Post: #1

Why do many women not shit test? I’ve been on some dates with some pretty women (from online) and they were usually the ones who tried to initiate physical contact during the date. These are women who are perhaps 7-8/10 physically but with good personalities and strong educational backgrounds/careers (CEO, doctors, Phds, etc).

I tend to present a strong frame prior to the meet (non needy text game, and I always call prior to the meet to get a feel for who they are). I imagine women get the idea that I’m not a guy they should fuck with because I tend to look aggressive/masculine (I lift and have a good jawline), and my body language shows that as well. I am very stoic by nature.

The few tests I do get, I tend to raise my eyebrows out of amusement, or just smile like I know what she’s doing.

My question is, do women not test some guys because they’re not interested, or because they feel confident in the guy’s masculinity?

Post: #2

You’re answering your own question here. They initiate physicality. They’re already sold on you. Interesting topic to me because from my experience, I use to get shit tested a lot. Not really now. What changed? Stronger frame and confidence and just general not giving fucks about what people think of me. What happened onthese recent dates where you weren’t shit tested? You close?

Post: #3

I don't think women do a whole lot of shit testing on the first few dates if they already like you. In turns into more of a slow poison drip that they do when you enter into a relationship with them.

Post: #4

If you are dating well below your SMV, she will not test you, since she knows she has got a good deal.

The whole reason women shit test is to see if she has a good man, that doubt only happens when you are close, or she has higher SMV.

Date better women, and you will feel the barrage of endless shit tests.

Post: #5

(04-08-2019 04:58 PM)RatInTheWoods Wrote:  If you are dating well below your SMV, she will not test you, since she knows she has got a good deal.

The whole reason women shit test is to see if she has a good man, that doubt only happens when you are close, or she has higher SMV.

Date better women, and you will feel the barrage of endless shit tests.

A guy with Brad pitt looks baffled by the fuss all these 'sexist' guys are making, would wonder why men just don't approach an 8 girl, say hi, and be a nice guy to her. That would be enough within his logic and experience. But nah. RITW is spot on on this one. Those girls who are not shit testing you are probably being cunts to guys with lower value than yours.

Post: #6

If youre banging girls on the regular that dont seem to be testing then whats the problem?

But if youre not then maybe youre getting tested and dont realize it.


Some, especially very attractive and smart girls often shit test very subtly rather than directly. Sometimes they dont even do it consciously...but they do.

Two most common stealth shit tests:

1. Questions

A question, any question, can serve as a shit test.

For example (And Ive used this before): Youre at a bar drinking a beer and a woman you just met asks you "What are you drinking?" She knows youre drinking a beer: She can see youre drinking a beer.

You answer logically "A beer"

Shit test failed...and you didn't even know you were being tested.

Answering direct questions with direct answers it a shit test fail. It shows youre following her into her frame.

You want to pass the "question" test? Ignore it and ask a question of your own

Her "What are you drinking?"

PT "You always wear white after Labor Day?" ( Or some other non sequitur ).

The point is youre going to lead the interaction...Not her.

And thats what she's looking for

2. Eye contact.

I know this has been discussed ad-naseum on the forum but its worth repeating. Its one of the "fundamentals" thats easy to forget in the heat of the moment especially if inside youre thinking "damn this chicks hot".

If you can confidently (not creepily) hold eye contact the first time you see / meet a girl and make her break off first you are well on your way to passing her subsequent shit tests.

Even the ones you dont see coming.

Post: #7

educated people in general come from "lighter" as opposed to "harder" environments, so they tend to play less aggressive word games, tend to poke at others less, and tend to no try and "trick" people for fun/to see if they can get away with it. the "shit test" phenomena is not common to women only. I know a ghetto kid who frequently tries to trick people into buying him things, pretend he is mad, etc.

also, much of a girls tendency to "shit tests" or act arrogant seems to be somewhat separate from her physical attractiveness, and related to the type of environment she is from and the friends she has. a ghetto "5" may shit test way more than an "8" college girl. the ghetto "5" may require man to be more masculine than some "8" college girl.

