Post: #26

Go paleo. That was the only thing that dug me out of the "skinny-fat" hole that I was in. Well, that, and ten minutes of kettlebell tabatas along two sets of every convict conditioning movement (four days a week).

Post: #27

Absolute worst build a man can have, after being a complete fat ass. It's like half fatboy/half stickboy.

Post: #28

(06-01-2012 05:43 AM)AlphaTravel Wrote:  I guess I'm skinny fat too. I'm pretty short, absurdly thin arms they are so boney, fairly thin legs but a fat belly and flabby upper body also a bit of a chubby face at the moment. Had the belly for as long as I can remember. Weighed myself yesterday and have put on a few pounds during my 4 months in Thailand due to daily beer consumption.

Starting next week I'm on a healthy eating plan, trying to lose as much weight as possible quickly and doing some well needed exercise.

Skinnyfat is no better than fat.

You don't sound like an Alpha Traveller like your name suggests ;)

Post: #29

(05-31-2012 01:20 PM)Menace Wrote:  Unfortunately, I fall into this category due to just being a lazy ass, relying on my metabolism not to gain weight, and living a sedentary life style for too long.

Although I have (re)-started weights (Starting Strength), I wonder, is it better (easier) to just bulk up to where I want then cut down and be lean, or to try and have lean gains?

Just keep keep doing the program.

Post: #30

Bulk. Get big then worry about your belly fat

Post: #31

amity Wrote:word of warning for anyone who's going paleo

i haven't done much in the way of weights since i started it

i'm underweight as it is (bodyfat %age of 7.5), gives me a slightly emaciated look

i've gotta rethink things a bit, definitely need to eat more (but will still try and stick largely to paleo and get on the protein shakes too) and get onto the weights regularly and see if there's an improvement

You have proven that paleo is effective (as I've always said on this forum).
Your issue is not diet related.

You don't need to warn anyone or rethink anything. You need to work out.

MikeCF Wrote:If you follow a clean diet and lift weights, your body will figure things out for itself.

Post: #32

What you eat is hugely important to your body composition.

Keep Eggs, boneless skinless chicken breasts, canned red salmon, and sirloin steaks, for example, stocked in your fridge, along with broccoli and spinach. Cook the eggs however you want, and learn to cook chicken breasts and steaks in a pan, it's fucking simple if you don't already do it.

At trader joe's you can get pre-washed organic spinach in a bag and eat it like potato chips, same thing with broccoli florets.

Try cutting out carbs for some of your meals. Right before and after a workout you can throw in a whey/milk protein shake, and perhaps add some beans to one of the above protein sources a few hours later. Otherwise, start limiting carb intake on non-workout days to only broccoli.

You want to eat 30-40 grams of protein every 2-3 hours, and within an hour after and before you go to sleep. Try eating MORE than a gram of protein per pound of body weight, and cut out all shit food like beer, anything with bread/wheat, ice cream, brownies etc.

Drinking caffeine before workouts is good, as it allows you to get more out of weightlifting, which is challenging enough for ectomorphs that burn out quickly. Drinking green tea may help for fat loss, and in particular a kind of tea called pu-erh.

Then just start lifting. one warm up set, combined with 3 sets of 8 reps is a good rule for most exercises. The more body areas you work in a single workout session, the more human growth hormone your body pumps out, meaning more muscle mass.

Having a day per week where you do HIIT, high intensity interval training, is good. This increases your resting metabolic rate. Hop on a treadmill and run as fast as you can at a high speed, like 10-12 mph, for as long as you can, then when you burn out, stop and walk, then repeat that like 8 times....you will be fucking wiped.

If you have a slouch posture, then get a yoga belt and tie it around your upper torso when you are at home on the computer, or just sitting alone. It's kind of homo, but it works and helps keep your shoulder blades back.

Check this video at the 20 second mark, the chick demonstrates how to put it on:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bxss2K4WY8A

Doing reverse dumbell flys in the gym is also good for correcting the bad "skinnyfat" posture.

Do ab exercises with a ball as well. This works way more of your abdominals.

If you follow the above general rules, and hit the gym 3 or 4 times a week, you will gain muscle, lose fat, have better posture, and look like a man instead of a woman.... if you are currently a skinnyfat ectomorph that is.

