Post: #1

Fucking hell. Go out with a friend tonight. He's more that an acquaintance, less than what I would truly consider a friend...

We regularly go out on Saturday nights but that's really about it. Guy can't Wong for shit. Kind of a bitch. Always complaining about wanting to go home early, won't go out if it's raining, etc.

Anyway, tonight we go out for dinner first, go to a bar, he says he forgot his umbrella so he goes to get it and I go to bar while I wait. No hot girls. I order a beer and wait. He shows up and as we debate sticking around it moving else where a few girls walk in. Not bad. He points out a fat one and says she's alright. I disagree and he says "who's better?" i point out a few and he gets upset. Wtf? I'm free to like what I want. She's fat faced. I don't like it. So what? Anyway, he says "who's better?" I point out four that I think are better. We argue a little. (!) another guy walks in all suited up and stands at our table. I'm thinking this guys a player. Looks like one totally (to me anyway). He hears my friend go on about te girl I thought was fat. He says "you should go talk to them". I'm like, I don't want to. He's the one who thinks she's hot. Then my friend changes his story. "I didn't say she was the hottest in here. I said she's in the top 3 or four." Whateer. You just challenges me to point out better. Anyway, I point out a couple girls that I think are better. We play marry-fuck-kill. The player and I agree. Player says let's go talk to them. Thinking, fuckin A, a real wing. We go and he and I get taking to the girls. Everything going good enough. Not 10 minutes into it, my friend taps me on the shoulder. "come in man, let's go. These guys behind me spilling drinks are pissing me off." I'm not impressed that he is breaking up my convo cuz he can't wait a bit but I get the number and go. We leave. Out the building, I say "let's go so that you can interrupt my game while I'm talking to a girl again." snarky, I know, but fuck, this is not the first time and it pisses me off that I even have to mention it to him. He starts arguing with me about how I hadn't approached until the other guy asked me to wing for him, etc. so fucking what? She was hot and I was doing ok. I'm trying to tell him that it's not cool and it's not the first time. Why are we even discussing this? Wtf? He should know better. He gets pisse off and takes off to go home! I'm like, "are you fucking serious??!" what a bitch move.

So he goes home and I'm soloing now. Fuck that. He has click locked and interrupted my game more times than I can count. Tires of explaining things to him. I have to conquer solo game, but it's hard. I don't feel comfortable alone in clubs. Don't know why because when I go
Out with my friends, I usually ditch them them to PU anyway. But having that home base makes all the difference. Don't know why. But I gotta get over this. I don't know one guy that can go out with me on Saturdays that would make a good wing.

Post: #2

Friends are not wings. They often get in the way. Go solo- stay focused.

Post: #3

Wings have always been a hindrance to my game rather than a help. You don't need your buddies for moral support.

Post: #4

Tell that to my friends, soup.

Post: #5

I only wing with other guys who are proven entities. I can tell in 10 minutes of talking to a guy if he will be an asset or liability on the field.

If he is a liability, I ditch him with no excuses or apologies, if he is an asset, I buy him a bottle of vodka.


Mixx

Post: #6

Mixx - how do u know if the guy will be an asset within 10 min?

Post: #7

Gmac, you probably roll with better players than me and my friends.

I think if they know how to wing, it's great. But even my friends who want to game get in the way. I'd rather go gaming with someone who is more advanced than me, but I'm probably the one with the most game in my circle (which isn't saying much about my friends).

Usually they want it to be all casual and laid back, like a bro-hang. When I go out to pickup, It's like working a job. Also, I get annoyed when I watch them fuck-up because I'd like to say something, but it's rude to correct them in the field.

Post: #8

That guy doesn't sound like he's comfortable approaching women cold at all. He's not much of a friend OR wing. You should hang out socially, but if you're going to be out hunting either don't bring him, or tell him to back off. If he wants to go home, tell him you'll talk to him later.

Post: #9

(11-19-2011 04:11 PM)soup Wrote:  Gmac, you probably roll with better players than me and my friends.

I think if they know how to wing, it's great. But even my friends who want to game get in the way. I'd rather go gaming with someone who is more advanced than me, but I'm probably the one with the most game in my circle (which isn't saying much about my friends).

