Post: #1

In Day Game, I think Roosh has astutely isolated another facet of game, all the more impressive because it is not an event which one would notice easily, but a non-event which is nevertheless important.

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Just got very politely blown out a couple nights ago on a coffee-walkaround date; to be fair the chick was fairly out of my league, an 8 who was thirty years younger than me, I'm overweight too.

She was very polite, socially skilled, a good conversationalist, extremely intelligent, and smiled a lot. I don't really know if I effectively dropped bait, we were discussing a wide variety of non-chick-crack stuff, movies-psychology-cultural differences; which was nice for a change-- very bright girl.

I was so taken with her, and she was so skilled at carefully answering my questions, and at maintaining a sweet but fake defensive smile, that I didn't even notice over the course of two(?) enchanting hours I don't think she asked a SINGLE significant question about me.

I had done some minor escalation early, but later when I escalated more she clearly tensed up and didn't like it.

In contrast, when I went to the health club later ( trying to lose the lard!) the less intelligent but very sweet my-age-minus-30 receptionist asked two questions about me while I chatted her up.

A socially skilled and polite girl who likes you but is not turned on by you can keep going on for hours acknowledging you and responding to your questions, but inside she's not really that into you or wondering about you, or she'd ask something.

I think Roosh has found a great, subtle negative indicator to work with.

I've read that women talk THREE TIMES as much as men do, a lot of the time unless we're very sharp we're talking to them and they are way ahead of us, they just are much better at reading between the lines and feeling out what's happening, and also fooling you as to what's happening.

Post: #2

For you to last 2 hours without her asking a question, you must have been under her spell!

It does suck when it happens, because she is in fact still talking to you. But trying to close will lead to nothing. Girls genuinely want to know about men whose penises they want inside them.*

*Except Icelandic girls at 5am on weekends.

Post: #3

(01-28-2012 10:27 AM)Roosh Wrote:  For you to last 2 hours without her asking a question, you must have been under her spell!

It does suck when it happens, because she is in fact still talking to you. But trying to close will lead to nothing. Girls genuinely want to know about men whose penises they want inside them.*

*Except Icelandic girls at 5am on weekends.

The rare very smart woman ( maybe one out of 100 versus 1 out of 50 guys) shocks you by saying interesting, insightful things. She also can keep the conversation going when you're not doing that well, further making you think everything's cool when it's not.

A side note here: She was a PROGRAMMER-- C language, which is one of the more cryptic, abstract languages that takes guy-level smarts. But the IT chicks seem very non-physical; it's like every star in the galaxy has to be in alignment for them to fuck as it's not that appealing.

Post: #4

(01-28-2012 10:27 AM)Roosh Wrote:  For you to last 2 hours without her asking a question, you must have been under her spell!

It does suck when it happens, because she is in fact still talking to you. But trying to close will lead to nothing. Girls genuinely want to know about men whose penises they want inside them.*

*Except Icelandic girls at 5am on weekends.

So if you're doing a day game approach, at what point do you conclude that you're wasting your time and end the interaction if she hasn't asked a personal question yet? I'd be tempted to keep going as long as she's indulging me in conversation but you don't want to end up spending 2 hours chatting up a girl who doesn't want to get banged.

Is there a point at which you've been talking so long that you'd say "fuck it" and run GALNUC even though she hasn't asked the personal question?

Post: #5

(01-28-2012 10:55 AM)iknowexactly Wrote:  

(01-28-2012 10:27 AM)Roosh Wrote:  For you to last 2 hours without her asking a question, you must have been under her spell!

It does suck when it happens, because she is in fact still talking to you. But trying to close will lead to nothing. Girls genuinely want to know about men whose penises they want inside them.*

*Except Icelandic girls at 5am on weekends.

The rare very smart woman ( maybe one out of 100 versus 1 out of 50 guys) shocks you by saying interesting, insightful things. She also can keep the conversation going when you're not doing that well, further making you think everything's cool when it's not.

A side note here: She was a PROGRAMMER-- C language, which is one of the more cryptic, abstract languages that takes guy-level smarts. But the IT chicks seem very non-physical; it's like every star in the galaxy has to be in alignment for them to fuck as it's not that appealing.

