Post: #1

Hey so this is my first post here and I decided to start it off with a very, very long read, so bear with me.

Last week I ended a fwb relationship that had been going on for about 6 months. Ever since I ended it, I’ve undergone a various post-hoc analysis’ of the situation and as a result the true nature of the relationship has started to unravel, and I’ve started to realize the immense amount of horseshit I was that I was not only putting up with, but enabling. The reason I got rid of her, however, was because I had started catching feelings and she wanted to keep things casual, and I knew I’d just get more hung up on her if I didn’t leave. I believe this attachment to her may have been the main reason as to why I was blind as to how she was treating me at times. You may think that a lack of abundance was my problem, but I had sex with a few other women while seeing her, and had another FWB thing going for the past couple of months. The attachment essentially came from nowhere and I think it was because I wasn’t cognizant about how this girl was torturing me with her bullshit.

Look - I know that ultimately this girl doesn't matter at all, but there have been many times in my life situations like these have happened with women and I was always a doormat who put up with their shit and I don't think I was aware even subconsciously of how much shit I was enabling by not putting my foot down. I believe there are some things to be learned from this situation, and I would like some help in uncovering them.

This girl (who is 20 years old btw) did not value my time. She was late to our first date, late to our second, and generally always took forever to show up. We had a set day and time that we’d generally hang out, and she would always drive over to my place since I lived alone. But there were many occurrences where she would text me and say "I just woke up (she worked 3rd shift, slept in until late afternoons), I have to shower quickly then I'll come over." Then 2 hours would pass and she would be saying she's on the way. (what was she doing this whole time you ask? I don’t know, she didn’t wear makeup or own a lot of clothing). And i'd be sitting around in my home expecting her to show up and not committing to anything big knowing she would be getting here "soon" except often I'd end up idling around for a long period of time.




So enough of a preamble, I'm going to lay out all the BS she did in sequential order, and you’ll notice it only gets worse over time because I enabled it ever since the first few dates.

Example 1: One day we had intended to hang out, she texts me saying she had made plans with her coworker (black lady in her late 20s) to go to lunch with some guy and his uncle for dinner, and that it “might” have been a double date. So she insisted that I join them, and even though I thought it was weird af, I agreed anyway. So guess what? She arrives there perfectly on time. Perhaps the only time she was ever on time to something with me is when she was going to meet some other dudes and compete for her attention (I can only assume this is how it would have gone). But long story short, the two guys never showed up. Make of this what you will, but the entire situation rubbed me the wrong way and it felt very strange. My uncomfortable feelings were mostly due to the fact that she showed up on time for someone else. A few weeks later we incidentally ended up going to the same restaurant again, I arrived on time and she responds with “how punctual.” and shows up almost half an hour late. But I said nothing about either of these instances and instead buried it all inside.

Example 2: I had mentioned wanting to go hiking somewhere next time we hung out to which she agreed, and it was a far enough drive that she would have needed to come over at a reasonable time so it wouldn’t be dark when we arrived. Well lo and behold she shows up an hour and a half later than the time we agreed on, with some story about being at the zoo, her friend yelling at her, and losing her keys and all sorts of shit. When she finally showed up she didn’t apologize and made no mention of how we didn’t get to go hiking to the place I mentioned.
Her excuse about why she was late was puzzling, though, and I didn’t find these details out until a few days afterwards. She said she had taken Adderall to help with her 3rd shift at work, only slept for a short while and then went to the zoo with a friend who wanted to wanted to have a few shots before going (even though it was like noon). Apparently she made a huge ass of herself, falling on the ground, cursing, zero self-awareness, apparently her friend yelled at her a lot and she apparently had a phone call with him afterwards that she didn’t remember at all.
Just like the last scenario, I found all of this puzzling it and distracted me from how shitty her behavior was towards me. While I did express that I was annoyed about her behavior, I was a total chickenshit about it and minced my words without really expressing how much it upset me, and in any case she was not apologetic in the slightest and acted like she did nothing wrong. It really bothered me she went to the zoo in the daytime (I could NEVER get her to hang out with me during the daytime, god forbid we actually do something besides having sex and watching Netflix for hours), then showed up to my place an hour and a half late, completely ruining our plans. She claimed she had left her keys in this dudes car and had to meet him at the mall where he worked, but this was obviously BS because the mall was quite close to where I lived and literally on the way towards my place anyway. Maybe she had make up sex him or maybe had been talking/fighting with him and lost track of time, but the excuses were paper thin and this really fucking hurt me and took a while to get over. I am angry just thinking about it.