Post: #33

As of tomorrow I'm cutting our carbs, junk food and beer for a couple weeks at least, just eating eggs, meat, fruit, veg and nuts.

Post: #34

(06-01-2012 04:54 AM)Nudge Wrote:  I've got a layer of flab over my gut that I have had all my life and just cant seem to get rid of. Even when I used to be super super skinny with chicken arms I still had it. Lately been doing a brutal High intensity boxing classes (1 hour) once a week plus another high intensity tabata workout once or twice a week. I bike ride to work most days, then I try to go for a jog once a week and I also play tag rugby. My diet, although not perfect, isnt too bad either - dont eat too many carbs and usually have chicken breast or fish and salad for dinner. The only thing is I party quite a lot and love my beer.

Anyone got any ideas? Am I just gonna have to accept that if I want to get rid of it I have to 100% commited and cut out the beer? Not sure thats possible living in London

Accept it, I decided to spend 2 years on an extreme diet eating 1 meal a day and at 70 kilos I still had a belly, I am now 96 kilos and still have it only now I have some muscle. Extreme diet with cardio will just make your body hold onto fat reserves and catabolise muscle . I acutally lost more fat after stopping cardio and just sticking to lifting. The 7-8 percent body fat is not healthy unless you are one of those people who can eat shit and stay skinny. Although many try to deny it your genetics decide how many fat cells you have and ignoring extremes of people who over eat and eat shit, you will have the same number of fat cells your whole life, only the size of them will change. Accept it or get lipo.

Post: #35

I found this series of posts to be quite informative and realistic.

Skinnyfat Guide

Post: #36

(06-03-2012 01:11 PM)billy Wrote:  

(06-01-2012 04:54 AM)Nudge Wrote:  I've got a layer of flab over my gut that I have had all my life and just cant seem to get rid of. Even when I used to be super super skinny with chicken arms I still had it. Lately been doing a brutal High intensity boxing classes (1 hour) once a week plus another high intensity tabata workout once or twice a week. I bike ride to work most days, then I try to go for a jog once a week and I also play tag rugby. My diet, although not perfect, isnt too bad either - dont eat too many carbs and usually have chicken breast or fish and salad for dinner. The only thing is I party quite a lot and love my beer.

Anyone got any ideas? Am I just gonna have to accept that if I want to get rid of it I have to 100% commited and cut out the beer? Not sure thats possible living in London

Accept it, I decided to spend 2 years on an extreme diet eating 1 meal a day and at 70 kilos I still had a belly, I am now 96 kilos and still have it only now I have some muscle. Extreme diet with cardio will just make your body hold onto fat reserves and catabolise muscle . I acutally lost more fat after stopping cardio and just sticking to lifting. The 7-8 percent body fat is not healthy unless you are one of those people who can eat shit and stay skinny. Although many try to deny it your genetics decide how many fat cells you have and ignoring extremes of people who over eat and eat shit, you will have the same number of fat cells your whole life, only the size of them will change. Accept it or get lipo.

This is wrong. I have always lifted, ran, competed in multiple sports, etc. I developed phenomenal strength, pound-for-pound, and have won fitness competitions, yet I still had the layer of fat until about 14 months ago. Now I don't...

This is what I did/am doing:

Diet-wise, I bought into the intermittent fasting craze. Eat ~10:30 in the morning with the last meal coming around ~6:30. Little meat, mostly fish.

Got a blender - started putting almond milk, protein powder, blueberries, strawberries, cashews, and eggs in it (actually tastes EXCELLENT). Drink this 2 or 3 times a day.

Supplement with some V8. Gallon of water a day. BCAAs, Fish Oil, Mult-Vitamin, and anti-oxidants.

The key is to give yourself cheat days or you'll go nuts. Saturday is generally my day where I can eat a bit shittier and I drink a good bit Saturday night. Sunday is a small cheat, but not too much. Enabling yourself to cheat on weekends also gives you more to look forward to.