I also have noticed I go unchallenged by many girls, only to later catch them talking down to other guys. i sometimes come in to back up the guys they're making fun off, and the girl rapidly backs off.

ability to win (and often even better not engage) in social fights and argue/reframe in a way that makes you look good to bystanders goes a long way.

(04-10-2019 10:23 AM)PapayaTapper Wrote:  1. Questions

A question, any question, can serve as a shit test.

For example (And Ive used this before): Youre at a bar drinking a beer and a woman you just met asks you "What are you drinking?" She knows youre drinking a beer: She can see youre drinking a beer.

You answer logically "A beer"

Shit test failed...and you didn't even know you were being tested.

Answering direct questions with direct answers it a shit test fail. It shows youre following her into her frame.

You want to pass the "question" test? Ignore it and ask a question of your own

Her "What are you drinking?"

PT "You always wear white after Labor Day?" ( Or some other non sequitur ).

The point is youre going to lead the interaction...Not her.

I consider myself a person who can pass almost every "shit test". If a girl asked me what I am drinking, I would probably answer with a joke, answer seriously and not realize she was playing , or if it was an obvious dumb question, i might answer playfully ( or maybe with a straight face, wait for her to get sad, and then reveal im kidding) "a fucking beer, are you dumb or something ? "
but i would never for the life of me thought to answer with an unrelated non-sequiter. interesting. i will try it.

however, I can instinctive tell when i am being talked down to, and always drop a comeback that corresponds with the emotions and severity of the talking down.

Quote:2. Eye contact.

I know this has been discussed ad-naseum on the forum but its worth repeating. Its one of the "fundamentals" thats easy to forget in the heat of the moment especially if inside youre thinking "damn this chicks hot".

If you can confidently (not creepily) hold eye contact the first time you see / meet a girl and make her break off first you are well on your way to passing her subsequent shit tests.

Even the ones you dont see coming.

eye contact is the fucking king - at a primal level whoever can hold a straight faced gaze longer is boss. I used to be obsessive about the whole eye contact thing, but now I already know I can win the eye contact/dominance game with almost all girls, so I don't always bother unless its an obvious staredown.

Sometimes, when I am done talking with a girl, there is a strong mutual eye contact at the end of a conversation, I always used to keep staring until I won, but now I sometimes walk off with the girl still staring at me. ( i think this looks good from a third person point of view) what do you guys think ?

Post: #8

(04-11-2019 01:27 AM)MarshalZhukov Wrote:  but i would never for the life of me thought to answer with an unrelated non-sequiter. interesting. i will try it.

Thats because youre not a psychopath (in the clinical sense...not the mainstream serial killer version of "psycho").

But this in large part explains why very attractive girls are attracted to men they know they shouldn't be (bad boys). Their need to be led is almost uncontrollably drawn to the guy who wont follow her into her frame because he truly just doesn't and cant give a shit

It goes against all logic and social conditioning. If youre a normal , well adjusted it, decent guy it takes a conscious effort to totally disregard a direct question from anyone...but especially from an attractive girl who your id tells you you must "win over".

Its counter intuitive...but its super effective in the very first interaction(s)

Post: #9

As far as my body language, I’ll add that one night a while back I was walking home downtown in a wealthy area, alone, and on an empty, dimly lit street these three people were approaching me.

There were no lights around and I noticed the three people were black, in their mid 20s, clearly looked like they were from southside chicago (hood). Two guys and one chick. Kept my head up and my body language normal. Apparently, my body language must be very strong because the girl, after passing me, broke away from her two guys and came back to me and opened me asking how old I was and if I had a girlfriend.

If I presented an appearance that was enough to impress a chick from the hood, where she’s surrounded by high testosterone thugs all day, then my body language must be very intimidating by default.

I know black chicks tend to approach more and are more aggressive, but they’re not attracted to weak looking men. So maybe its my appearance/body language that’s causing these normal, educated women not to test me.. I have to be sending out a fucked up vibe.

Post: #10

As far as eye contact.. in business I’ve noticed the most powerful, intimidating men are those who are:

1) quiet
2) don’t break eye contact
3) don’t nod their head AT ALL
4) move slowly

#3 is crucial. Its almost guaranteed those people have seen or experienced some fucked up shit. That kind of stuff fascinates me.