Examples 3-5: We had made plans for her to come over around the "usual time" which lately had been around 6ish (we had a pattern of hanging out once a week on the same day and time). We had made plans to go out for dinner, so I didn’t eat anything that evening since I knew we’d be eating out. Just before 6 she sends the usual “just woke up, gonna shower and head over”. An hour and a half later she says she just got out of the shower, and is about to head out. Then another hour passes before her finally fucking shows up. So in other words, I spent 2 ½, hours waiting for her to go to dinner, on an empty stomach because it didn’t even occur to me how useless she was. And when she finally shows up, no apology at all …………no explanation about why she was even late.

The very next week she pulls the same shit - mentions around 6 she "just woke up" and would get some food on the way over. Doesn't end up showing up until fucking 8:30, somehow...

Even the next time we hang out, yet again similar thing happens... around 5:30 she messages me asking what time to come over, and I say come over now. 1 hour and 15 minutes then goes by without a response and then she says "omw" - only to not actually show up for another 45 minutes.

In addition to all this shit, there would be little things. On a few occasions she would cancel the one day of the week we had planned to hang out. She would sometimes take days to text me back even though we hardly texted at all as is. Occasionally I would ask her to blow me, and I always sensed this annoyance or lack of enthusiasm about doing it (even though I ate her out basically every time we fucked), put no effort whatsoever into it (although she claimed she had never given a blowjob before).


Little things like this, as well as the total disregard for valuing and respecting my time, were never brought up. Why did I put up with this shit, you ask? Well, she was cute, and I was afraid that yelling at her or calling her out on this bullshit would be needy or controlling. I thought that due to the casual nature of the relationship, I was just supposed to just tolerate more than I would in a real relationship, that fighting about these things would somehow be inappropriate because she wasn’t my girlfriend but just a sexual object.

Her life seemed pretty unorganized and she definitely didn’t have her shit together. I don’t know if she was truly someone who didn’t value my time or feelings, or if she was just a young and naïve 20 year old who was genuinely too disorganized to keep her shit together. Either way, I never brought any of this up and a lot of this got buried deep, and it was only after ending things with her that I realized how I’ve put up with shit like this before.

And you may have already guessed it, but I’m not super experienced with women, I’ve only had sex with 10 and half of those were just this year. But I’m sick of dealing with this shit and I’ve started to believe that it’s worth listening to your gut and saying exactly what’s on your mind without editing yourself, without being afraid to yell at them and make them upset, even if your intuition may not always be correct. It shows them that you won’t enable their bullshit, keeps them on their toes. Again, I always thought that this sort of behavior was needy and controlling, but this is wrong. I’m also generally a fairly calm and easy going person, but this may be my downfall as it blinds me to the sort of shit that women do to us without any remorse.

So to wrap this up, here are my questions I want to raise for discussion?
How do you handle yourself around women when dealing with situations like this? Do you introduce logic in a calm way and carefully explain their behavior, or do you just let them have it and yell at them? What is your strategy about following your gut/intuition and speaking your mind with total honesty? I find it so hard to recognize the difference between neurotic thoughts that come from self-doubt, anxiety, etc and genuinely real insights about a woman’s behavior in the relationship. Does this come with experience?

Post: #2

why do you have feeling from a fwb who wants to be casual?

Its a sex relationship not a relationship.

Post: #3

I only read the beginning part. You didn't establish a strong frame from the get go. And, you never tried to grow some balls during that time period. It seemed like you wanted to say/do something, but you couldn't bring yourself to do it.

Establish dominance immediately, through whatever median you used to first introduce yourself. You are the one who needs to be in control. Don't be the submissive doormat that you described, be the leader who takes control.

Start with trying to get into the abundance mentality. Once you start having women constantly blow up your phone, you will realize that it doesn't matter what you do or say with a woman. Because if what you do/say doesn't agree with one girl, you can move on to the next one. This will give you the no bullshit attitude that will give you a stronger frame.

Respect yourself.

Post: #4

No need for fancy tactics. If certain behavior bothers you then bring this up. It may "destroy her mood" and will not want to exchange orgasms but in the long term tou won't feel like a bitch for hiding it inside what pisses you off.

Post: #5

She didn't respect you but you kept her around. It's your fault she used you like that, dude, you let her! I've never been quite as cucked over a fuckbuddy but I've been in your shoes to some extent. There's no need to explain logic to women, they don't work that way. Yelling at her just plays into her frame.