In terms of training:

Each workout I go into has a total of 6 available sections, although I normally only do 4 or 5 of them. They include: the Crossfit WOD, Olympic lifts, individual body part lifts, abs, skill lifts (handstand pushups, jump rope, box jumps, etc.) and sprints. Depending on my rotation a typical workout could look like:
Crossfit WOD, Olympic lifts, indy body part, abs, sprints
or maybe
Olympic lifts, indy body part, abs, skill work
or
Crossfit WOD, indy body part, abs, skill work, sprints

The important concepts to remember are:

Change things up in order to keep your body from adapting i.e. your workouts should ALWAYS be difficult (unless you are in a week/2 week chill-out phase)
Incorporate high intensity workouts i.e. the Crossfit and sprints. THIS is where you start to burn the weight
Make sure to do the indy body part exercises to keep general tone

This routine has dropped my bodyfat from 11.1 to 7.3 (measured by 2 different trainers independently) in a little over a year. I never thought I would get rid of the flab, but it is quickly disappearing. I don't have completely visible abs yet, but the cuts are definitely there.

P.S. The ab-wheel is one of the greatest inventions ever. Use it.

Post: #37

(09-05-2012 06:53 PM)JohnKreese Wrote:  

(06-03-2012 01:11 PM)billy Wrote:  

(06-01-2012 04:54 AM)Nudge Wrote:  I've got a layer of flab over my gut that I have had all my life and just cant seem to get rid of. Even when I used to be super super skinny with chicken arms I still had it. Lately been doing a brutal High intensity boxing classes (1 hour) once a week plus another high intensity tabata workout once or twice a week. I bike ride to work most days, then I try to go for a jog once a week and I also play tag rugby. My diet, although not perfect, isnt too bad either - dont eat too many carbs and usually have chicken breast or fish and salad for dinner. The only thing is I party quite a lot and love my beer.

Anyone got any ideas? Am I just gonna have to accept that if I want to get rid of it I have to 100% commited and cut out the beer? Not sure thats possible living in London

Accept it, I decided to spend 2 years on an extreme diet eating 1 meal a day and at 70 kilos I still had a belly, I am now 96 kilos and still have it only now I have some muscle. Extreme diet with cardio will just make your body hold onto fat reserves and catabolise muscle . I acutally lost more fat after stopping cardio and just sticking to lifting. The 7-8 percent body fat is not healthy unless you are one of those people who can eat shit and stay skinny. Although many try to deny it your genetics decide how many fat cells you have and ignoring extremes of people who over eat and eat shit, you will have the same number of fat cells your whole life, only the size of them will change. Accept it or get lipo.

This is wrong. I have always lifted, ran, competed in multiple sports, etc. I developed phenomenal strength, pound-for-pound, and have won fitness competitions, yet I still had the layer of fat until about 14 months ago. Now I don't...

This is what I did/am doing:

Diet-wise, I bought into the intermittent fasting craze. Eat ~10:30 in the morning with the last meal coming around ~6:30. Little meat, mostly fish.

Got a blender - started putting almond milk, protein powder, blueberries, strawberries, cashews, and eggs in it (actually tastes EXCELLENT). Drink this 2 or 3 times a day.

Supplement with some V8. Gallon of water a day. BCAAs, Fish Oil, Mult-Vitamin, and anti-oxidants.

The key is to give yourself cheat days or you'll go nuts. Saturday is generally my day where I can eat a bit shittier and I drink a good bit Saturday night. Sunday is a small cheat, but not too much. Enabling yourself to cheat on weekends also gives you more to look forward to.

In terms of training:

Each workout I go into has a total of 6 available sections, although I normally only do 4 or 5 of them. They include: the Crossfit WOD, Olympic lifts, individual body part lifts, abs, skill lifts (handstand pushups, jump rope, box jumps, etc.) and sprints. Depending on my rotation a typical workout could look like:
Crossfit WOD, Olympic lifts, indy body part, abs, sprints
or maybe
Olympic lifts, indy body part, abs, skill work
or
Crossfit WOD, indy body part, abs, skill work, sprints

The important concepts to remember are:

Change things up in order to keep your body from adapting i.e. your workouts should ALWAYS be difficult (unless you are in a week/2 week chill-out phase)
Incorporate high intensity workouts i.e. the Crossfit and sprints. THIS is where you start to burn the weight
Make sure to do the indy body part exercises to keep general tone

This routine has dropped my bodyfat from 11.1 to 7.3 (measured by 2 different trainers independently) in a little over a year. I never thought I would get rid of the flab, but it is quickly disappearing. I don't have completely visible abs yet, but the cuts are definitely there.

