Post: #151

I'm still greatly against the wild suggestion of outright erasing the "everything else" subforum. Much good information and brainstorming comes of it.

What we could use to improve it are: a personal dedication by each member to cut back on volume in the EE forum(I'm trying myself); all opinions should focus on researching back story and evidence before simply opining, especially on provocative subjects; reinforcement of the posting rules by peer intervention(tuthmosis can't do it all and it's not beta to use to the report button or scold a member for poor quality content if it saves forum quality); if a topic makes a particular person emotional, then they shouldn't be posting on it. that's why we have so many racethread, alpha/beta and height meltdowns.

Post: #152

This is a very old photo of him.

Post: #153

He had lots of friends. His closest friends had many a discussion with him regarding his dating theory and how he felt. He had lots if support over the years.
He had done his research and his mind was set.
He was a very rational and intelligent man who was incredibly stubbon. As hard as we tried, we couldnt change his mind.
please dont assume people dont care or notice. Because people do. He was open about his feelings and intentions. Accepting how he felt was a difficult thing for his friends to do.
If someone has set there mind to something, it is incredibly difficult to change their way of thinking. Especially if they are not willing to make the necessary changes themselves.

Post: #154

I have only skimmed through some of the comments here and I can't say I'm familiar with the blogger, so I'll add my two cents without getting into all the other minutiae.

While I will never celebrate someone's suicide, I cannot bring myself to respect the decision when the person has clearly given up on self improvement. Someone sacrificing themselves for their loved ones or family (i.e. war, hostage situation, etc.) I can wrap my head around... but this type of hopeless suicide seems, dare I say a bit selfish. It's not as though he was paralyzed, crippled, or had some major physical disfigurement.

Life is difficult and full of challenges and rewards. You get one shot. Choosing to end it prematurely is ultimately your call, but for a man to do so because of an inability to overcome adversity to me is the biggest show of weakness there is.

Post: #155

(05-19-2015 04:23 AM)TreeMyrtle Wrote:  He had lots of friends. His closest friends had many a discussion with him regarding his dating theory and how he felt. He had lots if support over the years.
He had done his research and his mind was set.
He was a very rational and intelligent man who was incredibly stubbon. As hard as we tried, we couldnt change his mind.
please dont assume people dont care or notice. Because people do. He was open about his feelings and intentions. Accepting how he felt was a difficult thing for his friends to do.
If someone has set there mind to something, it is incredibly difficult to change their way of thinking. Especially if they are not willing to make the necessary changes themselves.

I don't think that guys around here accused his friends.
His suicide entry was the most rational one I ever read.

It was sad that he learned about the Red Pill, but then decided to focus on the one taught by the PUAHATE crowd which had spawned Eliott Rodgers. In essence they see only the negative side of the Red Pill, but discard the positive potential.
If he had given that a chance then Neomasculinity around here would have given him hope and a plan on how to improve himself and even use his semi-famous state to get himself a cute girlfriend.

Instead his mind was set and he believed that only height, fantastic looks or massive wealth could save him. That is exactly what all the Game-denying Red Pill men preach. It is self-defeating and utterly wrong.

But as you correctly put it - he appeared very stubborn and his mind was set. That was his downfall. Still - likely there were no real positive Red Pill guys as his friends.

He may have had many friends, but what kind of friends? Blue Pill crowd that told him to "just be yourself"? Women who said that he is such a nice guy and that he would make another woman happy - just not her? Puahate-suckers who told him that Game is a myth and you cannot become significantly more attractive by working out, by optimizing your look towards r-selection and by become more masculine?

Yeah - so - "he had lots of friends" is very relative.

Post: #156

(02-11-2015 02:27 AM)Pride male Wrote:  Suicide is omega, unless it is wartime and one is trying to avoid capture.

Perhaps, but from society's standpoint, it's a less costly kind of omega behavior than, say, collecting a monthly tugboat for several decades to sit in a basement masturbating, smoking pot, and playing video games.

Yet society finds suicide much more disturbing. I think the reason is that when you live an omega life, people might think, "Maybe he just prefers to live that way," but if you kill yourself, then it's obvious you weren't happy. Society would rather men die with a whimper than with a bang. A high suicide rate is a sign that there's an immediate crisis, and it prompts an investigation into the causes.