Why would you go to dinner with a fuckbuddy if you didn't want to? Just say "No, I'm busy." If she keeps bugging you just ignore her. If she gets insistent maybe just turn off the text notification or block her for a while. She'll get the message that you aren't a bitch who goes to dinners, you're the guy who fucks her when her date drops her off after, then kicks her out so you can get some sleep.

It's one of those simple-but-not-easy fixes where "all" you have to do is develop frame, read books and develop yourself, and surround yourself with masculine friends from whom you can learn manly shit.

Also, your English is sloppy and disgusting. "Long story short", question marks ending declarative sentences, "unorganized", not taking the time to read the rules enough to find the newbie forum but expecting people to read that repetitive bullshit you posted. I love how you call this a very, very long read. I guess it is if you compare it to text messages and news aggregator headlines.

Grow up, Count Chocula.

Post: #6

Dinners, hiking, setting dates... Are you sure this was just a "friends with benefits" deal?

Post: #7

I remember having some similar feelings once upon a time. You are coming from a place of scarcity that's enabling you to be subservient.

You know what you should do when someone is more than 15m late without explanation (and preferably an apology for wasting your most valuable resource on this earth). make other plans. And I'm sure you know why you didn't right? You were thirsty.

These are hard-learned lessons that you have to go through for yourself. When a woman disrespects you, you either correct the behavior for immediately (if it's even worth the effort, it often isn't) or you act unphased and start getting "distant" and procede to fuck other girls.

Work on your frame. You need to think less about how she will feel about you being masculine and asserting yourself and more about what she's doing to even deserve your time. If it's just giving you pussy there are 1000s of girls that will do the same and 100s you can realistically have access to wherever you are.

Giving Sex is a base requirement for the interaction and it's like getting a D- on a test. Good you showed up and opened your legs, you get a pass. Think of what a girl would have to do to get an A+ and show her respect and attention accordingly.

Post: #8

We get the behavior from others, that we tolerate.

Post: #9

(08-03-2017 03:49 PM)DVY Wrote:  why do you have feeling from a fwb who wants to be casual?

Its a sex relationship not a relationship.

It just happened. I had no intention to ever develop feelings.

(08-03-2017 05:41 PM)Eugenics Wrote:  I remember having some similar feelings once upon a time. You are coming from a place of scarcity that's enabling you to be subservient.

You know what you should do when someone is more than 15m late without explanation (and preferably an apology for wasting your most valuable resource on this earth). make other plans. And I'm sure you know why you didn't right? You were thirsty.

These are hard-learned lessons that you have to go through for yourself. When a woman disrespects you, you either correct the behavior for immediately (if it's even worth the effort, it often isn't) or you act unphased and start getting "distant" and procede to fuck other girls.

Work on your frame. You need to think less about how she will feel about you being masculine and asserting yourself and more about what she's doing to even deserve your time. If it's just giving you pussy there are 1000s of girls that will do the same and 100s you can realistically have access to wherever you are.

Giving Sex is a base requirement for the interaction and it's like getting a D- on a test. Good you showed up and opened your legs, you get a pass. Think of what a girl would have to do to get an A+ and show her respect and attention accordingly.

Very insightful post and I think you nailed it. My attitude during this was "I have better things to invest my energy in, as long as I'm getting laid it doesn't matter how she treats me", which is self defeating.

(08-03-2017 04:46 PM)germanico Wrote:  Dinners, hiking, setting dates... Are you sure this was just a "friends with benefits" deal?

when I cut her off, I told her I thought this was basically FWB thing and she agreed. At first this didn't seem to be the case, I actually though it was an undefined relationship in the beginning.

(08-03-2017 04:19 PM)h3ltrsk3ltr Wrote:  She didn't respect you but you kept her around. It's your fault she used you like that, dude, you let her! I've never been quite as cucked over a fuckbuddy but I've been in your shoes to some extent. There's no need to explain logic to women, they don't work that way. Yelling at her just plays into her frame.

Why would you go to dinner with a fuckbuddy if you didn't want to? Just say "No, I'm busy." If she keeps bugging you just ignore her. If she gets insistent maybe just turn off the text notification or block her for a while. She'll get the message that you aren't a bitch who goes to dinners, you're the guy who fucks her when her date drops her off after, then kicks her out so you can get some sleep.

It's one of those simple-but-not-easy fixes where "all" you have to do is develop frame, read books and develop yourself, and surround yourself with masculine friends from whom you can learn manly shit.

