Post: #1

As I dwell more on my last LTR, I realize that it's left me in a state of deep anger towards women, and a distrust of future relationships. I gave a lot of myself in the relationship - time, money, focus away from my career. I actually lost two jobs during my time with her - still unemployed from the last job loss.

What makes it particularly worse is that this girl won't give me the time of day now. Has blocked me on social media, believes our relationship was "toxic" (which I do have to agree with, I did hit her at one point during it).

Overall, I can't get over this feeling that I wasted a year of my life and have caused irreparable career damage to myself due to this relationship. It has me seriously contemplating altering my plans for the future of wanting to get married and have a family. I have yet to have an LTR that has not adversely affected my school or work performance.

So yeah, thought I'd post this here and these feelings are pretty "early" in accepting the red-pill ideology. May post elsewhere if I don't get enough responses.

Post: #2

(03-13-2017 04:31 PM)MaceTyrell Wrote:  As I dwell more on my last LTR, I realize that it's left me in a state of deep anger towards women, and a distrust of future relationships. I gave a lot of myself in the relationship - time, money, focus away from my career. I actually lost two jobs during my time with her - still unemployed from the last job loss.

What makes it particularly worse is that this girl won't give me the time of day now. Has blocked me on social media, believes our relationship was "toxic" (which I do have to agree with, I did hit her at one point during it).

Overall, I can't get over this feeling that I wasted a year of my life and have caused irreparable career damage to myself due to this relationship. It has me seriously contemplating altering my plans for the future of wanting to get married and have a family. I have yet to have an LTR that has not adversely affected my school or work performance.

So yeah, thought I'd post this here and these feelings are pretty "early" in accepting the red-pill ideology. May post elsewhere if I don't get enough responses.

I think we all go through phases of hating women from time to time.

Back before I ever got laid I hated the fuck out of women. It wasn't until discovering ROK that that hate gradually started to dissipate when I started doing approaches and making progress. Honestly, the main cause of hating women is not being able to fuck them. Give Elliot Rodger pussy and you wouldn't even know his name.

Now, I can get laid fairly regularly, but I still have flare ups of frustration from time to time. A couple of girls might reject me, I'll feel like I'm getting played, and those old feelings come back again. But you have to just go on gaming as usual and not let that hate effect your game or come across as bitterness. Women have a sixth sense for a guy bitter that he can't get laid.

I was in an almost year long relationship a couple of years ago and I still see the girl from time to time. It can be frustrating as fuck when you're on a dry streak, but at the same time I enjoy flirting with other girls around her now.

Maybe I'm rambling but the bottom line is the more women you go out and game, the more success you'll start to have, and you'll start to hate women less.

You know what you need to do to get over this.

Post: #3

(03-13-2017 04:31 PM)MaceTyrell Wrote:  As I dwell more on my last LTR,

^Stop

If you are driving a Bentley (insert high end car of choice) you don't much focus which song is playing on your stereo. If it sucks...you just change it. Find music you like; you play that as you cruise

If your driving a beater Mazda (insert shitty car of choice) you don't blame the song for the shitty car

Or more simply:

Your life=your car

Song = Girl(s)

Post: #4

It's not a matter of needing more notches to make myself feel better. Have gotten two more in the 3 months since she broke up with me. 18 notches by 24, I should be "satisfied" my RVF standards.

It's the matter of suffering professionally and financially due to mistakes made during the relationship, way, way after the end of said relationship.

Post: #5

Good honest thread.

Post: #6

I never went through a stage of hating chicks, maybe because I grew up with a younger female sister and was surrounded by a bunch of female cousins and neighbours, I knew had to handle them. My LTRs from my early teens into my early 20s were fairly healthy, it wasn't until my mid to late 20s that I dated psychos and skanks but I knew that's what they were so I never invested much into those relationships (also wrapped it up with them). Then I found the promised land in my late 20s, third world shit hole poosy paradises where nearly every chick I've banged or dated has been a pleasure to be around and hang out with. I guess some of us just have vastly different experiences with women, I'll probably never get married or have kids (at the rate I'm going anyway) but I love women, even though they are like retarded little kids.