Usually they want it to be all casual and laid back, like a bro-hang. When I go out to pickup, It's like working a job. Also, I get annoyed when I watch them fuck-up because I'd like to say something, but it's rude to correct them in the field.

I've got a friend who is a natural wing (Black Thunder if you read the blog). He was until recently in a long term relationship. Big guy, loud and funny. Perfect for isolation and comic relief.

Then of course, VK and Rookie. Tonight will be the first night we've all been out together in nearly two months. Can't wait.

I can see how having rookies and wannabe players hanging around would be a pain in the ass though. I once made the mistake of talking about game with some guy while I was out one night. Dude would not leave Rookie or myself alone... we ended up having to blatantly ditch him.

I drop these guys faster than a fuck buddy who packed on 10 pounds. Don't waste your time, they will bring you do.

Post: #10

Wow. Looked at my post from last night and seeing all the typos. I typed that on my iPhone and I was in the process of getting hammered so, sorry about that. LOL I think you got the gist of it though, right?

Honestly, this guy is argumentative as fuck and is such a shitty wing, I don't know why I go out with him. Well, no, that's not true. I do know why. I'm dependent on him because I don't have the nuts to go out solo. But I don't know why I need to do that. Like I said, when I go out, I normally end up going around the club alone anyway to hit on girls. I run my game much better that way. I don't work nearly as well when I got someone with me. If someone wings for me, it's to remove the other and distract her for me, not so that we can all sit there and chat together.

This guy has cut my grass so often, not only is he a shitty wing, sometimes I wonder what kind of 'friend' he even is.

For example, a few months ago we went to a club together and we were just getting warmed up. I was in line to order a drink, standing beside this guy. He was ordering shots and I said to him, "hey, buy me shot too!" as a joke. He said, "sure!" and orders me one. I'm thinking, hey that's pretty cool of him. So this guy and me go to his group (two guys two girls), down the shots, and start shooting the shit. My buddy joins too. The girls are the guy's friends only, but not so hot. I decide to hang and talk with the two new guys for a bit. The four of us are just chillin' for a while. A little while later, I spot two girls not far from us and go to talk to one of them. I've got my back to the three guys (my bud and the two new guys) as I'm talking to the girl. We are getting along fine. This is all in Japanese cuz the girl doesn't speak much English. Then I noticed something out of the corner of my eye and turn around. The three guys are all hovering over us, less than a foot away! "What the fuck guys??!" My bud says, "hey, we just want to see the master at work! hahaha" Way to go, dick.

Another time, way before that, it was one of our first times out gaming together. I say that loosely...

After a night out together, we are heading home. It's close to last train. As we enter the subway, and I start heading down the stairs, he's taking the escalator ahead of me. I stroll up next to a girl who is on her cell phone. I smile, she smiles back. I say hi, she nods. I ask her who she's talking to, she answers it's her English teacher. Midnight on the phone with her English teacher? haha. So he's more than that, I smirk knowingly and leave her to her phone call. Meet up with my bud on the platform, we exchange a few words and I notice the girl has gone and planted herself not too far from us. So I go up to her, she smiles at me again, and I tell her to get off the phone so she can talk to me. To my surprise, she says to the guy "I'll call you back later" and starts chatting with me. We start talking and not 20 seconds into it, my buddy is standing right there beside us and starts talking about all sorts of stupid shit, completely irrelevant to what I am saying to her, asking her where she lives, what she does, etc. I pop completely out of state because of his interruptions and things go sour. After the subway ride, we get off (the girl stays on) and I tell him he fucked my shit up. He starts to get defensive. "She smiled at me, dude." AYFKM?! She was smiling because we were having a good talk! He tried to defend himself as if he had a right to swoop in somehow. When that wasn't working, "she looked scared and freaked out." WTF?!! You just said she was smiling! And who the fuck is he to white knight her anyway? If she was freaked out, she had an entire subway station to run away from me (and would not have hung up on her man to talk to me). This argument went on for a fucking hour. He just does not get it. Not only doesn't he know 'how' to wing, he doesn't even get the concept that you should at least be trying to help your friends, even if you don't really know how. Nothing but trying to defend himself the whole time and his lame ass behavior. This guy has fucked me up so many times, I am almost ashamed of the fact that I continue to invite him out with me.