Also, your English is sloppy and disgusting. "Long story short", question marks ending declarative sentences, "unorganized", not taking the time to read the rules enough to find the newbie forum but expecting people to read that repetitive bullshit you posted. I love how you call this a very, very long read. I guess it is if you compare it to text messages and news aggregator headlines.

Grow up, Count Chocula.

I wrote this last night while drunk and didn't proofread any of it. I definitely should have become more familiar with this forum so that's my mistake for not taking it seriously! You guys seem fairly sincere about this shit, I'm used to messaging boards and forums with white knights.

But you're right, I never said this wasn't my fault. I'm trying to learn how to recognize these things in the moment they happen so I don't find myself in these situations again. It seems like if you don't set the right frame from the beginning, you leave the door open to be treated poorly. Say I was still with this girl right now and had not ended things with her, would it even be possible to come back from this?

It seems like once they've already outplayed you, it's best to cut your losses. I do find that I ended things with her before I had a chance to bring all of this up, but a harsh lesson learned.

Side note...how is yelling at her playing into her frame? What if they actually did something really shitty to you? And wtf is wrong with going to dinner?

Post: #10

Post: #11

Walk. I only read the first couple paragraphs but for God's sake just walk when things are that bad.

Post: #12

Be late ...check,

Be slow to respond...check,

Show no acknowledgement of slights against another...check,

Not really giving a phuck...check.

That girl has game



If she were a member pf RVF and a dude Id +1 rep her

God dam...that girl just showed you exactly to a T how game should be run. Just thank her for showing you how its done and do exactly the same thing and you'll be driving chicks to post on forums instead of vice versa

Post: #13

To the OP - admit it, you took her back and made her dessert.

http://youtu.be/JZbyarZgHR8

Post: #14

(08-03-2017 11:07 PM)PapayaTapper Wrote:  Be late ...check,

Be slow to respond...check,

Show no acknowledgement of slights against another...check,

Not really giving a phuck...check.

That girl has game



If she were a member pf RVF and a dude Id +1 rep her

God dam...that girl just showed you exactly to a T how game should be run. Just thank her for showing you how its done and do exactly the same thing and you'll be driving chicks to post on forums instead of vice versa

Do you think she was even consciously aware that she was playing me like this? Also I don't see why that shit would work on a woman, surely they don't put up with this kind of bullshit from guys.

Post: #15

(08-04-2017 08:32 AM)Batman_ Wrote:  Do you think she was even consciously aware that she was playing me like this? Also I don't see why that shit would work on a woman, surely they don't put up with this kind of bullshit from guys.

An LTR was once sucking my dick and paused to ask me why it tasted like a condom, then paused and asked me when was the last time my cleaning girl had been by. Then she went back to work with renewed enthusiasm, even though she'd clearly connected some upsetting dots. (I never fucked the cleaning girl. There was no condom. That's not the point.)

What I'm trying to say is, "you can't be serious". You really are new to women.

Women are just as subject to Oneitis as we are, if not more so. If she's interested in you (you're demonstrating your value and fucking her properly), the less she feels like you need her, the more obsessively she'll be trying to solve the Rubik's Cube of keeping your attention. For women, attention is the currency they get paid in for their hard work on a dick they deem desirable. When she thinks she can't lose you, and especially if she thinks there's literally nobody else you could fuck - because no woman wants a man other women don't want - she'll no longer compete for your attention.

Instead, she gamed you. Whether she was doing it intentionally or not doesn't matter, she behaves this way because she's rewarded for it. It drove you nuts and got you to cater to her. If she'd been great at sucking cock, you'd still be putting up with it and probably putting her down as the beneficiary on all your accounts by now.

In any case, read your Tomassi. All women seek a source of indignation: "bullshit" to put up with. If their lives get too easy, they'll start making up things to be indignant about. Always be the target of her indignation without remorse, but without ever showing her you know what you're doing. You're just that valuable guy who fucks her really good AND WHY DON'T YOU LOVE ME?! IS IT BECAUSE I WON'T BRING MY FRIENDS OVER FOR THREESOMES? FINE! YOU CAN FUCK MY FRIENDS IN FRONT OF ME. I LOVE THIS BECAUSE I'M SO COOL AND THE BEST WOMAN EVER.

I'm not even being funny. Let's back way up, here.

https://therationalmale.com/2013/08/07/a...to-reason/
https://therationalmale.com/2011/10/17/indignation/
https://therationalmale.com/2012/03/27/dread-games/

If you're trying to decide whether to argue with her logically or scream at her, you've probably already got an architectural problem in the relationship that's causing her to act up and need to re-establish yourself as the leader and the one who needs her less than she needs you.