Destructive violence is what grabs people's attention. A suicide or a mass shooting hits the news (or at least gets talked about), and can become the catalyst of an activist movement and legislation; but a woman's eggs quietly dying goes unnoticed, even though the effect on the population figures may be the same. Society itself has gone omega (in the sense that it is unwilling to do what's necessary to keep its fertility rate above the replacement rate), but as long as people don't do anything that would make it obvious how discontented or unfulfilled they feel, it's easier for the politicians and the media to deny that any problem exists, or that any cultural or political change is needed.

The general public probably doesn't think much about how widespread the taking of antidepressants is, or how women's rates of happiness have declined in recent decades, because that's not stuff people discuss on social media. They're too busy trying to depict their lives as more awesome than anyone else's. In the manosphere, we can't admit some real problems that we face, because that wouldn't sound very baller. So we cover it up and pretend that the individual is able to triumph on his own, and that IRL social isolation isn't a major limitation on what we as a community can accomplish.

One thing that can be said in suicide's defense is that it is, at least, a decisive action that the individual can take. A lot of people will go to a therapist for years and talk and cry about their problems. Suicide actually does something to end the pain and save any resources that are being wasted. When the colon cancer gets to a point where you're vomiting feces uncontrollably while doctors look on helplessly, I don't really blame a person for wanting to cut their losses. Sometimes it's a relief for the family too when the suffering is finally over.

But what about those aren't terminally ill? Don't they matter? Maybe, maybe not. Society is like a ship such as the Titanic. While there's still the possibility that the ship could complete its voyage safely, then the loss of any one of its crew matters, especially if he would be in a position to prevent it from hitting an iceberg. But if the ship is going to hit an iceberg regardless of anything he does, and go down with loss of all aboard, then his falling overboard a few days earlier really doesn't make that much of a difference.

That was the overall message of the film Titanic: Even if you have good enough game to bang the hot rich girl, and think that you're king of the world, if society is dysfunctional, you still end up drowning at the end and going down to the same icy grave as everyone else.

Post: #157

Resurrecting a thread on suicide. Novel.

Onto the subject.
I do find it odd that so many folk promote natural selection / Darwinism / evolution to the nth degree.
Then they get rather uncomfortable when someone implements natural selection the "wrong" way...

Post: #158

Wherever Raymond/jvj posts I get nothing but the sense of promotion of accepting failure as inevitable and now suicide is a good option.

Post: #159

(06-19-2017 09:23 PM)cascadecombo Wrote:  Wherever Raymond/jvj posts I get nothing but the sense of promotion of accepting failure as inevitable and now suicide is a good option.

Libertarian though process of relative morality. Suicide is not to be encouraged regardless of the supposed "benefits" for society.

Anyone arguing it is using globalist mindset.

There is a good reason why most societies in the world condemns suicide despite the apparent harmlessness at least to some.

I think that it is a divine law to not end your life. You are given this chance of a life and are not to waste it. Suicide is tantamount to murder in my opinion. It does not matter whether you kill yourself or someone else.

Post: #160

(06-19-2017 03:10 PM)Jean Valjean Wrote:  That was the overall message of the film Titanic: Even if you have good enough game to bang the hot rich girl, and think that you're king of the world, if society is dysfunctional, you still end up drowning at the end and going down to the same icy grave as everyone else.

Jean, have you ever thought about taking a vacation from the forum?
Maybe going to Mexico, looking at some ruins and having some of those impossibly colored fruity drinks?
Stamp collecting, perhaps? I heard stamp collecting can be a lot of fun.

Post: #161

(06-20-2017 02:14 AM)SamuelBRoberts Wrote:  Stamp collecting, perhaps? I heard stamp collecting can be a lot of fun.

Sam, no! Don't encourage him! It may not end well --

Post: #162

(06-19-2017 03:10 PM)Jean Valjean Wrote:  That was the overall message of the film Titanic: Even if you have good enough game to bang the hot rich girl, and think that you're king of the world, if society is dysfunctional, you still end up drowning at the end and going down to the same icy grave as everyone else.

Your post is very interesting and I mostly agree with it, but this last paragraph... jeez.

Post: #163

On a related note, the story of Mr. McDermid I think could be turned into an essay for RoK on the dangers of falling into the foodie lifestyle trap but how putting a couple of restaurants in your neighborhood on lock-down can help your game.