Last night was the last straw. Fuck that noise, I am done.

I have GOT to get over going out solo. Last night after he walked away like a bitch, I soloed all night. Didn't pick up, but I made friends with a couple of guys. The most action I got all night was some grinding on the dance floor that didn't go anywhere. Maybe I should've escalated. The club was full of girls 15 to 20 years younger than me, so it's no surprise that it is a challenging venue. Osaka sucks for clubs though. If I was 22, maybe not so much, but being over 40, I work better in an atmosphere that is a little less party party and is a bit more chill where I can talk. The only problem is that the places that have that vibe are more dives than anything else and the quality of girls is much lower - if there are any worth talking to at all. Tokyo is much better. So many places to go out to.

Anyway, I'm starting to ramble. I've slept six hours but I'm still drunk from last night. LOL

Post: #11

even if you find a pair of girls for you and your wingman, chances for sex are rare,
usually because your wingman is lacking game or the girl his with is very stuck up.


in my opinion, youll have a higher chance if you go out alone,
youll have more freedom and nobody holding you back.

the only one night stands i ever had was when i was by myself.

Post: #12

drop him lol. read that thread "going dolo" and read up a bit on it. I recommend you go solo next time..

btw how is Osaka for foreigners(tall,white)

Post: #13

A full 98% of other men, sadly including your friends, will at best be absolutely useless, or at worst salt you up during the pickup.

And it's a weak crutch to stand on, the 'wingman'. I'm lucky enough that my best friend and I know each other well and have been tight for over ten years and we can seamlessly wing for each other. Recently, he got a girlfriend and some outside constraints (not the girl, she loves me and she's actually a pretty cool chick) have made it so instead of hanging out every weekend or other weekend, I can only see him every 4-6 weeks. You think I want to wait 4-6 weeks to pull women?

Solo is the way to go(lo).

Post: #14

(11-20-2011 11:43 PM)drymarro Wrote:  btw how is Osaka for foreigners(tall,white)

Any major Japanese city is good if you're tall and white, and especially if you're blond haired and light-eyed. Ask me how I know (well, except for that tall part, but tall is relative so I was fine).

Small towns are another matter, you'll get a lot more gaijin hate.

I love Osaka, next to Kobe it's my favorite Japanese city, but I'm partial to Kansai.

Post: #15

Picking up in Japan depends on a lot of things. You hear lots of guys say that it's 'easy' and I used to think, damn, what's wrong with me? It ain't 'easy' for me! The problem was miscommunication. What I considered 'easy' is that you can go out to a bar and 'most' of the time, pick up a snl. I thought that's what they meant. Then I started slowly figuring out that they couldn't do that any better than the next guy. What they meant by 'easy' was that you could go out a few times, eventually meet a girl who likes you and let you bang her three dates later. That was 'easy' to them because these guys had no game and getting laid in three dates back home was practically unheard of.

I know lots of guys here and none of them, not one, can consistently go out and pick up SNLs, and no one I know can do so with 8's even semi-consistently. In fact, I only know personally maybe two guys that have had girls better than my ex and I'm not a master PUA by any means. I never see foreigners with anything above an 8, ever.

It also depends on what your world is. If you spend all your time teaching at a conversation school and bars that only foreigners go to, then you've got an instant pool of anywhere between 300 to 800 students to choose from, plus all the girls that go to the bars you like. Why do they go to those bars? To meet foreigners. So yeah, that's 'easy' to a degree. The problem is, these foreigner bars attract very few real hotties. The kinds of girls that are enamored with foreigners are so for a reason. They also tend to like the very casual attitudes of the west. Unfortunately, that means they end up dressing like shit and wearing minimal makeup and think that being 25 lbs overweight is all cool. There are a few cuties that are maybe in the 7-8 range, but they are few. In addition to all this, most of the guys that come here think that the average Japanese girl is 'hot' because here they're almost all thin. Even being 15 lbs overweight is 'thin' back home. So they land what is only really a 5.5 or 6 here and they feel like they're banging Ms. Japan. They're not, but they haven't acclimatized to the environment yet, so they don't realize it. If you're lucky (good?) enough to get yourself a Japanese 7.5 or 8 while you're still FOB, that's great because then you feel like you're doing a 10 (at least until you get used to your environment).

