I haven't dropped any game posts in some time, so I thought I'd do a quick write-up of my personal procedure--that's been working wonders for me lately--for securing the bang on the first date. This may or may not be your schtick, but I thought I'd share it with the community.
As usual, I invite you to chop it up with me. I'd like to refine this further, if possible.
Tuthmosis's Homemade First-Date Bangs
Prep Time: 60 mins Cooking Time: 3-4 hours Serves 2.
Ingredients
1 free night
1 cute girl
2-4 alcoholic drinks
1 decent/smooth venue (preferably a lounge-style bar)
1 cool bachelor pad
Liberal amounts of logistical planning
Directions
Step 0. Get your logistics (pre-date planning) in order.
Any of you who know my game know that I'm always preaching the "logistics sermon." My credo is that an ounce of logistics is worth a pound of pussy. Even if your game is dog-shit, solid logistics will still get you laid here and there. Logistics is among the most under-developed parts game, in my opinion.
Once you have your system (whatever that is) down, it doesn't require a lot of effort to repeat over and over. In my case, this revolves around--apart from making sure my game-knife as sharp as possible that night--having my pad on complete lock-down:
-Apartment tidied up
-Light dimmers set on optimum setting
-Cool, smooth playlist queued up
-Condom stashes stocked up
-Dishes washed
-Plenty of ice ready for drink making
-Mixers and alcohols stocked
This, of course, pre-supposes an optimal living situation. I live by myself and have a reasonably lounging set-up (with cool, interesting decor); I think this is the ideal situation. If you live with other people, a good atmosphere is still possible, but you need to add the additional step of Roommate Lock-Down, where your housemates know what to do (and more importantly, what not to do) when you come around at night with some talent.
Another piece of logistics involves knowing your surroundings and routes home. You need to have at least one or two go-to places--ideally within walking distance, but otherwise easily accessible--near your pad. This place should, at minimum, have good lighting, good music, comfortable seating (if possible), and serve drinks (and preferably serve no food beyond light "tapas"). Even better, you should know the optimal nights at each place, so that can pick your spot according to the day of the week. If you're a real G, you have each venue's calendar page bookmarked in a folder in your Internet browser. When it's time to make a selection, you hit "load all pages" for that folder and pick accordingly.
This may sound like a lot, but the more of these things your spot has, the higher your chances of doing damage are going to be.
Step 1. Angle your date for optimal logistics.
I'm assuming you've met your girl during the day, online, or quickly at night, where you still haven't actually had significant time alone with her yet. This means, 9.5 times out of 10, that you're going to be coordinating a "first date" via text. I always try to get a girl to a place near my apartment, or within striking distance and along one of my routes to it (a stop on the subway or a reasonable walk).
I often get the psychology set up ahead of time too, adding something like this to my text, "let's start [emphasis added for the purposes of this post] at XYZ Lounge. We can always bounce somewhere else if its lame."
Of course, it goes without saying that you should have observed all of the Game 101 requirements: setting the date up at a time after standard dinner time, keeping your texts functional and minimalist, and waiting to set up the final details until the day of the date (so you have an excuse to ping the girl via text, and thereby minimize flaking).
None of you need to be reminded of this.
Step 2. Get a round of drinks at your first venue.
Don't fuck around with making her buy her own drink or some other principled bullshit. At the same time, don't fall into being her free-refills fountain for the night.
If you've picked a good, loungey bar and gotten there around, say, 9/9:30, during the week (when you should be a doing a "first date" anyway), there'll be ample seating. Grab your seat--with optimal location for your purposes--talk for a couple of minutes, and then say something like the line I've been using since my first day of "formally" practicing game: "what are you drinking? First round's on me."
I don't need to tell you what that implies about the second round.
Step 3. Build some old-school comfort, using generous amounts of "neo-kino"
Sorry to drop some ugly PUA-style jargon here, but this it's important for differentiation purposes. This is the stage where you're going to work your regular player magic, with a slight twist. You're telling stories, jokes, and whatever else is in your particular quill. For me, it's elaborate stories that stack on one another and meander all over the place. That's my neurotic style; it's probably not yours.
Meanwhile, you're doing what I'm going to have to call "neo-kino." Why neo? Because you're omitting all of the stupid palm readings, forced hugs, or other gimmicky, high-energy crap from the early 2000s. It's really the same thing, just considerably more subtle. Everything, needless to say, is smooth and unawkward. Some of what I do:
-Gradually invade her personal space as if she's succeeding in getting you interested. If you do it right, she will reciprocate.