Post: #164

(02-10-2015 05:45 PM)Tuthmosis Wrote:  While I'm the first to say that game and the manosphere are unfairly demonized--and that poor guys like this blogger are the collateral damage of that characterization--we're also partly to blame. Guys like us are the inheritors of the practical, non-commercial, regular-guy self-improvement (game) mantle--the best, and maybe only, alternative to salesy Youtubers with actresses in their "real daygame" videos and expensive coaching packages for sale. Yet we've lost sight of the important things.

Instead of spending so much time and energy talking about the apocalyptic "fall of civilization," the life-and-death struggle with "Social Justice Warriors," how "Muslim infiltration" is destroying "Western Civilization," and that restaurants being allowed to deny black people service is the height of the "free market working as it should," we should be focusing on reaching guys like this. Rather, I find us (rather foolhardily) trying to make some kind of wholesale ideological change from the comfort of our laptops. It may feel good to read and say something so unpopular and so verboten, but that short-term contrarian pleasure is siphoning energy--and, more importantly, sympathetic hearts and minds--from our little corner of the world. The wrong voices are getting louder, while the more articulate and pragmatic ones are getting fainter. Don't get me wrong: there's nothing wrong with a bit of social commentary, and taking unpopular opinions; I've always supported that. But we're not doing ourselves any favors by embracing an increasingly fringe status and heavy, even angry and uninformed, tone. Some time ago, I did an AMA on the "redpill" sub-reddit. In it, I was asked what I considered to be "the manophere's biggest weaknesses going forward." I warned that giving the wrong views, or people, too much of a platform would stunt the manosphere's growth, even discredit it altogether. We might never have reached this particular poor bastard, but guys like him are our growth, and I see some of what I said coming to pass.

The way to "win" is to bring in and help the men that this Brave New World is leaving behind--not just trying to say increasingly crazier shit so that we can remain opposite of what the "Cultural Marxists," the so-called "Left", or the "SJWs" are saying. Important words are losing their meaning, and we're churning out incoherent labels faster than some of the people we hold in such low esteem.

I, for one, think we're losing focus. This is a good reminder of that.

Tuth called it like it was almost 2 and a half years ago.

It's no wonder he stopped posting here.

Post: #165

< And what is the focus?

Try to become mainstream?

I have a message for you - this will never happen. They will only accept us if we literally chop off everything and then step forward without balls.

Yes - acceptance to a degree could come if you focus only on Game, but I seriously doubt even that, because you would have gender differences and they will never accept it.

Who says what voices are the best here?

Muslim immigration is no problem eh? You should go ask Western European women what they can tell you about it and how the fucking countries have fucking changed within a few short years.

There are no easy solutions out there. Everyone has to get a thicker skin. We are still united on most things in life.

Also what kind of responsibility could we have had? I have friends who are successful, good-looking, can bang women 15 years younger than them and they still refused the Red Pill almost instantly saying "Women are not like that."

And that guy had much less going for him. He certainly came upon other viewpoints on our side, but he refused them. He may have even refused the Red Pill if he met an Asian Player, even a 5'2 Day Gamer (they exist).

The idea that if no hard topics are breached, that we repeat the mantras of "Diversity is our Strength" and "Islam is a Religion of Peace" while also never ever breaching any "racist" topic to reach the biggest number of people - yes that might indeed work to a degree. But on the other hand you end up blind as well and driven over a Truck of Peace and the worst is yet to come. The Buzzfeed of the Manosphere gets there, but you need to constantly police the content in Orwellian fashion and that is what happened.

Truth can defend itself. And as for outreach programs and more inclusive topic selection - this will never work by culminating into getting to the mainstream. The MRAs after almost 80 years of campaigning got nowhere. Some PUAs when focusing only on Game might get there, Manosphere terms will via osmosis filter to the public like Alpha, Beta and now Cuck. It happens because we have the truth behind us. No amount of pretty lies will help us if we are not speaking the truth about everything.

Post: #166

There's absolutely something to Tuthmosis' post and it puts far more eloquently what (perhaps) Excelsior was trying to say last week.

But times change and so does the world.

Still, there's wisdom there. Being the screaming lunatic on the street corner might win you a small gathering but it severely caps your ability to reach a larger audience and thusly help more people.

I for one am going to continue pushing for resurgent masculinity and the reclamation of western values but from now on I'm going to make a concerted effort to do it in a more positive tone.

I'm sick of the drama and I don't want to see anyone else bail on the forum. Certainly not on my account.

Post: #167

(06-20-2017 11:29 AM)Leonard D Neubache Wrote:  I'm sick of the drama and I don't want to see anyone else bail on the forum. Certainly not on my account.