Post: #7

(03-13-2017 05:36 PM)MaceTyrell Wrote:  It's the matter of suffering professionally and financially due to mistakes made during the relationship, way, way after the end of said relationship.

What would you like to see happen to quench your woman-hate? Do you want to see your ex's life face-plant due to bad karma or something? I can totally relate to that. But it's ultimately self-defeating. The energy spent trying to put a psychic hex on her would be better spent getting into new relationships. If empty "notches" aren't doing it you've got to seek out new LTR material.

Post: #8

I've been there OP. It's not so much the fucking you miss as that part of your life sort of being gone, a part that, as you've mentioned, you've sacrificed for. The best way to deal with it is to fill the space you used to allot to her in your time or mind towards other things, like professional pursuits or, yes, gaming more women. Though I would never have suggested putting a girl above personal pursuits at all, even if you'd been married. The health of an LTR often reflects the rest of your life: if you're failing or letting yourself fail in your pursuits and dreams, you can be damn sure the LTR will follow.

Post: #9

I went through a short brief woman hating phase in Medellin in '13. I had the sense enough to get on a bus and change venues to a small town not far away. And then I was good again. I dated some nice small town girls, went hiking every day, boating, partying, and I was a new man.

When you recognize that you're in a rut, switch something up. Skydiving helped me get through a crushing breakup with a three year LTR. Instead of staying a broken miserable mess, I was suddenly my old self and having a huge time every weekend jumping out of planes. I got to FLY like Superman bitches!

You can't get the past year back. That shit's done. Do something new and crazy. Book a flight and go somewhere out of the way. That ex-GF is gone for good, and it does you no good to spend a second more of your life dwelling on her. You wasted the past year? Fine. Don't waste this one on her, too. It's a new year and you're a free man. Enjoy.

Post: #10

If you don't mind sharing, how exactly did you lose jobs over a woman? I feel like we may be missing part of the picture here.

Post: #11

I respect your candid introspection and the desire to have a more positive mindset following the rough end of your LTR. It's natural to feel frustrated by a lack of success, bitter during the shock phase of "seeing the matrix", or angry in the aftermath of a serious break-up or divorce.

However, there are serious physical, mental and emotional costs of holding on to resentment or constantly complaining about 'the decline' rather than focusing on present opportunities and taking action. Although I appreciate the value of cautionary tales, I have worked with men in real life and witnessed the long-term effects of seething indignation, externalised blame, and getting stuck on problems rather than focusing on taking steps towards the solutions. These effects included alcoholism, chronic health issues, social isolation and more.

Competence fosters both confidence and enjoyment, and it is difficult to feel empowered and excited without taking regular action. Beyond that, a feeling of underlying bitterness will subconsciously leak out and will stop you from getting laid and bonding with quality women. Sure, you can keep your guard up and bang random, likewise-jaded or no-character hoes indefinitely, but ultimately I think this is a hamster wheel of ever-fleeting pleasure that leads nowhere.

All the best players I know well, along with those in solid LTRs, are generally characterized by a few traits such as being able to:

- Accept things beyond their control,
- Focus on the positive aspects of their situation and don't take the game too seriously, remembering to have a laugh.
- Consider their experiences and associates as a reflection of their own choices and energy, and believe they have considerable power in shaping their life.
- Take consistent action in improving their lot, including a mission beyond women and a typically healthy lifestyle.

(03-13-2017 04:31 PM)MaceTyrell Wrote:  So yeah, thought I'd post this here and these feelings are pretty "early" in accepting the red-pill ideology. May post elsewhere if I don't get enough responses.

What remains to be seen is your question - what are you asking, exactly?

