in a coworking space and some random person asks me to watch his or her computer, their bag, or any of their shit while they go do whatever for an indeterminate period of time.

This to me is symptomatic of the bitch ass culture of victims we have now.

Ask another person to take responsibility for your possessions, your rights, your obligations, your family, your success, your health, your government, your safety.

Because you don't have the balls or brains to take matters into your own hands.

So when I have to step outside to make a sales call and somebody jacks your laptop, it's now my fault right?

Fuck that.

I tell people who ask me - and I practice what I preach - that if you're worried about somebody taking your possessions while you're gone, take your possessions with you.

And I look them dead in the eye and we can start some shit if they don't like it.

I'm sick of these weakling men pouting like girls when I say no to babysitting their belongings.

Take responsibility and stop expecting others to take it for you.

If it were me in your shoes I would avoid doing my work in public spaces if the most minor indiscretions sent me into a rage. But if you can't handle the most basic of human interactions without taking to the forum and venting, your problems are probably bigger than that.

Post: #39

Seems to me people are split on this. As long as you are going for a quick piss or to grab something under <5 minutes it doesn't really bother me. Not a big deal either way. You should be able to say "No" to any request from a stranger without feeling obligated but if someone wants me to watch their stuff while they take a leak or buy a coffee or a snack it's not a big deal. As others said, if you are going to be leaving you can always say you are going to be leaving in X minutes and after that it's not your responsibility.

Post: #40

(01-04-2017 07:01 PM)LeoneVolpe Wrote:  I'll be honest, I misread this thread's title as "People asking you to watch them shit" and clicked out of morbid curiosity.

Honestly I thought the thread said "People asking you to watch me eat shit".

Post: #41

(01-04-2017 08:29 PM)younggun Wrote:  Read through these two threads you started and notice the similarities

(06-04-2016 02:53 AM)VincentVinturi Wrote:  Every so often I'll get stuck in a stare-off with a dude.

Case in point this morning I'm eating breakfast and working on my computer in a cafe.

2 dudes walk in and I look up just out of curiosity.

One of the dudes starts mad dogging me and I hold his gaze.

He nods to me and I nod back.

But he still has a confrontational look on his face and as he's walking past me says scornfully "do I know you mate?"

I look at him, say "nope" and turn back to my computer calmly.

I felt that was a good moment to de-escalate without backing down.

If I'm going to get into some shit I'm not going to do it while I'm sitting down with two guys hovering above me, out-manned (I was in the cafe alone), and with an expensive piece of equipment sitting on the table liable to get wrecked in the process.

Also, I can't box worth a damn and we're in a confined space where I may not be able to effectively take it to the ground so it's best to disengage for now.

Anyway, the guy then walks past and intentionally brushes me with his arm.

Whatever to that, it's empty posturing as far I'm concerned and it doesn't bother me at all but by this point my body is flooded with adrenaline and I feel like I've had 4 cups of coffee.

Pretty sweet rush actually!

(01-04-2017 04:24 AM)VincentVinturi Wrote:  One of my biggest pet peeves is when I'm in a coworking space and some random person asks me to watch his or her computer, their bag, or any of their shit while they go do whatever for an indeterminate period of time.

This to me is symptomatic of the bitch ass culture of victims we have now.

Ask another person to take responsibility for your possessions, your rights, your obligations, your family, your success, your health, your government, your safety.

Because you don't have the balls or brains to take matters into your own hands.

So when I have to step outside to make a sales call and somebody jacks your laptop, it's now my fault right?

Fuck that.

I tell people who ask me - and I practice what I preach - that if you're worried about somebody taking your possessions while you're gone, take your possessions with you.

And I look them dead in the eye and we can start some shit if they don't like it.

I'm sick of these weakling men pouting like girls when I say no to babysitting their belongings.

Take responsibility and stop expecting others to take it for you.

If it were me in your shoes I would avoid doing my work in public spaces if the most minor indiscretions sent me into a rage. But if you can't handle the most basic of human interactions without taking to the forum and venting, your problems are probably bigger than that.

Future posts to look forward to from VincentVinturi:

. People purchasing more than ten items from the "10 items or less" line
. People who step on other people's untied shoelaces
. People who don't say "gesundheit" when you sneeze
. People who drink milk straight out of the carton
. People named "LeoneVolpe" who playfully poke fun at the kinds of posts I write

Post: #42

The only thing that pisses me off more than 'people asking me to watch their shit' are people who remove cornhusks at the store.