The fact is that as long as you hang out exclusively in places that attract women who like your foreign-ness, then you'll believe that all Japanese girls are 'easy'. The truth is that 9/10 have no interest in your dirty foreign ass.

The real hot ones, the ones that look fantastic, dress really nice, do up their hair properly, etc., most of these girls have no interest in English or your culture and therefore are a lot harder to pick up. First, you'll need to speak Japanese. Then you'll have to speak it well enough to exhibit your personality through it. Then you'll have to have some game.

If you want top-shelf, you're going to have to work for it. Being tall, blond and have blue eyes will help you immensely. For the record, being skinny is fine here. Big and buff might be impressive to some, but many don't care at all and in fact, many say they prefer thin. Just don't be fat.

All that said, I'm sure there's a guy out there somewhere who is pulling in some quality all the time. I don't know him, but I'm sure he's out there. Just don't be fooled by what you read on the net. For 99% of guys, it's going to be somewhere between really fucking hard and impossible. The keyboard jockeys want to lay claim that they are constantly pulling in some great quality but if that's true then why haven't I met them?

Anyway, I don't mean to sound negative. They're out there and you can get some very decent girls. The 'average' girl here 5 is equivalent to I'd say a 7 in Canada because of the body and style, so if banging a 7 makes you happy then yeah, go for the 5's when you're here and bang away with a smile on your face. (I will always remember my American friend that came to visit. He picked up a fat fucking 3.5 and banged her two days straight, laughing his ass off. We kept asking him why, oh why?? He just said, dude if you could understand how good she looks to me because of how fat everyone back home is! LOL This guy was a decent looking brick shithouse, too. In his eyes, she was a 6.)

Post: #16

Japan is beginning to sound like the Peru of Asia.

Based on what I'm reading on this forum,Japan sounds like Latinos, and non-whites won't do to well, especially if they don't speak moderate Japanese.

I personally knew this one kid who lived in Japan, but he was short about 5'6 (1.70m), and had black hair, skinny, and pale-white skin tone. He could not rave about Japan easy girls enough.

Mixx

Post: #17

I don't know about latinos, but blacks seem to do alright. Hip hop is fairly popular in some circles. Again, these guys are going to attract girls that are into that whole image. It's kinda funny because you sometimes see Nigerians and other Africans dressed up all Compton ghetto thug in efforts to cash in on the trend. Some of these girls are pretty hot, too. Some are just skanks. Everything else being equal though, whites will probably tend to do better but it doesn't matter because there's 20 to 1 whites to blacks. They have their niche carved out and so do the whites.

It goes without saying that if you're a really good-looking guy, you'll do a lot better than most, but that's pretty much anywhere.

Another thing that makes Japan seem easier for some guys is that being a nice guy is not necessarily a bad thing. In fact, it's a good thing, especially in social circles. Girls here don't shit on nice guys nearly as much as in the States. Unless you're over the top beta, you'll probably find something if you're working around lots of students or involved in clubs of some sort. Nice guys don't get laid much back home and then come here and find that girls are repulsed by it so much. Ergo, "easy" Japan. It's an interesting illusion but tiring to keep pointing out. Most of the time, I just nod and go uh-huh.

Next time a guy tells you how easy Japan is, ask him what he means by it. How many does he approach vs lays? Average how many dates to lays? Most guys I know don't get the goods until the 2nd or 3rd date. 1st date occasionally. SNL, somewhat rare. That's why it was always so confusing to me. This is pretty standard in N.A., so what makes this "easy"? And ask for pictures. Don't ask how good the girls are cuz he'll say she's an 8 then you find out she's a 5. I've seen it a million times.

Post: #18

I lived in Japan for a few years myself... Smoker's on point.

SNL's are much rarer even with solid game. You usually have to lead Japanese girls on over a few dates. I've got a buddy that is destroying it on the outskirts of tokyo right now though. Tall, white, cool artsy skinny hipster type.

Post: #19

man I have so many stories of friends AND wings fucking my shit up. I'll never go back to having a wing. going out solo is the way to go unless i'm celebrating something with my boys.