Problem is there are some people on here who need to be banned on this forum as well but aren't.

Post: #168

(06-20-2017 01:05 AM)Zelcorpion Wrote:  

(06-19-2017 09:23 PM)cascadecombo Wrote:  Wherever Raymond/jvj posts I get nothing but the sense of promotion of accepting failure as inevitable and now suicide is a good option.

Libertarian though process of relative morality. Suicide is not to be encouraged regardless of the supposed "benefits" for society.

Anyone arguing it is using globalist mindset.

There is a good reason why most societies in the world condemns suicide despite the apparent harmlessness at least to some.

I think that it is a divine law to not end your life. You are given this chance of a life and are not to waste it. Suicide is tantamount to murder in my opinion. It does not matter whether you kill yourself or someone else.

Yes, some wise people might say that everyone is on earth for a reason, to accomplish, something, to fix something, etc.

When one suffers a lot in life, it is comparable to being at the dentist while your teeth are being fixed. You can decide to walk out (aka suicide) but you will suffer a million times more afterwards, lost in between worlds for a long long time...

Post: #169

If we (myself included) have been doing something too much, then it's not the politicising (although damaging) It is by constantly pointing out the flaws of the dating market.

Members constantly write about how bad they feel when they return home, and I empathise. But this is feeling a perception that is not aligned with our goals: having hot girls in our beds and by her side. By writing this stuff, they bring each other down.

I remember a conversation with a member that I met in the Phils, who was back in Western Europe where he could not get a date. I gave him 3 suggestions on how to improve, and he all shot them down. In a later exchange, he kept complaining about how bad European girls suck compared to Asian girls.

Giving up hope or losing the strength to keep fighting are bad things. I don't think this should be encouraged. Everyone has dry spells. The question is: how will you spend your newfound time? Finding a solution to your problem, or fruitless and painful analysation of environmental factors that caused it?

I don't care if you want a sweet, submissive girl untainted by a bad social climate, or that you want so many notches your bed falls apart.

Too much posts on here can be summarised as "why, God, why".

We know the realities. Now it's time to rise above them. It's a shame this blogger didn't have the strength to try anymore. Game was initially created to help men overcome limitations like race, being short or having little status. It's much needed in todays world.

Hopefully, new members of this forum will see all the wisdom and opportunities it provides.

Post: #170

(02-10-2015 05:45 PM)Tuthmosis Wrote:  In before the litany of attention-whoring bitches steps up to say they "would have dated him in a second!"

(02-10-2015 04:55 PM)Veloce Wrote:  If he would have spent half as much energy on game as he did food blogging, he could have at least had a mini-harem of 6s. Enough to satisfy his yearnings for female contact.

But of course, game is pua and pua is creepy and creepy makes girls uncomfortable and girls being uncomfortable is illegal. I believe the stigma against game is strong enough to keep men away from the tools that would drastically improve their lives and happiness.

While I'm the first to say that game and the manosphere are unfairly demonized--and that poor guys like this blogger are the collateral damage of that characterization--we're also partly to blame. Guys like us are the inheritors of the practical, non-commercial, regular-guy self-improvement (game) mantle--the best, and maybe only, alternative to salesy Youtubers with actresses in their "real daygame" videos and expensive coaching packages for sale. Yet we've lost sight of the important things.

Instead of spending so much time and energy talking about the apocalyptic "fall of civilization," the life-and-death struggle with "Social Justice Warriors," how "Muslim infiltration" is destroying "Western Civilization," and that restaurants being allowed to deny black people service is the height of the "free market working as it should," we should be focusing on reaching guys like this. Rather, I find us (rather foolhardily) trying to make some kind of wholesale ideological change from the comfort of our laptops. It may feel good to read and say something so unpopular and so verboten, but that short-term contrarian pleasure is siphoning energy--and, more importantly, sympathetic hearts and minds--from our little corner of the world. The wrong voices are getting louder, while the more articulate and pragmatic ones are getting fainter. Don't get me wrong: there's nothing wrong with a bit of social commentary, and taking unpopular opinions; I've always supported that. But we're not doing ourselves any favors by embracing an increasingly fringe status and heavy, even angry and uninformed, tone. Some time ago, I did an AMA on the "redpill" sub-reddit. In it, I was asked what I considered to be "the manophere's biggest weaknesses going forward." I warned that giving the wrong views, or people, too much of a platform would stunt the manosphere's growth, even discredit it altogether. We might never have reached this particular poor bastard, but guys like him are our growth, and I see some of what I said coming to pass.