Post: #16

(08-04-2017 08:32 AM)Batman_ Wrote:  

(08-03-2017 11:07 PM)PapayaTapper Wrote:  Be late ...check,

Be slow to respond...check,

Show no acknowledgement of slights against another...check,

Not really giving a phuck...check.

That girl has game



If she were a member pf RVF and a dude Id +1 rep her

God dam...that girl just showed you exactly to a T how game should be run. Just thank her for showing you how its done and do exactly the same thing and you'll be driving chicks to post on forums instead of vice versa

Do you think she was even consciously aware that she was playing me like this? Also I don't see why that shit would work on a woman, surely they don't put up with this kind of bullshit from guys.

Post: #17

(08-04-2017 09:02 AM)Jetset Wrote:  <drops knowledge>

Post: #18

Sounds like YOU were HER FWB and you had a strong case of oneitis. Just like PapayaTapper pointed out....she played you like a fiddle.

However, you did the right thing about not bitching and moaning to her about it. At least you kept it inside. The only thing wrong about this is that you truly did care about it. The next step is to not give a fuck.

It's too bad you ended this 'relationship'. I would have suggested inviting her over and then head out and do something else. Be gone all night. She would show up and you wouldn't be there. She would ask "Hey, I came over at XX time. Where were you?" and you would respond "Oh, you were late so I just made other plans with some friends."

Learn and move on. Apply what knowledge you have gained and use it on your next oneiti....oops, I mean 'FWB'.

Post: #19

(08-04-2017 08:32 AM)Batman_ Wrote:  

(08-03-2017 11:07 PM)PapayaTapper Wrote:  Be late ...check,

Be slow to respond...check,

Show no acknowledgement of slights against another...check,

Not really giving a phuck...check.

That girl has game


If she were a member pf RVF and a dude Id +1 rep her

God dam...that girl just showed you exactly to a T how game should be run. Just thank her for showing you how its done and do exactly the same thing and you'll be driving chicks to post on forums instead of vice versa

Do you think she was even consciously aware that she was playing me like this? Also I don't see why that shit would work on a woman, surely they don't put up with this kind of bullshit from guys.

So you haven't read much here on the forum, right? The BLUE PILL has you.

"Knock Knock Batman_."

Post: #20

(08-04-2017 08:32 AM)Batman_ Wrote:  Do you think she was even consciously aware that she was playing me like this? Also I don't see why that shit would work on a woman, surely they don't put up with this kind of bullshit from guys.

Buddy - Papaya told you how it is.

I would rep that girl as well, because she has clearly showed perfect Alpha characteristics.

If she was a guy, then it was a Player who banged plenty and you were one of his side-pieces. He sometimes left keys in cars of other chicks he banged. He did not like to eat you out, because you were a 6.5 to him and he banged plenty of 8s and 7s. That is why he did not respond to your texts for weeks, because he was busy fucking hotter poonani.

If that was a man, then his texts of "I woke up, will come over after I shower." - that would be a good text. Maybe a man would be better with his timing, but maybe not.

Also as others have pointed out - you have a lot to learn young Padawan.

Women will be on perfect time if they are into you and she clearly was not. You were living in her frame and not reverse. If I call a I girl I am fucking and she is not picking up the phone or calling me back ASAP, then I fucking drop her. I expect shit-tests and the like during the early period, but not later.

Learn from it - learn from this Dark Force user of your fuckbuddy - she shows you exactly how to behave in the crimson arts.

She let you do this instead of her doing it:

Post: #21

(08-04-2017 09:35 AM)Zelcorpion Wrote:  Also as others have pointed out - you have a lot to learn young Padawan...Learn from it - learn from this Dark Force user of your fuckbuddy - she shows you exactly how to behave in the crimson arts

Actual photo of Batman_ reading this thread:



He's gonna be OK. He's thinking and learning.

Post: #22

I took the red pill around the start of 2014. I spent a lot of time learning how to initially attract women. I took massive action and was doing a lot of cold approach. Then in 2016 I genuinely stopped giving a fuck about women completely and did not keep myself sharp, I didn’t keep this knowledge internalized. I think during that time I may have been brainwashed once again by culture and the media into blue pill styled thinking.

2017 rolls around and suddenly I’m finding myself interested in actually pursuing women again. I listened to the recordings from the Black Phillip Show on XM radio hosted by the late Patrice O’Neal (rip) who was a red pilled God before the red pill was even a thing. (here’s a clip from the show that’s just pure gold https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fCpHHJAk_zE) The crazy thing though is that some of the things he said are already becoming obsolete. Culture changes so quickly now and as a result the game keeps changing too.