The more context you provide the more individualised and therefore useful responses you can receive. Some example questions you could answer:

* Do you have real-life mentors or fellow players, including RVFers, that you can debrief with?
* How is your overall health, eating, and sleeping?
* If you met another woman who you really liked, what would you do differently?
* How long you have been unemployed, and what have you been doing to fix this (your financial situation)?
* Why do you think that you've suffered "irreparable career damage" at the young age of 24?
* What specific negative thoughts are you experiencing?
* How are you meeting women (through incidental approaches, clubbing, online, social circle, or lifestyle avenues)?

In the meantime, here are some readings from RVF which can help with both mindset and behavioural change:

- H1N1: The dangers of the red pill
- The Lizard of Oz: Don't Let Frustration With Women Make You Feel Bad About Life In General
- Mr Lemon: I had a heart attack
- Rhyme or Reason: Breaking the cycle of cynicism
- Quintus Curtius: The Ultimate Truth Of Our Age: There Are No Consequences For Women
- Birthday cat - Gf Saying Some Guy On TV Is 'So Hot'. How Would You React?
- Dusty: Book Study: A Guide to Rational Living
- Guriko: The "I am thankful for" thread

Post: #12

Ah it pops up every now an again like zits on a pubescent teen.

PapayaTapper is on the money. It goes away as you focus on other girls and honestly find yourself unable to find the time to even think about it. Just keep making moves and working on things to improve yourself. Two girls since your last LTR isn't enough. Fill that pipeline up with leads until it drowns the thought of her out..

Post: #13

(03-13-2017 09:26 PM)Mufasa Wrote:  find yourself unable to find the time to even think about it.

This is key. It has to do with how memories fade or are retained. When you obsess it keeps the memory of those wounds fresh. You'll keep waiting and expecting for the pain to end, and it never will. This is why movies like Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind exist. Everyone wishes they could accelerate the forgetting process to the point where it stops popping into your mind all the time. The closest thing to the Eternal Sunshine device is to get busy doing something. The activity itself is meaningless. Its purpose is simply to divert your attention away from the painful memories. Yeah, it's just a stupid mindgame, but it does help.

Post: #14

(03-13-2017 05:36 PM)MaceTyrell Wrote:  It's not a matter of needing more notches to make myself feel better. Have gotten two more in the 3 months since she broke up with me. 18 notches by 24, I should be "satisfied" my RVF standards.

It's the matter of suffering professionally and financially due to mistakes made during the relationship, way, way after the end of said relationship.

The point of my "car" metaphor isn't at all about the number of women you have or haven't banged. It is rather about the level importance you choose to give them.

Live your life. Focus on making your life the best it can be. If and when the right one comes along that plugs into your life and enhances your life then you'll be better equipped to keep her.

Regressing to my cheesy car metaphor:If your life is a Ferrari then you wont give a shit if a woman decides to get out. The biggest irony in all of what most guys refer to as game is that the less you care, the more they're going to want to ride along

The added benefit of caring less is that you'll actually start to enjoy them more.

"They all sluts except your mom and the one you marry" PT's old man

The rest of em are entertainment vagina containers...hard to hate something that means little

Post: #15

(03-13-2017 04:31 PM)MaceTyrell Wrote:  As I dwell more on my last LTR, I realize that it's left me in a state of deep anger towards women, and a distrust of future relationships. I gave a lot of myself in the relationship - time, money, focus away from my career. I actually lost two jobs during my time with her - still unemployed from the last job loss.

What makes it particularly worse is that this girl won't give me the time of day now. Has blocked me on social media, believes our relationship was "toxic" (which I do have to agree with, I did hit her at one point during it).

Overall, I can't get over this feeling that I wasted a year of my life and have caused irreparable career damage to myself due to this relationship. It has me seriously contemplating altering my plans for the future of wanting to get married and have a family. I have yet to have an LTR that has not adversely affected my school or work performance.

So yeah, thought I'd post this here and these feelings are pretty "early" in accepting the red-pill ideology. May post elsewhere if I don't get enough responses.

I don't see anything wrong with your transition of thinking. You should have extreme distrust towards relationships. You should never get married in the West.

I was your age a few years ago, going through the same exact anger phase that you were going through. I was following the script, working for an F500 company, looking for an 18-20 y/o to start my life with. It never happened, and I came to a few painful realizations.