P.S. The ab-wheel is one of the greatest inventions ever. Use it.

This guy knows whats going on.

Apart from the bodyfat measurements, trainers dont know squat (lol). At 10% you have visible abs at 7.3 you are shredded to pieces. I would venture you are higher up the scale.

Post: #38

Here's the minimum/lazy man's/most realistic path:

1. You don't actually need to lift that often just to be toned/have a decent swimmers body. Use free weights and just do a few exercises that work most of your larger muscles. Squats, bench press, curls, something that works your lats and then make sure to work your abs USING WEIGHTS.

2. Do interval workouts on a treadmill. Shift the speed every 2-3 minutes go faster and slower constantly. Most guys are pretty out of shape. Switch between 4.5-5.5 mph and 6-7.5 mph. You can even walk in between.

3. Start walking everywhere. I lost more weight when traveling than almost anything else. When you walk 4+ hours a day, you'll lose weight, even that belly flab.

4. Eat right. Eat lean meats and lots of vegetables and stay away from fried foods. And yes reduce non-whole grain carbs.

5. Drink those 64 calorie beers instead of regular.

That's it. If you can do all this, then move to the next step of trying to get big, do crossfit, etc, but for the average guy who works 40-50 hours and tries to have a social life, even just doing this beats most other guys. Good luck.

Post: #39

Not sure I give a fuck about having a six pack.

Post: #40

(09-05-2012 10:20 PM)Chief Wrote:  

(09-05-2012 06:53 PM)JohnKreese Wrote:  

(06-03-2012 01:11 PM)billy Wrote:  

(06-01-2012 04:54 AM)Nudge Wrote:  I've got a layer of flab over my gut that I have had all my life and just cant seem to get rid of. Even when I used to be super super skinny with chicken arms I still had it. Lately been doing a brutal High intensity boxing classes (1 hour) once a week plus another high intensity tabata workout once or twice a week. I bike ride to work most days, then I try to go for a jog once a week and I also play tag rugby. My diet, although not perfect, isnt too bad either - dont eat too many carbs and usually have chicken breast or fish and salad for dinner. The only thing is I party quite a lot and love my beer.

Anyone got any ideas? Am I just gonna have to accept that if I want to get rid of it I have to 100% commited and cut out the beer? Not sure thats possible living in London

Accept it, I decided to spend 2 years on an extreme diet eating 1 meal a day and at 70 kilos I still had a belly, I am now 96 kilos and still have it only now I have some muscle. Extreme diet with cardio will just make your body hold onto fat reserves and catabolise muscle . I acutally lost more fat after stopping cardio and just sticking to lifting. The 7-8 percent body fat is not healthy unless you are one of those people who can eat shit and stay skinny. Although many try to deny it your genetics decide how many fat cells you have and ignoring extremes of people who over eat and eat shit, you will have the same number of fat cells your whole life, only the size of them will change. Accept it or get lipo.

This is wrong. I have always lifted, ran, competed in multiple sports, etc. I developed phenomenal strength, pound-for-pound, and have won fitness competitions, yet I still had the layer of fat until about 14 months ago. Now I don't...

This is what I did/am doing:

Diet-wise, I bought into the intermittent fasting craze. Eat ~10:30 in the morning with the last meal coming around ~6:30. Little meat, mostly fish.

Got a blender - started putting almond milk, protein powder, blueberries, strawberries, cashews, and eggs in it (actually tastes EXCELLENT). Drink this 2 or 3 times a day.

Supplement with some V8. Gallon of water a day. BCAAs, Fish Oil, Mult-Vitamin, and anti-oxidants.

The key is to give yourself cheat days or you'll go nuts. Saturday is generally my day where I can eat a bit shittier and I drink a good bit Saturday night. Sunday is a small cheat, but not too much. Enabling yourself to cheat on weekends also gives you more to look forward to.