My problem, however, was that I thought these rules didn't apply to me as much because this was a "casual" relationship, I thought I was immune to oneitis because I was still seeing other women. I thought all I had to do was give this girl good sex and not be needy and I didn’t really need to do anything else. I forgot one of the most vital lessons that I had always known about, I forgot that you have to keep gaming them the entire time, it’s never over. I was in a haze for most of this year. I’ve been struggling with depression for over 12 years and I’m definitely a hard case. In fact in April I had a major depressive episode that was so bad I spent many nights repeating “kill yourself” over and over in my head for long periods of time, trying to figure out how to end my life. Then I started seeing a psychoanalyst and got myself back on track. Incidentally it was around April that things really started getting bad with this girl. I told her how much I was struggling, which turned out to be a big mistake, because apparently she interpreted that as an invitation to just take advantage of me even more.

…I feel sick to my stomach. I haven’t been eating much or sleeping well. And there have been moments of intense rage for not realizing how much I was being gamed. There have been some tough truth pills dropped in this thread. People (and no doubt women) have surely taken advantage of me before and I’m absolutely sick of it.

Just the other day some rich suburban housewife tried to do this very same shit I’m talking about. She backed into my car in a parking lot and made a huge dent in her Land Rovers bumper. I wasn’t even mad at her, I simply tried to give her my information and go on my way. But she then stood in the way of my car so I couldn’t leave, frantically trying to make phone calls to her husband. Eventually, I forced her to take a photo of my insurance info and gave her my name and number and left. But she called the cops and tried to fabricate a story that it was a hit and run and that I took off without giving her my information. Boy was I mad. I cursed at her and yelled at her and really wanted to beat her to death. But I ended up calming down very quickly and handled the situation with the cop, and she was issued a ticket. I felt invigorated to have done this and it made me realize how many times similar situations may have happened to me because of my passive attitudes towards things.

Yet this is whole situation with this girl still haunting me. My phone has incidentally started blowing up from texts, I got laid last night, and a cute Asian girl with a tight little body is coming to my place tonight but it's one of the last things on my mind. Learning all of this over the past week or so has been a lot to deal with and it's really painful to come to terms with everything.

(08-04-2017 09:02 AM)Jetset Wrote:  If you're trying to decide whether to argue with her logically or scream at her, you've probably already got an architectural problem in the relationship that's causing her to act up and need to re-establish yourself as the leader and the one who needs her less than she needs you.

If you find yourself in a situation like this despite your best efforts, surely battling their emotions with your logic can work. Reframing the dynamics in the way you described does not sound like a quick fix.

(08-04-2017 09:18 AM)[email protected] Wrote:  It's too bad you ended this 'relationship'. I would have suggested inviting her over and then head out and do something else. Be gone all night. She would show up and you wouldn't be there. She would ask "Hey, I came over at XX time. Where were you?" and you would respond "Oh, you were late so I just made other plans with some friends."

Learn and move on. Apply what knowledge you have gained and use it on your next oneiti....oops, I mean 'FWB'.

I actually feel quite vindictive and disappointed I ended things before I was even aware of all this. But I suspect I might not have become aware of all of this if I didn’t end things and get a chance to sit back and analyze things. She lives quite close to me and works near me as well so if I see her I’ll have to resist the temptation to do anything. Best to ignore her if I see her and let it go.

I actually have had another fuck buddy thing going on for a few months now. Nothing like this shit ever happened. We a chat a bit, fuck, then go our separate ways.

(08-04-2017 09:35 AM)Zelcorpion Wrote:  Buddy - Papaya told you how it is.

I would rep that girl as well, because she has clearly showed perfect Alpha characteristics.

If she was a guy, then it was a Player who banged plenty and you were one of his side-pieces. He sometimes left keys in cars of other chicks he banged. He did not like to eat you out, because you were a 6.5 to him and he banged plenty of 8s and 7s. That is why he did not respond to your texts for weeks, because he was busy fucking hotter poonani.

If that was a man, then his texts of "I woke up, will come over after I shower." - that would be a good text. Maybe a man would be better with his timing, but maybe not.

Also as others have pointed out - you have a lot to learn young Padawan.

Women will be on perfect time if they are into you and she clearly was not. You were living in her frame and not reverse. If I call a I girl I am fucking and she is not picking up the phone or calling me back ASAP, then I fucking drop her. I expect shit-tests and the like during the early period, but not later.