You need to understand that what we are experiencing with women is completely unprecedented in history. Women have never had this much economic or social power because as our ancestors predicted, it would lead to a society of broken families, socialist governments, and eventually mayhem. We're living in a complete freakshow environment, where women are getting dopamine highs from social media likes and taking multiple cocks per month. Our forefathers would laugh at us for taking this quality of woman seriously for romance.

By analyzing your post, I could pick up that you were emotionally and/or financially invested in your ex. A modern western woman is a horrifically poor investment for both. She'll suck your retirement funds on vapid entertainment-bars, concerts, events, dinners at fancy restaurants. She'll be your best friend and emotional confidant-until she drops the axe, gets "bored,' and fucks her backup plan, leaving you distraught over it 3 months later.

When intergender relations are working efficiently, they are beautiful and symbiotic. The man busts his ass towards his career, and his wife greets him with a clean home, a warm meal, a good fuck, and a loving shoulder from the competitive world that he has to face every day. Girlfriends/wives are supposed to help you towards your goals, not distract you from them.

I remember your posts in the No Contact Thread. I got out of a relationship at the same time you did. Mine only lasted 4 months or so, but I had every intention of making it last for as long as it could help my career while avoiding cohabitation. My career was immensely helped in my short relationship-I was 100% focused throughout the day, determine to provide for our future. I didn't have to worry about entertaining Tinder dates or if my plates would flake. I got laid on command. She was nurturing and empathetic towards my problems. It was the closest I've been to 100% efficiency in my life.

I wifed this girl up because she was from a highly traditional country/culture with parents that could have been reading ROK every day. I confided in her because I took her words about love, commitment, and marriage seriously-she would mention every day that she wanted a future with me as a traditional couple. I gave her everything shy could have possibly wanted in terms of love, support, and attention.

I fell into a trap. I saw the red flags and ignored them. She was a basic sorority bitch who migrated to NYC to continue the serial monogamy that she had practiced her whole life, not the traditional immigrant that she wanted to masquerade as. Her feminine and demure personality turned loud and obnoxious once she was drunk with her friends. Her "love" for me was a temporary infatuation-once she realized that she was missing out on her life of late-night boozing and brunch, she bailed. This was a girl who migrated to the west to attend a liberal college. Before that, she had been given appropriate wife lessons from her mother and slut shamed by her father. Less than half a decade as a hot girl in America ruined her permanently. She now has a double digit notch count, is focused on her independence, and will continue to ride the carousel, all being encouraged by the SJW feminists that befriended her upon her arrival to the US.

Don't get emotionally or financially involved with a Western woman. You have everything working against you-the media, the magazines, the blogs, her friends, possibly her parents, technology, etc. Trust me, your girl didn't come to the opinion of your relationship as "toxic" by herself-either her friends or some dumb feminist blog like xoJane was confirming every hamster belief in her system. She'll look you in the eyes for months and tell you that she loves you, all while she hyperanalyzes all of your flaws, creating a mental checklist of your flaws while she plans to dump you. Focus on yourself, your plates, your friends, don't get too wrapped up into a modern western woman. All relationships are temporary in her mind, and it should be in yours as well.

Post: #16

(03-13-2017 04:41 PM)Mark Fletcher Wrote:  Back before I ever got laid I hated the fuck out of women. It wasn't until discovering ROK that that hate gradually started to dissipate when I started doing approaches and making progress. Honestly, the main cause of hating women is not being able to fuck them. Give Elliot Rodger pussy and you wouldn't even know his name.

Yeah, once I stepped my game up and fucked a couple cute chicks 10 years younger than I most of that hatred simply evaporated. Not even talking model-attractiveness here, but it was enough. Later on I was fortunate enough to bang a girl or two who actually did look like models and yeah, most of the self-confidence issues I had at one time were a thing of the past. Even men don't particularly stress me any more, I've been called a misogynist and a beta cuck before, depending on who you ask; "IS FUNNY TO ME" because at the end of the day I know internally that I'm actually the "up in your bitch is where you might find me"-guy.