-I touch her legs and arms with the back of the hand for emphasis on certain points
-I high-five her upon cool discoveries about her (in a calm, un-douchey, not-over-enthusiastic way); if she likes a band I like, for instance, I give her a high five
-A couple of times--emphasis on a couple of times--I hold eye contact for a little bit while talking, like I'm telepathically telling the bitch that, "I'm going to make out with [her] soon"
This shit is so nuanced that it's nearly impossible to describe in-person, never mind in an Internet post. Everyone is different, so your style of touching may be also, but just make sure to do a good amount of it.
Meanwhile, during the conversation portion, I've talked up--among other things--the bar in my apartment or some "new drink" that "I've learned to make." I'm not pushing it, I just drop the seed and move on. This doesn't have to be a drink, but it's what I use. Just insert your pad into the conversation somehow, so you can have a fake "aha! moment" about it later.
Step 4. Absolutely do not kiss her. Do not, I repeat, go for the make-out at the venue.
This is the counter-intuitive part. There will be a logical time where it seems like you should, and could, go for the escalating make-out. Ideally, this will be around the time you've finished off a slow-paced first round of drinks. If you've played your logistics correctly, you will have settled your tab (by not opening one in the first place) on the first round, so you're free to leave the venue at any point.
But don't kiss her. You should imply (physically) that you might be starting to want to, but "haven't decided yet." This means giving the subtle physical cues--like the ever-so-slightly lingering eye contact above--not some sort of overt act. She'll likely be giving you some of her own cues that she's down, but don't do it. Of course, don't avoid it pussy-like, like you're scared to do it, but like you're steadily being won you over. Keep in mind that you're being gregarious and touchy the whole time, not awkward and uncomfortable. This is very subtle physical communication, but being in that state-of-mind will help to convey this emotion.
At around the 60 to 90-minute mark, I say something like, "hey, let's do round two somewhere else." You may get some, "I have to work (or class) the next day" resistance, that's why it's important to do it on the early side, since this early in evening, it's still too early to raise this concern. She can't argue with you.
This--if I haven't already done so--is where I suggest that we go to my place, so I can "make her that drink" or whatever bachelor-pad bait I've used that night. What's more, "I live pretty close from here anyway." She knows that I'm going to try something, because I've done everything in my power to subtly suggest it, but she can reasonably expect that that's going to be merely making out. A little private make-out session probably sounds good (and safe) to her, so she's more-than-likely going to be down.
This is where not spending your make-out token plays a big part. She has iron-clad plausible deniability that all you're looking for is a private place to make out with her, that's all. Because nothing's happened so far, she feels a lot less committed about going over to your place than if you'd already made out and the next thing on the escalation hierarchy has to be sexual.
Because you've been charming and cool, you don't seem like a chump who can't put it down either. She wants to make out with you and recognizes this is her chance.
Step 5. Keep up the energy from the first venue on the move to your place.
This is important, and where I believe most guys go wrong on the move to their place. Having had only one drink, this girl is not intoxicated and she's going to the apartment of a dude she's known for an aggregate of maybe two hours, if that. Her hamster is going to be working on overdrive and you need to strangle that little bastard before he fucks you up.
One of my few talents--that I probably milk to death in my game--is making people feel at ease. I don't know why this is, but I'm often called "disarming." I'm very good about telling stories and eliciting related stories from girls and keeping them distracted. Because your place (if you've done your logistical homework correctly) is only like 10-15 minutes away, you only need to keep up this act for a short period.
If you can't talk about interesting stuff for a continuous 15 minutes, go directly to the newbie forum this instant, and stay there until you can.
I'm shocked at how consistently girls will comment on the "danger" of going home "with a stranger." It's like they're reading from a script. I had, literally, three girls over the course of the past 10 days say the same, identical shit. Of course, girls love "dangerous situations" so play on that. Why do hot girls love horror movies and hanging around with social deviants? It some psychological hard-wiring.
I always say, "what's the worst that can happen?" with an ironic tone in my voice. Gets them laughing every time. Sometimes, depending on the personality of the girl, I lay it on thick about chopping them up into little bits and adding them to my white-girl collection.
Step 6. Get her comfortable and situated in your spot.