Learn from it - learn from this Dark Force user of your fuckbuddy - she shows you exactly how to behave in the crimson arts.

She let you do this instead of her doing it:

See my problem was I thought it was important to maintain the impression that I was an “easy going” guy, but I confused that with being a doormat. It somehow didn’t occur to me that I had no standards and that this girl didn’t give a fuck. The fact that men and women are so different and not equal in relationships blinded me to the fact that this sort of behavior, if flipped, would be highly indicative of an ice cold pimp in abundance. But this sort of behavior just sounds like a shitty, shitty thing to do to someone else. I can surely implement some of it but I really do think that not valuing someone else’s time is just a terrible thing to do to someone. But this is a battle. If I have to pick between going through something like this again or being happy, then I’ll go with the latter. My happiness is paramount.

The fucked up thing too is that she wasn't even better looking than me really. I’m a fairly good looking guy, lift weights, pay attention to my diet and what kind of clothes I wear, etc. She didn’t even go to college and her life seemed like a mess in comparison. Yet she still framed the relationship towards her benefit and made it seem like she was doing me a favor, not the other way around.

(08-04-2017 09:44 AM)Jetset Wrote:  Actual photo of Batman_ reading this thread:



He's gonna be OK. He's thinking and learning.

Oh no, I’ve been swallowing all the truth bombs right away, and I feel ill. Even before this thread I was becoming aware of the true nature of my behavior in all of this. But I feel more awake now than ever.

Post: #23

We were hard on you OP, but if what you say is true then you fit the description of a good-looking guy a bit stuck in a life crisis and Beta/Purple Pill state. Don't beat yourself up over it.

Since you are lifting already then I would recommend No-fap which will clear your mind.
In addition if you are struggling with depression, then take a good High Potency Multi, Vitamin D3 5000IU and some daily L-Tryptophan at levels of 500mg to 2000mg (start with 500mg plus the Multi - https://www.swansonvitamins.com/swanson-...ze=SW882). If you get rid of the worst toxins in the food like artificial sweeteners as well as too much MSG, then the biggest neurotoxins are done.

Within 2 weeks you will feel a stronger man especially with the high potency non-toxic multi which will give your body essential nutrients at levels that were lacking for a long time - the official RDA levels of some nutrients are bullshit. We need far more of them - vitamin C, E, D, B-group etc.

I would also recommend reading the books or site by Rollo Tomassi - Rational Male. He already has 3 books out and even some audio-books for easy listening. It will help you to reprogram yourself from the Blue Pill indoctrination that we are all influenced by since our childhood.

Since you are already in good shape, are good-looking, you get laid because of it - all you need to become is simply more Red Pill aware and a stronger version of yourself. It does not matter whether you are introverted or extroverted - you fit Game to your personality and not vice-versa. You don't "game your women" - you are sometimes the cocky funny, the amused mastery guy, the automatic joking shit-test deflector, the iron Frame-holder of "My way or the Highway missy". You have to realize that this is how men should all be taught to treat women - like casual good-natured slightly arrogant chauvinists.

If you want to show weakness or talk about your problems - talk with a male friend.

Those are some basic kernels of wisdom. By the way - some women report that certain men are attractive, but "too nice" for them. So they come back occasionally for sex, but the pull of a more dominant more Alpha man is simply stronger. The good part is - that countless men have learned to bring out the "more Alpha guy out" - or to create better "chemistry". Women .... chemistry .... yeah - Game is learned charisma.

Post: #24

(08-04-2017 03:27 PM)Batman_ Wrote:  See my problem was I thought being an “easy going” guy who doesn’t give a fuck was an attractive quality. But it somehow didn’t occur to me that I had no standards and that this girl didn’t give a fuck. The fact that men and women are so different and not equal in relationships blinded me to the fact that this girl didn’t give a fuck about me. It didn’t occur to if a man were to emulate her behavior around his girl, it would imply he was in abundance. But even hearing that now it like a shitty, shitty thing to do to someone else. I can surely implement some of it but I really do think that not valuing someone else’s time is just a terrible thing to do to someone. But this is a battle. If I have to pick between going through something like this again or being happy, then I’ll go with the latter. My happiness is paramount.

Dont beat yourself up. We ve all been there and most often than not some kind of negative experience with women is the catalyst that led us here.