The way to "win" is to bring in and help the men that this Brave New World is leaving behind--not just trying to say increasingly crazier shit so that we can remain opposite of what the "Cultural Marxists," the so-called "Left", or the "SJWs" are saying. Important words are losing their meaning, and we're churning out incoherent labels faster than some of the people we hold in such low esteem.

I, for one, think we're losing focus. This is a good reminder of that.

^ Bumping this

Post: #171

Yeah - that statement has not aged well with countless terrorist attacks in Europe since then and millions of barbarians in the West - reaching a few half-Asian boys is all fine and well, but when your civilization is going down, then it won't help you much to teach Game - it will be like dancing on the Titanic.

2013 is not 2017 - Trump would not have won in 2008. Things have gotten much different since a few years ago - some of the things that some of us have been predicting since 2014/15 have come to pass. 300.000 crimes per year perpetrated by wonderfully peaceful Muslim immigrants in Germany alone have shifted the entire country and changed behavioral patterns even of women.

Post: #172

I agree that things have changed but I also agree the following is true

Quote:Tuthmosis: The way to "win" is to bring in and help the men that this Brave New World is leaving behind--not just trying to say increasingly crazier shit so that we can remain opposite of what the "Cultural Marxists," the so-called "Left", or the "SJWs" are saying. Important words are losing their meaning, and we're churning out incoherent labels faster than some of the people we hold in such low esteem.

If anything it's truer now than it was even then. We have serious problems and we need serious men to address them

Post: #173

(02-13-2018 11:35 PM)PapayaTapper Wrote:  I agree that things have changed but I also agree the following is true

Quote:Tuthmosis: The way to "win" is to bring in and help the men that this Brave New World is leaving behind--not just trying to say increasingly crazier shit so that we can remain opposite of what the "Cultural Marxists," the so-called "Left", or the "SJWs" are saying. Important words are losing their meaning, and we're churning out incoherent labels faster than some of the people we hold in such low esteem.

If anything it's truer now than it was even then. We have serious problems and we need serious men to address them

This forum isn't going to save the world. It never could, because we don't hold positions of power or authority. If you think about it, we can't save anybody... we can only assist men in saving themselves.

At it's best it gives us a place to vent with generally like minded people about the direction things are going.

The men on this forum will never be able to compete with the blue pill brainwashing machine. We simply do not have the financial resources.

Post: #174

(02-14-2018 01:45 AM)EndsExpect Wrote:  

(02-13-2018 11:35 PM)PapayaTapper Wrote:  I agree that things have changed but I also agree the following is true

Quote:Tuthmosis: The way to "win" is to bring in and help the men that this Brave New World is leaving behind--not just trying to say increasingly crazier shit so that we can remain opposite of what the "Cultural Marxists," the so-called "Left", or the "SJWs" are saying. Important words are losing their meaning, and we're churning out incoherent labels faster than some of the people we hold in such low esteem.

If anything it's truer now than it was even then. We have serious problems and we need serious men to address them

This forum isn't going to save the world. It never could, because we don't hold positions of power or authority. If you think about it, we can't save anybody... we can only assist men in saving themselves.

At it's best it gives us a place to vent with generally like minded people about the direction things are going.

The men on this forum will never be able to compete with the blue pill brainwashing machine. We simply do not have the financial resources.

Crux of it right here. It's REALLY difficult to try to help someone that doesn't want to help themselves. Unfortunately, I think by nature most guys are built to be fodder. So why I think guys' hearts here might be in the right place, on the grand scheme it's merely an exercise in futility.

The best you can do is save yourself, and be an example that hopefully galvanizes other men to take the reins in their lives.

Post: #175

(02-14-2018 02:03 AM)nek Wrote:  Crux of it right here. It's REALLY difficult to try to help someone that doesn't want to help themselves. Unfortunately, I think by nature most guys are built to be fodder. So why I think guys' hearts here might be in the right place, on the grand scheme it's merely an exercise in futility.
The best you can do is save yourself, and be an example that hopefully galvanizes other men to take the reins in their lives.

We are pack animals. We are designed to follow the Alphas of our tribe to riches and glory.

2000 years ago America would have a Genghis Khan leader come along and we would conquer the world... slay the men of the other nations, have their women as slaves and live off their riches.

What are the Alphas of our tribe doing today?