I have the same exact routine when I come into my place with a girl. It's so similar that I sometimes feel a little dirty and guilty about it. Mostly, though, I feel like I'm going to work.
We come in; I tell them it's a "shoeless house"; I wait for them to take off their boots (and wait for them to comment about how their socks don't match, which they always do); I apologize for the "mess" because I "didn't expect to have guests" (bullshit, of course); and I give them "the tour"--which is also pre-scripted. I tell them to sit down on my couch (which is also my bed) and "get comfortable." I start the same exact playlist iTunes on my big multimedia setup and go to work on the same one or two drinks I know how to make.
If she has to piss, I let her do that. Same. Thing. Every Time.
Having a polished system like this helps.
Step 7. Give her the drink, sit down, and go back to work.
Now you're in the home stretch, player. You're comfortable and isolated. It gets easy from here. I usually sip the drink with her and chat for another 10-12 minutes; just long enough for her to barely start to wonder if I'm actually not going to make a move. "Is this guy actually atttracted to me? Is he a pussy? He seems into me, though. What the fuck?" Then, if she hasn't set her drink down herself already, I take her drink, set it on the coffee table, and start the make out.
It's amazing how enthusiastic a little waiting will have made her to receive your manly advances. They devour me half the time. The last one squealed in glee a little.
Step 8. Escalate like a champ.
This is where your old friend plausible deniability goes to bat for you. She only "expected" a private little make-out session--since you smartly left that token in your pocket--but if your make-out game is tight, you're a master at smoothly rounding those bases. Escalate expertly, like the goddamn RVF champ that you are. Because my couch doubles as a bed, I lay them out and go to town. I deflect LMR by periodically coming back up for "a sip of our drinks," before going back to work and advancing the ball upfield each time.
Step 9. Bang.
My conversion rates are considerably higher with this framework than going old-school: doing the make out at the venue and trying to get her back to my place after that. Invariably, you end up having to go for the bang on the second date (if she doesn't flake in between), because she sees the make-out as "giving you enough" to string your hongry-ass along for longer. But with this recipe, not getting the bang is more the exception than the rule. Of course I've had a few of prospects stop short. But I get farther along nonetheless. And, in one of those situations I was, quite literally, cockblocked by a tampon.
Needless to say, your rock-solid logistical planning is going to yield dividends at the bang stage. The good music, nice lighting, and prompt condom access lubricates your dick right into to the love canal.
I don't need to remind you to make sure you put it down respectably, at least. Even if you're not a sex god, make it memorable.
Step 10. Damage Control.
If you're like me, you prefer to bang prospects a few times (rather than once). Call me a romantic. If that's also your goal, you want to be prepared to do a little bit of damage control on the rapid bang. (Keep in mind that you will have banged this girl with three or four hours.) That doesn't mean you have to assuage every weird little emotion she may be going through, it just means you have to go back to being your cool, charming self for a while. It should be seamless.
This is probably cheesy (and unnecessary), but I sometimes throw this in at the end: "Whoa. I didn't expect that to happen."
--
Endnote:
The interesting part about this whole thing is that I (indirectly) learned this move from a chick. Who says you can't learn game from a woman? Just don't listen to to women, watch them. You can learn some shit.
The chick was this cute, but super-shy, college girl who was giving me mad signals. After dropping some solid game at a local lounge (on a "first date"), which brought her out of her shell, I went for the make out. This is how it went down:
Shy Girl [backing away from me]: Here?! Tuthmosis: Yeah. [incredulously and continuing to advance] Shy Girl: I don't really like P.D.A. [public display of affection, in case you don't know] Tuthmosis: Well, I live less than 10 minutes from here. Let's go. [I actually lived 15 minutes from that place] Grabbed her by the wrist and bounced.
The light bulb went off after that: some girls prefer to "make out" in private. Live and learn.
(12-22-2011 03:02 PM)Tuthmosis Wrote: This is where not spending your make-out token plays a big part. She has iron-clad plausible deniability that all you're looking for is a private place to make out with her, that's all. Because nothing's happened so far, she feels a lot less committed about going over to your place than if you'd already made out and the next thing on the escalation hierarchy has to be sexual.
Genius.