It isn't that they're asexual, they just are smart enough that while talking to them you easily get sucked into a non-sexy conversation. Think about it, if they got turned on talking about operator precedence then they'd be fucking all the dorks they work with.

Post: #6

C is not rocket science (I should say cellular biology or something, because rocket science is not that complicated), and knowledge of C does not make her smart, nor does being a programmer make you smart. However, this is such an unusual profession for an attractive woman to be in, that we project all kinds of things on them. Was she really interesting and insightful, or were you so attracted to her that your mind convinced you that she was? Not saying it's not possible, but when our dicks interact with our brains, strange thoughts can occur.

Post: #7

Gringo: For newbies, 15 minutes is a good number. For me, I wait 5 minutes.

Post: #8

(01-28-2012 03:52 PM)Menace Wrote:  C is not rocket science (I should say cellular biology or something, because rocket science is not that complicated), and knowledge of C does not make her smart, nor does being a programmer make you smart. However, this is such an unusual profession for an attractive woman to be in, that we project all kinds of things on them. Was she really interesting and insightful, or were you so attracted to her that your mind convinced you that she was? Not saying it's not possible, but when our dicks interact with our brains, strange thoughts can occur.

This seems a little disingenuous... like "out of my class of
MA holders in computer science at <hard state university> , 90% knew C really well"
It almost sounds like the person is bragging that their milieu is somewhat elevated.

To me being a competent programmer who can creatively analyze and code does mean someone is smart RELATIVE TO THE GENERAL POPULATION , very likely above average intelligence in the area of abstract reasoning.

Another thing about programming is that a program that is 99.9% correct usually works terribly. That's a high standard.
A program either works or it doesn't, no quota system or flirty smile makes it pass, without some serious organization covering up.

Programmers might be pretty primitive socially (asperger's spectrum) but in biz they help the wealthy maintain their position above others, which is the primary function of modern capitalist society. ( See Foucalt's concept of techno-power)

As to whether she was really smart OVERALL, I've actually lured her into further conversation although I was really frustrated with her, she's been sending me some poetry-type prose which is really good, so I'd have to say I think she really has well above average subtlety as well as precision. I would actually be impressed even if she was a guy at this point. That combined with her being an 8 (for me, I'm a small-boob, petite model type fan) exponentially (or geometrically? I'm not that smart!) rockets her into being 1/1000 or more based on 8's are 1/50 females here, and real smart girls (strong logic plus strong aesthetic sense) 1/200.

Oh, and she impressed me with all this in her second language which she rarely has a chance to use, and had to bust out to deal with me.
Yup, she's really smart. Looking back, she did ask if I was a Trekkie, so maybe I've done better than I thought.

I mean, What's she supposed to do to prove she's exceptional, provide a side commentary gleaned from Catallus in the original Latin?

Anyway-- who cares, being infatuated is great as long as you know she's going to disappoint you eventually. And she's 30 years younger than me.

Post: #9

I disagree, women are not ahead of men, most women could never pick up of a man for shit if they had to jump through the same kind of bull shit test as men do.

This woman was simply polite, she was not interested in you sexually, but she may have saw you as a potential friend. I see nothing wrong or advanced in her skills with what she did, its called common decency to talk to someone and not ignore them, lucky for you she didn't tell you to fuck off.

Post: #10

Well if she wants to be friends, you can at least use her to meet her girl friends, and as social proof.

Post: #11

Quote:I had done some minor escalation early, but later when I escalated more she clearly tensed up and didn't like it.

Okay, this, plus the fact that you're 30 years older than her would have me asking myself "she's not sexually interested in me, do I want to keep her around as a friend or not?" That's it.

I went on a date once with a girl as smart as yours. Except, I was not attracted to her. I wanted to get out in 15 minutes. Except she was so damn interesting I couldn't believe it, so, I stuck around and listened to her. Why? Because it was fun listening to someone THAT intelligent. I was having fun. The End. She then contacted me after two weeks, I turned her down in a very subtle way, and she reacted like a child, which made me laugh out loud considering her intellect. See, still a little hurt girl inside.

Question: That kind of polite, intelligent, classy behavior can sometimes be a very subtle neg. Or, not so subtle neg. The subtext is, "I'm superior to you, but, since my behavior is spotless, you can't call me on anything"

How would a seasoned player deal with this?