From youre post I can tell youre going to be alright. Youre already way ahead of most new posters that stumble in here and then refuse to see the truth. Youve made leaps forward already


Edit: After reading Jetsets post below I reread OP and concur with his assessment

Edit You did nothing wrong ethically. The mistake you made was assuming this empty headed vagina transporter was capable of the same level of empathy, consideration and humanity as you. Welcome to Game

Edit: After reading Jetsets post below I reread OP and concur with his assessment.

Post: #25

(08-04-2017 03:27 PM)Batman_ Wrote:  My problem, however, was that I thought these rules didn't apply to me as much because this was a "casual" relationship, I thought I was immune to oneitis because I was still seeing other women. I thought all I had to do was give this girl good sex and not be needy and I didn’t really need to do anything else.

I got to tell you, waiting two and a half hours for some silly bitch is pretty needy. Look up "compliance testing". She constantly did this and you constantly passed: she decides what will happen, and you sat through it patiently. This girl knows she's just a FWB, that's more than enough time to bring some over plate over to bang and make sure this one can smell it on you if she ever shows up.

In the future, you pull her into your frame. You set the compliance tests. You withdraw attention if she fails. Innocent, contextual things. Be ten minutes late, tell her to wait for you at the end of the bar. Tell her to wear that black top with the lace shoulders.

I didn't read all of your examples as closely as I should have the first time, but holy shit, bro. Example #1? She knew exactly what she was doing the whole time. She made absolutely certain that you would do anything she said and put up with anything. She literally invited you to come watch her date another guy, and you went. Did she try to legally change your name to Reek, too? Why did you go? What were you trying to accomplish? Be honest.

Quote:I told her how much I was struggling, which turned out to be a big mistake, because apparently she interpreted that as an invitation to just take advantage of me even more.

Especially with this one, but yes, AWALT. Proactively trying to be horrible like this woman, though? NAWALT. That is some epic vile behavior, there.

Quote:Boy was I mad. I cursed at her and yelled at her and really wanted to beat her to death. But I ended up keeping calming down very quickly and handled the situation with the cop, and she was issued a ticket. I felt invigorated to have done this and it made me realize how many times similar situations may have happened to me because of my passive attitudes towards things.

I never really went through this, but in reading some of the red pill literature, this seems to be a common reaction to seeing human nature for what it is. You were promised Disney and invested in Disney, and found out it's not Disney. The bitterness will pass.

Quote:If you find yourself in a situation like this despite your best efforts, surely logically battling their emotions with your logic can work.

You know what happens when a woman you're arguing with realizes you're right? That's when the really disrespectful, crazy shit comes out. It's a waste of time. You cannot negotiate for her pussy and it sets a bad precedent where you have to justify things that are not negotiable for you. It will be more effective to just tell her that no, she can't have her way. If she's argumentative and bloody-minded about a reasonable compromise, don't be afraid to tell her that now she gets nothing.

You don't have to walk away and start with the right dynamic. You can often fix the existing one. It won't be easy, but ultimately, she wants the right dynamic and will fall into compliance if you work through her tests. Show her that you're going to do what makes you happy and she can go along as a guest in your life or fuck off. Try making her rephrase a demand or telling her "no" sometimes over small things, for no sensible reason, just to teach her to be polite to you and that you are the decider.

I literally just made the LTR say 'please' for permission to cook my dinner early because she's hungry. Keeping the leash one notch too tight is always better than keeping it one notch too loose. It's all in good fun, though. I delivered it with a smile and she was giggling.

Quote:See my problem was I thought being an “easy going” guy who doesn’t give a fuck was an attractive quality.

"Not giving a fuck" here means that when she shows up half an hour late, you already tried to get a phone number off your waitress and went to another bar of your choosing. When she texts you and asks you where you are, tell her you left and went to another bar. She can join you if she wants. When she finds you chatting up a woman there, who gives a fuck? Next time, she should show up on time and this won't happen. It's been half an hour and your dick isn't going to suck itself.

Keep your own life moving. Your happiness first.

Quote:The fucked up thing too is that I was probably better looking than her. I’m a good looking guy and lift weights, pay attention to my diet, what kind of clothes I wear, etc. She didn’t even go to college and her life seemed like a mess in comparison. Yet she still framed the relationship towards her benefit and made it seem like she was doing me a favor, not the other way around.

She would have burned your entire life down dragging you into her disaster of a world, and then blamed you for all of her problems when it was over.

As for being vindictive, you can't out psychopath a psychopath. They're better at it than you are. I would leave this one in the dumpster where you put it.

If you think about it, she was completely worthless. Not even good at sucking dick. Dumping her was as unimportant as firing a shoddy handyman.