12-22-2011 03:26 PM
The following 1 user Likes speakeasy's post:1 user Likes speakeasy's post PapayaTapper
(12-22-2011 03:02 PM)Tuthmosis Wrote: I haven't dropped any game posts in some time, so I thought I'd do a quick write-up of my personal procedure--that's been working wonders for me lately--for securing the bang on the first date. This may or may not be your schtick, but I thought I'd share it with the community.
As usual, I invite you to chop it up with me. I'd like to refine this further, if possible.
Tuthmosis's Homemade First-Date Bangs
Prep Time: 60 mins Cooking Time: 3-4 hours Serves 2.
Ingredients
1 free night
1 cute girl
2-4 alcoholic drinks
1 decent/smooth venue (preferably a lounge-style bar)
1 cool bachelor pad
Liberal amounts of logistical planning
Directions
Step 0. Get your logistics (pre-date planning) in order.
Any of you who know my game know that I'm always preaching the "logistics sermon." My credo is that an ounce of logistics is worth a pound of pussy. Even if your game is dog-shit, solid logistics will still get you laid here and there. Logistics is among the most under-developed parts game, in my opinion.
Once you have your system (whatever that is) down, it doesn't require a lot of effort to repeat over and over. In my case, this revolves around--apart from making sure my game-knife as sharp as possible that night--having my pad on complete lock-down:
-Apartment tidied up
-Light dimmers set on optimum setting
-Cool, smooth playlist queued up
-Condom stashes stocked up
-Dishes washed
-Plenty of ice ready for drink making
-Mixers and alcohols stocked
This, of course, pre-supposes an optimal living situation. I live by myself and have a reasonably lounging set-up (with cool, interesting decor); I think this is the ideal situation. If you live with other people, a good atmosphere is still possible, but you need to add the additional step of Roommate Lock-Down, where your housemates know what to do (and more importantly, what not to do) when you come around at night with some talent.
Another piece of logistics involves knowing your surroundings and routes home. You need to have at least one or two go-to places--ideally within walking distance, but otherwise easily accessible--near your pad. This place should, at minimum, have good lighting, good music, comfortable seating (if possible), and serve drinks (and preferably serve no food beyond light "tapas"). Even better, you should know the optimal nights at each place, so that can pick your spot according to the day of the week. If you're a real G, you have each venue's calendar page bookmarked in a folder in your Internet browser. When it's time to make a selection, you hit "load all pages" for that folder and pick accordingly.
This may sound like a lot, but the more of these things your spot has, the higher your chances of doing damage are going to be.
Step 1. Angle your date for optimal logistics.
I'm assuming you've met your girl during the day, online, or quickly at night, where you still haven't actually had significant time alone with her yet. This means, 9.5 times out of 10, that you're going to be coordinating a "first date" via text. I always try to get a girl to a place near my apartment, or within striking distance and along one of my routes to it (a stop on the subway or a reasonable walk).
I often get the psychology set up ahead of time too, adding something like this to my text, "let's start [emphasis added for the purposes of this post] at XYZ Lounge. We can always bounce somewhere else if its lame."
Of course, it goes without saying that you should have observed all of the Game 101 requirements: setting the date up at a time after standard dinner time, keeping your texts functional and minimalist, and waiting to set up the final details until the day of the date (so you have an excuse to ping the girl via text, and thereby minimize flaking).
None of you need to be reminded of this.
Step 2. Get a round of drinks at your first venue.
Don't fuck around with making her buy her own drink or some other principled bullshit. At the same time, don't fall into being her free-refills fountain for the night.
If you've picked a good, loungey bar and gotten there around, say, 9/9:30, during the week (when you should be a doing a "first date" anyway), there'll be ample seating. Grab your seat--with optimal location for your purposes--talk for a couple of minutes, and then say something like the line I've been using since my first day of "formally" practicing game: "what are you drinking? First round's on me."
I don't need to tell you what that implies about the second round.
Step 3. Build some old-school comfort, using generous amounts of "neo-kino"
Sorry to drop some ugly PUA-style jargon here, but this it's important for differentiation purposes. This is the stage where you're going to work your regular player magic, with a slight twist. You're telling stories, jokes, and whatever else is in your particular quill. For me, it's elaborate stories that stack on one another and meander all over the place. That's my neurotic style; it's probably not yours.
Meanwhile, you're doing what I'm going to have to call "neo-kino." Why neo? Because you're omitting all of the stupid palm readings, forced hugs, or other gimmicky, high-energy crap from the early 2000s. It's really the same thing, just considerably more subtle. Everything, needless to say, is smooth and unawkward. Some of what I do:
-Gradually invade her personal space as if she's succeeding in getting you interested. If you do it right, she will reciprocate.