Post: #43

Post: #44

I'm getting this mental picture of a rock-solid 9 looking for an icebreaker with OP and asking him to watch her chem-mart bag full of jimmy hats and lube.

OP angrily tells her to fuck off and learn to take responsibility for her own shit!

But seriously, someone asks you to look after their stuff. Tell them you need to iron out some details first. Ask them "what if someone tries to take the stuff?" "What do you want me to do? I'll warn them, sure. But what if they don't listen? Do I escalate? I'm only asking because you might not want me to put a man in the hospital over some groceries. So we need to talk use-of-force escalation scenarios..."

I'm guessing at that point they'll leave you alone.

Post: #45

Rarely happens, but I normally say yes, sure... Then I do not even give a second look to their stuff, its subconscious though, it's not mine, I don't give a damn.

Post: #46

The request is made based on their trust in strangers. You could always teach them a lesson about that, by pawing through their goods while they're away.

Rearrange the contents of their bag in some way that they can't possibly miss later on. Get yourself caught looking through the bag or purse, or appearing to be trying to log on to the laptop.

Take questionable pictures with their phone (with an Android you can do this while it's locked) - not of yourself, but just odd or dumb or skeezy things around you, or hundreds of pictures of exactly the same thing until you use up all their phone memory.

Wait until they return and comment about something that's in their gear or bum something obscure off them you know they have. "So that girl with the pink sweater in that picture from Chad's birthday party in the back room at Stevenson's on November 3...Sarah is it?...Is she taken?" "Would you mind if I had one of your specific-brand mints/cigarettes/prescription medications?"

Obviously don't do anything legally actionable. Just something unsettling that will make them think twice before asking a stranger to watch their goods. Or at least you.

Post: #47

Maybe they're hitting on you:

Quote:Another potential opener is to ask her to watch your stuff while you go to the bathroom. When you return, ask if she had to fight anyone off to protect your valuables. I especially like this opener when I’m in a foreign city. Let me share an example.

V, Roosh (2011-08-23). Day Bang: How To Casually Pick Up Girls During The Day (Kindle Locations 2198-2200). . Kindle Edition.

Post: #48

This was a plot point on Curb Your Enthusiasm:

Post: #49

(01-04-2017 08:29 PM)younggun Wrote:  If it were me in your shoes I would avoid doing my work in public spaces if the most minor indiscretions sent me into a rage. But if you can't handle the most basic of human interactions without taking to the forum and venting, your problems are probably bigger than that.

Haha bro of course if you cherrypick 2 posts where I'm venting and asking the forum's advice on how best to handle a situation that I admittedly may not be handling as well as I could be, it's possible to paint me in a bad light.

How about the hundreds of posts where I contribute value and experience that I *do* possess and that other members may not have figured out yet?

Do you just conveniently sweep those under the rug?

It seems to me that whole point of the forum is to be able to ask other guys who possess knowledge, wisdom and technology that you don't for help so you can fill your gaps and improve yourself.

Is that a crime now?

Do you actually have anything constructive to add or does pointing your finger and making a snippy remark pass for sage advice now?

Give me something I can use man!

Everybody has holes in their knowledge and funny tweaks in their personalities.

I'm just a man trying to better myself, and I don't mind putting myself out there in an attempt to improve.

If that deserves your derision, fine I'll take it.

I'll even watch your stuff for you.

Quote:Future posts to look forward to from VincentVinturi:

. People purchasing more than ten items from the "10 items or less" line
. People who step on other people's untied shoelaces
. People who don't say "gesundheit" when you sneeze
. People who drink milk straight out of the carton
. People named "LeoneVolpe" who playfully poke fun at the kinds of posts I write

Well that actually made laugh out loud.

You can only take yourself seriously for so long.

I'm glad I started this conversation though, clearly it's polarizing and some dudes dropped some great suggestions.

Respeck.

Post: #50

I was sitting in the departure gate in JFK a couple of months ago and a business man in his 50's asked me to watch his bag for him while he went to get a coffee.

He asked if I wanted anything. "A water please".

He was gone less than 5 minutes, came back with two bottles for me and wouldn't let me give him money for them.