In terms of training:

Each workout I go into has a total of 6 available sections, although I normally only do 4 or 5 of them. They include: the Crossfit WOD, Olympic lifts, individual body part lifts, abs, skill lifts (handstand pushups, jump rope, box jumps, etc.) and sprints. Depending on my rotation a typical workout could look like:
Crossfit WOD, Olympic lifts, indy body part, abs, sprints
or maybe
Olympic lifts, indy body part, abs, skill work
or
Crossfit WOD, indy body part, abs, skill work, sprints

The important concepts to remember are:

Change things up in order to keep your body from adapting i.e. your workouts should ALWAYS be difficult (unless you are in a week/2 week chill-out phase)
Incorporate high intensity workouts i.e. the Crossfit and sprints. THIS is where you start to burn the weight
Make sure to do the indy body part exercises to keep general tone

This routine has dropped my bodyfat from 11.1 to 7.3 (measured by 2 different trainers independently) in a little over a year. I never thought I would get rid of the flab, but it is quickly disappearing. I don't have completely visible abs yet, but the cuts are definitely there.

P.S. The ab-wheel is one of the greatest inventions ever. Use it.

This guy knows whats going on.

Apart from the bodyfat measurements, trainers dont know squat (lol). At 10% you have visible abs at 7.3 you are shredded to pieces. I would venture you are higher up the scale.

You're probably right to an extent, but everyone wears their fat differently. When I have measurements done, trainers are always surprised at what areas are high and which are low.

The point is, I am DEFINITELY more toned, cut, with abs beginning to show by doing this program. 90 minutes 5-6 days a week sucks, but going to the pool and getting looks/numbers/etc.

Post: #41

Ever read this site? Looks of interesting info on it.

http://skinnyfattransformation.com

Post: #42

I was skinny fat once. I took care of it by eating a bulking diet and eating everything in sight.

Forget these fad diets, lift heavy, eat lots of protein and fats, and get some sleep. You'll get pulled out of that rut.

Post: #43

(06-02-2012 04:59 PM)Rurik Wrote:  What you eat is hugely important to your body composition.

Keep Eggs, boneless skinless chicken breasts, canned red salmon, and sirloin steaks, for example, stocked in your fridge, along with broccoli and spinach. Cook the eggs however you want, and learn to cook chicken breasts and steaks in a pan, it's fucking simple if you don't already do it.

Get your bloody head outta my fridge

You and particularly MikeCF nailed it for me. Eat clean, as much as you can, and lift as much as you can. I'm starting to bulk up, particularly in my arms. Good feeling.

I'll never go back to sugar and wheat. Never.

Post: #44

In order of priority...
1. Lift (as roosh says this is vital)

Not to be funny, but the point is lifting will change your life, and other steps/priorities are a long way after that. Also, depending on your personality...

Start by just going to the gym once. Lift. No expectations, just lift. If you get 1 set of each exercise in, that's better than sitting at home. Then in a day or two, go again. If you get 1 set in of each, that's better than sitting home.

That's what has always worked for me. No goals or expectations, no set "I have to do this many sets or reps", just get to the gym and do something.

Post: #45

It'll be easier for a younger guy - your T levels are higher than mine.

I started lifting very late - early 40's after being skinny fat for most of my life. Took me about 3 years of SS 5x5 to get to intermediate level stuff, suddenly in the last year the hypertrophy just took off as did strength gains. I've been lifting for about 5 years now, finally things have progressed to the point where I'm actually happy with my physique - and get comments. ~32% bf @ 195+ to ~9% bf @ 185lbs.

Should mention I went on a modified primal/paleo diet as well. I do about 100g carbs a day - white rice, sweet potatoes and sometimes GF pizzas etc.

I do a 6-1 split now, free weights only about 90 minutes a day.

Post: #46

Never been skinnyfat, but to me it actually looks worse than slightly chubby all over. The skinny arms and legs but fat belly just looks weird.

Post: #47

There is a lot of bad information aka broscience in this thread. The truth is that there is no special diet or activity hack for skinny-fatness. All the fundamentals of nutrition and lifting are the same, whether you are skinny-fat or not. Muscle gain (high-protein hypercaloric diet + progressive overload) is the same. Fat loss (high-protein hypocaloric diet + strength maintenance) is the same.

The difference is that skinny-fat people are simply inferior/disadvantaged in terms of physiology and musculoskeletal structure, i.e. bodybuilding potential, and therefore in their fitness journey have a worse starting point and slower, harder progress in store for them compared to others.