-I touch her legs and arms with the back of the hand for emphasis on certain points
-I high-five her upon cool discoveries about her (in a calm, un-douchey, not-over-enthusiastic way); if she likes a band I like, for instance, I give her a high five
-A couple of times--emphasis on a couple of times--I hold eye contact for a little bit while talking, like I'm telepathically telling the bitch that, "I'm going to make out with [her] soon"
This shit is so nuanced that it's nearly impossible to describe in-person, never mind in an Internet post. Everyone is different, so your style of touching may be also, but just make sure to do a good amount of it.
Meanwhile, during the conversation portion, I've talked up--among other things--the bar in my apartment or some "new drink" that "I've learned to make." I'm not pushing it, I just drop the seed and move on. This doesn't have to be a drink, but it's what I use. Just insert your pad into the conversation somehow, so you can have a fake "aha! moment" about it later.
Step 4. Absolutely do not kiss her. Do not, I repeat, go for the make-out at the venue.
This is the counter-intuitive part. There will be a logical time where it seems like you should, and could, go for the escalating make-out. Ideally, this will be around the time you've finished off a slow-paced first round of drinks. If you've played your logistics correctly, you will have settled your tab (by not opening one in the first place) on the first round, so you're free to leave the venue at any point.
But don't kiss her. You should imply (physically) that you might be starting to want to, but "haven't decided yet." This means giving the subtle physical cues--like the ever-so-slightly lingering eye contact above--not some sort of overt act. She'll likely be giving you some of her own cues that she's down, but don't do it. Of course, don't avoid it pussy-like, like you're scared to do it, but like you're steadily being won you over. Keep in mind that you're being gregarious and touchy the whole time, not awkward and uncomfortable. This is very subtle physical communication, but being in that state-of-mind will help to convey this emotion.
At around the 60 to 90-minute mark, I say something like, "hey, let's do round two somewhere else." You may get some, "I have to work (or class) the next day" resistance, that's why it's important to do it on the early side, since this early in evening, it's still too early to raise this concern. She can't argue with you.
This--if I haven't already done so--is where I suggest that we go to my place, so I can "make her that drink" or whatever bachelor-pad bait I've used that night. What's more, "I live pretty close from here anyway." She knows that I'm going to try something, because I've done everything in my power to subtly suggest it, but she can reasonably expect that that's going to be merely making out. A little private make-out session probably sounds good (and safe) to her, so she's more-than-likely going to be down.
This is where not spending your make-out token plays a big part. She has iron-clad plausible deniability that all you're looking for is a private place to make out with her, that's all. Because nothing's happened so far, she feels a lot less committed about going over to your place than if you'd already made out and the next thing on the escalation hierarchy has to be sexual.
Because you've been charming and cool, you don't seem like a chump who can't put it down either. She wants to make out with you and recognizes this is her chance.
Step 5. Keep up the energy from the first venue on the move to your place.
This is important, and where I believe most guys go wrong on the move to their place. Having had only one drink, this girl is not intoxicated and she's going to the apartment of a dude she's known for an aggregate of maybe two hours, if that. Her hamster is going to be working on overdrive and you need to strangle that little bastard before he fucks you up.
One of my few talents--that I probably milk to death in my game--is making people feel at ease. I don't know why this is, but I'm often called "disarming." I'm very good about telling stories and eliciting related stories from girls and keeping them distracted. Because your place (if you've done your logistical homework correctly) is only like 10-15 minutes away, you only need to keep up this act for a short period.
If you can't talk about interesting stuff for a continuous 15 minutes, go directly to the newbie forum this instant, and stay there until you can.
I'm shocked at how consistently girls will comment on the "danger" of going home "with a stranger." It's like they're reading from a script. I had, literally, three girls over the course of the past 10 days say the same, identical shit. Of course, girls love "dangerous situations" so play on that. Why do hot girls love horror movies and hanging around with social deviants? It some psychological hard-wiring.
I always say, "what's the worst that can happen?" with an ironic tone in my voice. Gets them laughing every time. Sometimes, depending on the personality of the girl, I lay it on thick about chopping them up into little bits and adding them to my white-girl collection.
Step 6. Get her comfortable and situated in your spot.