Quote:Women have a sixth sense for a guy bitter that he can't get laid.

You bet.

A brief anecdote about my own experience: I was seriously ill for a while and trying to get my health on track was the main priority, not girls. I was fortunate (and relatively young) and it did happen. But it had been a long time since I'd fucked a girl and I honestly didn't even know if everything worked properly. Or even if I remembered how to engage with women romantically. I felt like I wasted my youth, and the bitterness and anger was there.

I'd been reading some game stuff and while I knew it was frowned upon (and would definitely not recommend this to everyone), instead of immediately going out into the wild I hired a hooker. Basically the most "normal" girl-next-door type I could find on Backpages.

Instead of just rushing over to bang her for an hour and be done with it, though, I agreed to pay extra to take her on a full "night out" and just try to play it like I'd imagine a date with a girl I approached would go. Try to apply a few of the things I learned, rather than just an "I'm back, bitches!" grudge-fuck.

At some point this actually quite pleasant young woman was sitting in my car, eating take-out pizza and singing along to Lady GaGa on the radio, and I'm sitting in the driver's seat watching. She seemed so very much like a child. And I thought to myself "I can't hate them, can I. It's impossible. I'm sure women will dump me, do nasty things to me, and screw me in various ways in the future, as it probably happens to every man. But I cannot hate them for being born how they are, and doing the best with what they have in this fallen world."

We had sex later that night, everything seemed to work about as well as expected on my end, and I dropped her off home. She said "Thanks, I actually really enjoyed our date. We can get together again if you want, but why are you on Backpages? You don't really belong there." I never saw her again, or again hired a working girl.

Maybe it's a feel-good thing she says to every john. She only charged me for an hour, though.

Post: #17

I feel you man, the feeling of being ignored after all you have done for a girl only to have it ruin you.

However, I would invite you to take a step back and look at this ex-LTR.

What made you get into a LTR with her in the first place, out of all the other women in your life at the time?
Was she a virgin?
What quality did she possess that make you invest time, effort, money, losing two jobs for it?
What did she do for you before and during the LTR?

If you struggle to find answer to the above, then I hate to say it man, you got into a LTR with the wrong girl.

I think most guys on this board are smart enough to recognize if a girl is bad business, but most ignore it for the pussies.

I'm a big proponent of LTR despite the anti-LTR sentiment and the next-that-bitch on this board.

The problem is that, you talk to any guy getting out of a horrible LTR, you realize quickly that its because they got into a LTR with a girl that has no fucking business being anything other than a fuck buddy.

You cannot ignore the red flags on parade and then later scream how did the red army steam roll you out of nowhere. Most average Western girls will destroy your soul and skull-fuck you in hell if you let them into your life too easily.

That said, it is silly and unnatural to deny your women-loving, children-bearing nature because one girl irrevocably damage you.

There are a lot of high-quality women out there, and even the bad ones have the positive sides that they only show to men who deserve it.
Our job as men is to be the guy who deserve and awake the good qualities in women. Takes a lot of work though, and definitely not by staying in LTR with shitty women.

Women, no matter how passionate they might have been during the relationship, can be utterly vicious and cold once they dump you.

Cant really blame them for that though because they have the wall. You waste a few years of your career on a girl and you feel devastated, thats how a girl past her prime and still without a man feel.

Hating women makes as much sense as hating children. They will always and only do what you allow them to do. Some are wonderful, some need training, some need encouragement, some need the lash, some need to be kick out with an iron boot.

For now however, I suggest just going out and hitting it for a while. Dont jump headlong into another LTR until you develop the ability to screen for quality women. You will run into enough pleasant girls while gaming I'm sure.

Just remember, your ex fucked up a few years of your life. Dont let her fuck up the rest of your life by holding on to that hatred.

Post: #18

Questor- I'd like her to get in contact with me, and apologize for ending things in such an abrupt and unfair manner. As I type that out I know it's silly, but that is what would make me feel better.