Post: #12

FOLLOWUP:
First , Keyword spam: Ukraine cold Ukraine racism Ukraine freezing
I went out with the chick again, for the last time I swear, partially because she was so good at getting back to me. Every message or email got a thoughtful, fast reply. I hate Murkabeests' insistence on ignoring/slow reponding/claiming busy. I don't like being gamed with that kind of shit.

So I've been cruising along in EE, much better at getting numbers from much younger chix than in USA, it's like it's not even the same world. I'm not the enemy here. It's the brutal economy and life itself.

I felt I had a handle on how to escalate in Murka-- once they are convinced you're not a serial killer, defuse with some affection, kissing, proceed until they're saying filthy things while orgasming.
Simple and fun!!!

Here it's a little different, I'm welcoming input from experienced EE hands. (Ha ha. Hands. Experienced hands.. Get it? Oh never mind...)

Here my impression is although my chances are much better, they want to play it like they're being forced right from the beginning.

In Murka, we would start to play rape games AFTER we were sexually intimate.
"OK, say 'no' like you don't want it."

DATE : There is a restaurant here in a hotel that has a ROOM with comfy couch-like seating you can get for your party. It's GREAT for seducing-- the waiters even knock before coming in.

The 8 mentioned above talked a blue streak against sex without a Zhivagoan romance, and how she "doesn't want a relationship", but then I start rubbing her back and whispering to her and she just starts moaning, totally inconsistent with what she was just saying!!

I was really slow/overcautious with escalation, just gave her a kiss on the cheek while massaging her back.

She unloaded a bombshell on me, her divorce ( at 24) was only finalized A FEW DAYS AGO!! Before I thought she was divorced four years ago, now she said she was MARRIED four years and it just ended.

I do have some scruples about pushing a chick when she's been recently traumatized. I backed off, tried to get her to come over my house, but she didn't want to.

We kept in contact on "chat" (probably a mistake in retrospect) that night, and she said she was "really mad" I was kissing groping etc.

But she was fucking sighing and moaning while I did it!!

I've read about the rationalization hamster and ASD, but I still cannot believe the disconnect between what they say and what their bodies say.

Is it really just caveman like crazy here unless they scream? Wow, what a different world...

First , Keyword spam: Ukraine cold Ukraine racism Ukraine freezing
By the way, I NEVER want to come back to the Murkabeests again...

Post: #13

(01-29-2012 01:27 AM)bmn200 Wrote:  Well if she wants to be friends, you can at least use her to meet her girl friends, and as social proof.

This bitch is a cat lady in training and doesn't really have friends from what I can tell. Feminist thought is spreading here; poorly-thought-out ideas about being "objects" and "toys" are being used as a crutch-to-bitch by the less socially skilled chicks.

However, moderating that cancerous virus of feminazism is that the competition here for men by women is brutal.

Almost every woman on the street is perfectly groomed with expensive (snug fitting to show off slim legs) boots, exact, carefully done makeup, and tastefully sexual clothes emphasizing their figures. And they don't speak harshly to you or glare in anger when you express interest in them.

Post: #14

(01-28-2012 09:38 PM)misterstir Wrote:  I disagree, women are not ahead of men, most women could never pick up of a man for shit if they had to jump through the same kind of bull shit test as men do.

Please see study showing women are better at detecting subtle, but not strong, emotion in facial expression, This tends torefute you opinion:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20728864

I agree with woman can't pick up, but that's like saying I suck at applying eye makeup, I never have to do it so of course I would suck at it.

Quote:This woman was simply polite, she was not interested in you sexually, but she may have saw you as a potential friend.

substitute "orbiter" for friends and you've spot on--she's kind of too *ucked up right now post-divorce to have real friends.

Quote: I see nothing wrong or advanced in her skills with what she did, its called common decency to talk to someone and not ignore them, lucky for you she didn't tell you to fuck off.

I'm not just lucky, I've spent decades and tens of thousands of dollars educating myself and working at understanding and helping people such that they paid $100/hr and more just to talk to me. She's the one that was lucky to talk to someone far more educated and experienced than her.