I have the same exact routine when I come into my place with a girl. It's so similar that I sometimes feel a little dirty and guilty about it. Mostly, though, I feel like I'm going to work.
We come in; I tell them it's a "shoeless house"; I wait for them to take off their boots (and wait for them to comment about how their socks don't match, which they always do); I apologize for the "mess" because I "didn't expect to have guests" (bullshit, of course); and I give them "the tour"--which is also pre-scripted. I tell them to sit down on my couch (which is also my bed) and "get comfortable." I start the same exact playlist iTunes on my big multimedia setup and go to work on the same one or two drinks I know how to make.
If she has to piss, I let her do that. Same. Thing. Every Time.
Having a polished system like this helps.
Step 7. Give her the drink, sit down, and go back to work.
Now you're in the home stretch, player. You're comfortable and isolated. It gets easy from here. I usually sip the drink with her and chat for another 10-12 minutes; just long enough for her to barely start to wonder if I'm actually not going to make a move. "Is this guy actually atttracted to me? Is he a pussy? He seems into me, though. What the fuck?" Then, if she hasn't set her drink down herself already, I take her drink, set it on the coffee table, and start the make out.
It's amazing how enthusiastic a little waiting will have made her to receive your manly advances. They devour me half the time. The last one squealed in glee a little.
Step 8. Escalate like a champ.
This is where your old friend plausible deniability goes to bat for you. She only "expected" a private little make-out session--since you smartly left that token in your pocket--but if your make-out game is tight, you're a master at smoothly rounding those bases. Escalate expertly, like the goddamn RVF champ that you are. Because my couch doubles as a bed, I lay them out and go to town. I deflect LMR by periodically coming back up for "a sip of our drinks," before going back to work and advancing the ball upfield each time.
Step 9. Bang.
My conversion rates are considerably higher with this framework than going old-school: doing the make out at the venue and trying to get her back to my place after that. Invariably, you end up having to go for the bang on the second date (if she doesn't flake in between), because she sees the make-out as "giving you enough" to string your hongry-ass along for longer. But with this recipe, not getting the bang is more the exception than the rule. Of course I've had a few of prospects stop short. But I get farther along nonetheless. And, in one of those situations I was, quite literally, cockblocked by a tampon.
Needless to say, your rock-solid logistical planning is going to yield dividends at the bang stage. The good music, nice lighting, and prompt condom access lubricates your dick right into to the love canal.
I don't need to remind you to make sure you put it down respectably, at least. Even if you're not a sex god, make it memorable.
Step 10. Damage Control.
If you're like me, you prefer to bang prospects a few times (rather than once). Call me a romantic. If that's also your goal, you want to be prepared to do a little bit of damage control on the rapid bang. (Keep in mind that you will have banged this girl with three or four hours.) That doesn't mean you have to assuage every weird little emotion she may be going through, it just means you have to go back to being your cool, charming self for a while. It should be seamless.
This is probably cheesy (and unnecessary), but I sometimes throw this in at the end: "Whoa. I didn't expect that to happen."
--
Endnote:
The interesting part about this whole thing is that I (indirectly) learned this move from a chick. Who says you can't learn game from a woman? Just don't listen to to women, watch them. You can learn some shit.
The chick was this cute, but super-shy, college girl who was giving me mad signals. After dropping some solid game at a local lounge (on a "first date"), which brought her out of her shell, I went for the make out. This is how it went down:
Shy Girl [backing away from me]: Here?! Tuthmosis: Yeah. [incredulously and continuing to advance] Shy Girl: I don't really like P.D.A. [public display of affection, in case you don't know] Tuthmosis: Well, I live less than 10 minutes from here. Let's go. [I actually lived 15 minutes from that place] Grabbed her by the wrist and bounced.
The light bulb went off after that: some girls prefer to "make out" in private. Live and learn.
Step 7 is on point. One of my recent girls was wondering the same thing, except after we banged she straight up asked me these very questions.
Great post, very interesting! Although my concern would be that after only one drink, the girl would baulk at the invitation back to the apartment. That said, I´ve never tried it like this. I love the way it skips a chunk of investment in time / drinks trying to get them oiled enough to get back to the house. If all goes to plan you could have everything wrapped up by 11.30pm!
I´ll have to give this one a go. I like the mixed drink excuse too....maybe you could even suggest just dropping by the house to quickly make the drink on the way to the next bar as an extra bit of plausabile deniability?