I don't want another LTR for the foreseeable future. Above all I can't afford it, both financially and professionally, and I am too fearful of falling into the same traps yet again.

Dreammedicine- Thanks for the detailed response. Haven't even gone through all the links you've posted. I don't have real life players/mentors I can de-brief about this with (meeting up with RVFers here in NYC is something I want to do as I continue to try and game this place). I have met women mostly through social circle, with an incidental approach for my most recent notch. I've been out of the work game for nearly 5 months. Have been applying to jobs online and interacting with some head hunters, mostly to no success. Have honestly only been at it aggressively for 1-2 months now. I think I've suffered irreparable career damage in that I've tried to do the whole NYC finance grind, but these hiccups in job experience have ruined that. I've also been attempting to take grad school exams and go to grad school, but the relationship (and now my moping about it) has gotten in the way.

Above all, what I'm asking is how have people gotten out of this stage of hate & distrust towards women? Reading through the forum, and some of the experienced people here I respect, it's looking like the solution is to change my plans of wanting an LTR and family one day.

Post: #19

Dalaran- She was independent, not like most women I've dealt with, pursued me (started out as a plate, a side piece during a former LTR), then asked me out). Super supportive, even as I started to unload my personal issues. Even stood by me after I put my hands on her. She was absurdly patient, honestly more so than I deserve. Attractive, would cook for me often. Like it was a great LTR, honestly the best I've had.

Red flags? 1) Parents separated young, mother died when she was young. Was surprised how put together of a person she was despite these setbacks. 2) (and this really should have done it for me) Her "processing" mechanisms seemed delayed. Multiple times something would happen that would unnerve her, and she'd bring it up with me days later. We had a huge argument a few weeks before she broke up, and her silence on the matter after we discussed it gave me the impression things were fine.

A double-edged sword to this is that my experience with her is part of my screening methodology now. I'm grateful that I have a standard to hold future women too (it's part of why I find my last notches so particularly unbearable). However, how the relationship ended, it's left me with the impression that such an abrupt switch can happen again, and again, and again.

Post: #20

The lavish treatment guys get when they are the center of a woman's life doesn't really mean they think you're so special. It's just what she does with anyone who is put in that role. That's one of the bitter pills to swallow about relationships as you rack up miles. Men and women go through this game of musical chairs with each other. Of course, this works both ways. Focus more on what you have to give and what she loses by not being with you than what you're losing.

Post: #21

^Thats a good point. Yet, one that only reinforces my current "hate" perspective.

Part of this issue is that I fell into a sense of security, one that active attendance on the RVF board during the relationship would have helped stem. I followed some of the advice (continued gaming women in social circle, took a notch that came as a layup).

Post: #22

You are in NYC, worst place for LTR in US maybe other than LA.

Know what you up against when you get the feeling you met another keeper there.

I don't care if she is a steadfast Orthodox Christian virgin from Belarus that got off the plane yesterday. Steep hill to climb.

Post: #23

(03-14-2017 03:04 PM)MaceTyrell Wrote:  one that only reinforces my current "hate" perspective.

How long do you see this lasting? If you keep going down this road you're going to reach a point where you will have simmered in bitterness over the breakup longer than the period you two were even together. I reached that point, and that's what finally made me realize it had crossed over from feeling justifiably wounded to reopening and re-wounding myself.

All anybody really has in the end are isolated pockets of memory, good and bad. Maturity is about accepting the impermanence of all things. Even in a perfect marriage you'll watch yourself and your partner grow old and hideous. Go out there and seize the day.

Post: #24

We all go through this especially after serious LTRs. Accept that is over, learn from your mistakes and move on. You'll be over it once you've banged some sloots.

Also realize that serious LTRs give you a lot of experience and knowledge about the female sex. Use it your advantage

Post: #25

It is very common that when you go out if your way or sacrifice yourself to make a woman happy you will end up miserable. In the end she will not even appreciate it cause she ends up with unhappy man eventually.

Been there done that. Anytime I did it my life started turning into a mess