Have you had many chicks baulk at such an early move to the apartment?
takeda
12-22-2011 06:35 PM
Tuthmosis
Innovative Casanova
Posts: 9,583
Joined: Jan 2011
Reputation: 217
(12-22-2011 06:35 PM)takeda Wrote: Great post, very interesting! Although my concern would be that after only one drink, the girl would baulk at the invitation back to the apartment. That said, I´ve never tried it like this. I love the way it skips a chunk of investment in time / drinks trying to get them oiled enough to get back to the house. If all goes to plan you could have everything wrapped up by 11.30pm!
That's where not kissing them at the first venue comes in. They pretty much know you're going to try something back at the apartment, but because you haven't made out, she's going to fill in the gaps and assume you're just looking for an excuse/place to do that. It's just too easy: you live close, you seem cool, you haven't made out yet.
She has the make-out buffer still, and that seems to add a tremendous of comfort.
(12-22-2011 06:35 PM)takeda Wrote: I´ll have to give this one a go. I like the mixed drink excuse too....maybe you could even suggest just dropping by the house to quickly make the drink on the way to the next bar as an extra bit of plausabile deniability?
That could work too, but it might be unnecessarily complicated, since you now need three venues to be in the same vicinity. The other thing I say is that we can stop by the place, have a drink, "hang for a couple minutes," and then "call it a night" since "I still have work to do" (or whatever). This is a classic time-constraint thing, but it works nicely in this context.
(12-22-2011 06:35 PM)takeda Wrote: Have you had many chicks baulk at such an early move to the apartment?
A lot fewer than the ones I try to liquor-up on the outside (at much greater expense) and then try to bring back.
But, the percentage of girls who "balk" at coming back to the apartment after the make-out is very high, though. They know you want to go fuck now. A very DTF girl will still come with you, but why unnecessarily eliminate the regular girls who will likely become DTF in the comfort of your pad?
My only question would be how much lmr you get once you're at your place and are already making out. So to summarize, the pros of making out beforehand, like you said, are that if you've already made out with her and she agrees to go back to your place, you definitely know she's dtf. But saving the make out for your place allows you to convert borderline-dtf girls into dtf girls if you escalate quickly/well enough, so you don't need to screen them for horniness ahead of time since you create it?
In any case, well played.
(This post was last modified: 12-22-2011 09:20 PM by YoungGunner.)
You Bastard, you need to be banned for giving out all the secrets.
Me and a buddy run something similar. He conducted a little experiment where he tried to kiss girls in public when they were both sober. None of them came back to his place.
But now the girls think that they are going to hangout, or only "make out" at his place and they are all for going. Then all of a sudden he makes out and undresses them. They are so unprepared.
Good write up, +1.
"and waiting to set up the final details until the day of the date (so you have an excuse to ping the girl via text, and thereby minimize flaking)."
Very important point, you and Sam have both pointed out and it does an incredible job of weeding out the flakes.
12-22-2011 09:37 PM
Gmac
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I like this strategy of keeping the "make-out buffer" intact so she feels more comfortable coming home with you. My question is, would you ever go direct with this strategy? Instead of making up some excuse about stopping off at your place, might you say something like "man I want to kiss you but I hate PDA. We need some privacy. I live just down the street. Come on let's go." I mean, if she knows what's up, why not be direct about it. Does that last minute faux-ambivalence on your part really add that much?
12-22-2011 10:27 PM
Deluge
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(12-22-2011 03:02 PM)Tuthmosis Wrote: This is where not spending your make-out token plays a big part. She has iron-clad plausible deniability that all you're looking for is a private place to make out with her, that's all. Because nothing's happened so far, she feels a lot less committed about going over to your place than if you'd already made out and the next thing on the escalation hierarchy has to be sexual.
Genius.
This.
"He beeg genius. He design your mind"
- From Blade Runner (doomed scientist - cold lab scene)
12-23-2011 03:05 AM
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Amour Fou
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Contributions like these and some of the posts Roosh has at his blog shows how far off we are from mere "game". This is science, work of architects... it is past seduction, it is a body of knowledge that takes shape as new human science.
One day people will learn these things at universities.
Awesome post. Third request for playlist! Right now I'm living pretty far from the bar scene, at least 30 minutes... I think I can't pull off the whole come to my place before making out cause its so far away...
tuth, do you think you could pull these same sorts of moves and go back to a girls place? i realize the logistics would have to work, but say the girl lives closer to the venue than you do. would you suggest going back to her place?
A couple of additional comments once you have isolated and have done some kino escalation.
The first kiss is CRITICAL. From you, it has to be gentle. (If she goes immediately into throat devour mode, or heavy panting...great...but don't necessarily expect it of a first date bang).
Go sensual, erotic, slight open mouth, but no tongue at first. Slight touch, not to heavy, not to long. Stroke her face along the jaw line gently after you do the first kiss -- look at her eyes. Bring her back for the second kiss...make it a bit longer, a bit wetter...move one hand to her arm, one hand to her back--don't pull her close to you yet, but position yourself so you could, if she decides to go for the clench, bring her tight to you. If she is not quite ready for the tight embrace, you still have communicated to her in your body language that you have strength and power.
Now start escalating the make out, just like you would escalate kino. Longer deeper kisses. If she has bare arms or shoulders, caress them. After the first few big kisses, go for the neck, the shoulder -- flutter your tongue from time to time on the neck shoulder area. Try to sense her head movements. If she scrunches her shoulders, she's tense...back off a bit and go for the mouth. If her shoulders relax, she is moving into never never land. Move her hair away from here ear...kiss the ear.
At this point, it's all about the rhythm. Sometimes I will say something like, "I've wanted to do this the first time I saw you." The "this" is ambiguous -- make out...or fuck? Sometimes I will turn her around, so her back is against my chest, so I can work the neck and shoulders from behind...and she can feel me hard. If she reaches her hand around to the back of your head..she's DTF. Spin her around again, kiss, and then go for the chest above the cleavage.
Bottom line, the lizards love the clothed eroticism. Spend time on that. Caress, caress, caress.
Of course, if they go nuts with the first kiss...well, proceed to Stage D.
Then, as Tuth says, "put it down respectably." Eat her...then let her eat you. Fuck her hard, fuck her slow, fuck her in multiple positions. Stop fucking her, and then finger her, then mount her again. Slow, fast, hard -- and when hard, be animalistic, convey strength, power, hold her neck....
With every babe I bang, I want her to think, "Wow, this guy is INTO it!" I know, and have been told, that I am the best lover they have ever had. Convey that confidence.
Bottom line, women want to be ravished...and feel safe when they do, even as they fantasize that they have completely succumbed and are helpless. Give that fantasy to them. It is your gift to them.
(This post was last modified: 12-23-2011 11:22 AM by tenderman100.)
Good stuff, but I'm surprised that most of this isn't common knowledge! What I found interesting is the not-kiss part. I've done this on a few dates and I must say it's easier to get them to your place if you haven't kissed them yet. Especially on girls under 21, but I've kissed a girl who was 25 and she wouldn't let me back inside of her place. I wonder if this is culture-specific.
Logistics wise; I use my car to get girls back home. I've got the best parking spots around town figured out, and I get them back here without much issue. I usually just drive them back here without saying anything. You don't need to be walking distance from bars but it helps.
I say less than 1/3 of my dates involve alcohol and I still close. Alcohol is overrated if you can think of a good activity to do otherwise. Rock climbing is still the #1 non-alcoholic way to get girls comfortable with me. A lot more fun than sitting at a bar as well.
Quote:We come in; I tell them it's a "shoeless house"; I wait for them to take off their boots
This is really good advice, as girls feel much more intimate once their shoes are off. True story. I wish I thought of this sooner. Classic line.
Contributor at Return of Kings. I got banned from twatter, which is run by little bitches and weaklings. You can follow me on Gab.
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(12-23-2011 12:29 PM)Samseau Wrote: I say less than 1/3 of my dates involve alcohol and I still close. Alcohol is overrated if you can think of a good activity to do otherwise. Rock climbing is still the #1 non-alcoholic way to get girls comfortable with me. A lot more fun than sitting at a bar as well.
Samseau, could you do a seperate post on non-alcoholic activities? I live in a city with a large muslim minority and this could be fun!!
PS. OUTSTANDING post, Tuthmosis! I'm going to follow your plan with my next prospects and post results. I've been following that routine more or less, but this is much more structured and the kissing part was great - I was wondering why I was having a hard time banging. I thought it was important to warm them up in the first venue... I guess it's all situational.
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